Sounds pretty weak to me, I guess there must be a market for gamers that don't want to game.
Pay2Win made it to Elite
- Thread starter Einar Donarsson
- Start date
For the Python variant the arx is getting you 3 months of use before the plebs, and an example of something similar happening with the use of access in the description would be the Cobra IV of course. The prebuilds I'm with you, will be interesting to see what exactly that means, but my guess is you still buy the ship with credits and the arx gets you the cosmetics in the kit as well as an engineering bypass (lvl 3 or so maybe), and I guess even not spending the time to fly around and A rate it, which for a new player could be a play session or two.
My 2 cents:
1. This game is not being released newly, but has a 10 year history of users having gone down the grind road. There seems to be a very limited influx of new users. These new pay to win/avoid grind options seem to be primarily aimed at them. Trying to get them to join the fun even if they have been put off by all the reports of ED being one big grind. As long as it doesn't mean that you only get access to superior engineering if you pay extra, but just get the easy ride to catch up, I'm okay with it. I did my grinding many years ago, didn't bother to repeat if for Odyssey infantry game play loop anyhow. So nobody is going to beat me to any new gear this way.
2. FD are operating in shallow waters. Desperate times call for desperate measures. If given the choice to see FD either go down this route or fold the game in a couple of years due to permanent, predictable losses made on ED, I am very much in favour of them opting for the former.
That's how I see it.
1. This game is not being released newly, but has a 10 year history of users having gone down the grind road. There seems to be a very limited influx of new users. These new pay to win/avoid grind options seem to be primarily aimed at them. Trying to get them to join the fun even if they have been put off by all the reports of ED being one big grind. As long as it doesn't mean that you only get access to superior engineering if you pay extra, but just get the easy ride to catch up, I'm okay with it. I did my grinding many years ago, didn't bother to repeat if for Odyssey infantry game play loop anyhow. So nobody is going to beat me to any new gear this way.
2. FD are operating in shallow waters. Desperate times call for desperate measures. If given the choice to see FD either go down this route or fold the game in a couple of years due to permanent, predictable losses made on ED, I am very much in favour of them opting for the former.
That's how I see it.
Yes, unfortunately there is such a market and it is quite large. Admittedly it’s mostly mobile and buying “crystals” or such to “advance”.
You buy it with real world currency
I see three types of players here
A. Those pushing back against microtransactions that affect the dynamic of the game
B. Those who don't like it but tell themselves "surely this big company needs financial help!" to cope
C. People who grew up with mobile games, who are now ecstatic with the fact they can buy their way ahead of other players (and probably hoping that the P.MkII is OP to boot)
A. Those pushing back against microtransactions that affect the dynamic of the game
B. Those who don't like it but tell themselves "surely this big company needs financial help!" to cope
C. People who grew up with mobile games, who are now ecstatic with the fact they can buy their way ahead of other players (and probably hoping that the P.MkII is OP to boot)
apparently simple things are too difficult for some to understand.
also imagine an mmo game is not only about you
cosmetics are microtransactions
pre built ships are not, imho
I really hope they do, and soon. The best case read IMO is pretty much consistent with how FD’s precariously balanced on the edge of over predatory pay-to-win since the Kickstarter. But it feels like a flock of birds are eyeing their truck to land on. The question remains is it a hummingbird, a pigeon, or a pelican.
Any in-game features and goods bought with irl currency is a micro transaction. One problem is the transaction is no longer micro, that's a problem with the industry in general though.
If this new scheme flops dismally, FD will get the message that it is unwelcome and have to reconsider their options.
Conversely, if it succeeds in whatever metric they measure success by, there would likely be more Early Access content being sold for Arx.
I guess it all depends on the players who are prepared to spend their money for bright, shiny things, and, allegedly, most of those don't frequent this forum, so judging the 'mood' of the players from a few dozen forum posters is going to be very difficult - a bit like using steam charts to say that nobody plays this game.
As I just happen to have over 20,000 Arx on 2 accounts, I can have the shiny without any new spending...
People play once they have the ships they want because they have an innate desire to make it the best at what they want. purchasing got to be too fast. so engineers and engineering was created to keep players running in the hamster wheel of grind loops longer. more active players ==more purchases by new players who think the game might be good. also more upgrading ship opportunities means potentially more ships being tried and more paint jobs bought.
a skip the grind loop option cuts all the needed game play out. you are back to the situation they faced before engineering. players have what they want (there's nothing else in the game to get) and so they stop playing.
they'll probably get some money, but I'll bet the active player count falls proportionally to how many ships eventually follow this purchase model.
because players don't play the engineering mechanic because the game play is fun, is difficult, requires skill, or is interesting after the first couple repeats. they do it because they have to in order to get the carrot. it doesn't seem like that's going to be changing. and that's what some people are actually crying over when they complain about pay 2 win. someone is paying to avoid the pain of boring grind repetition and they want everyone to suffer as they had for that reward. it's not about skipping the skill a player used to get it. it's about skipping the pain of repetitive tedium.
it does say something when fdev thinks it's worth more to players to pay to skip playing the game vs playing it. unfortunately for those who take the bait, once they do many will find that all they can do with their purchases are the same activities they paid to skip, only now the reward is pointless credits and materials. and then they will stop playing.
a skip the grind loop option cuts all the needed game play out. you are back to the situation they faced before engineering. players have what they want (there's nothing else in the game to get) and so they stop playing.
they'll probably get some money, but I'll bet the active player count falls proportionally to how many ships eventually follow this purchase model.
because players don't play the engineering mechanic because the game play is fun, is difficult, requires skill, or is interesting after the first couple repeats. they do it because they have to in order to get the carrot. it doesn't seem like that's going to be changing. and that's what some people are actually crying over when they complain about pay 2 win. someone is paying to avoid the pain of boring grind repetition and they want everyone to suffer as they had for that reward. it's not about skipping the skill a player used to get it. it's about skipping the pain of repetitive tedium.
it does say something when fdev thinks it's worth more to players to pay to skip playing the game vs playing it. unfortunately for those who take the bait, once they do many will find that all they can do with their purchases are the same activities they paid to skip, only now the reward is pointless credits and materials. and then they will stop playing.
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I'm firmly of the opinion that there is no 'separate, but equal'.
While I strongly suspect the Python Mk II will be a potent ship, the specifics of the ship are neither here nor there for the purposes of this argument. Unless it's a universal downgrade, better in exactly nothing under any circumstances, it's a degree of pay-to-win, if out-of-game payment allows one to get it when others cannot. And yes, I have the same perspective when it comes to stuff like the Cobra IV (which does actually have some utility).
I don't think Elite: Dangerous costs that much to maintain, or to develop at the pace they've been developing at.
I think the company as a whole is strapped for cash and they are exploring options to increase revenue. I'm highly doubtful that most of what they make will go back into Elite, and what does will go back into what they can sell.
Some people are eager to throw money at the game they enjoy, but without any obligation to use that money in a certain way the default is always going to use it however the accountants believe will grow revenue the fastest. I have serious concerns that we'll see strings of low-effort, inflationary, assets sold for Arx.
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I don't like pay to win, but I have no issue with this because it's not pay to win - it's pay to avoid grind. I did the grind, and I would probably have done it again, but was it fun? Ish. The number of gamers who are obsessively minded like me and will slog away to get the thing that they want is probably much smaller than the overall pool of gamers. We need more gamers to bring money into ED otherwise there won't be an ED.
I hadn't thought about the rebuys, though tbf I think it's only an advantage to early players, and could prevent losing noobs to the soul crushing bankruptcy of losing the new ship you just saved up all your money for, and make playing in open less terrifying.
That would be crazy.
100% agree with you. Which is why any prebuilt ships should definietly not have engineering attached. Free credits in the game, a leg up finding modules, even quick access to some activities is definitely a different kettle o' fish from the materials system.