The Tri-poll: What does multiplayer mean to YOU?

[jabokai]

I concede that at this point the only true way of separation is to have PvE'ers and PvP'ers in their own universes.

Sounds good to me!

Should they remain in their own universes forever? (using your example, without the conditions I have listed above, PvE'ers will be able to achieve more in the same time frame.. meaning that anyone who decided to have a fully immersive experience (as you put it) will then be at a disadvantage.. at that point the PvE'er could decide that PvP sounds like a fun idea)

If private groups didn't exist I'd agree with you - you start in PvP or PvE and you stay there; if you want to try the other one, you re-roll. However, private groups already give players the ability to bug out of the "hard" galaxy for as long as they like and then saunter back in. I raised this as an issue way back when - that players can use the private groups to, for example, avoid a notorious PC pirate/hit squad frequenting a system they want to get to for something. "Notorious PC pirate you say? Why then I'll switch to an alternate universe (private group), go do my thing, and then switch back". Exploit? Debatable, but definitely a way of doing what you suggest above in an already existing way.

FWIW I argued that a player should only be able to move "downstream" in the relative difficulty settings. I.e. Ironman -> Normal -> Private Group. That had it's own issues in that it didn't cater for people who legitimately wanted to play with a bunch of mates for a while then rejoin the main fray.

Anyway, that's by the by... the "exploit" already exists is the TL;DR!

 

[Zplintz]

I, specifically, will NEVER engage in unwanted PvP.

I never fire first at another player unless I'm absolutely certain that the other player wants to engage in the PvP conflict.

On top of that, if someone attempts to engage me in PvP against my will, I will simply suicide, respawn, and continue playing as if nothing has happened. If the game has strong enough PvP death penalties to disincentive this kind of behavior then I will just not play.

Just out of interest - if you die (because you suicide) anyway - why not at least try to defend yourself (after all you may win) - what do you gain by suicide?

 

[Void Sun]

Players who want a social game could do that in the main group.

The reasons I can see why someone would want to be in a PvE group rather than the main group are below. I have these concerns as well but will deal with them as stated below.
a) Players who are purely out to ruin other players experience. (FD will control this in policed systems. The Criminality update states the police will arrive via hyperspace within 60 seconds.)
b) Concerns that there is no levelling when faced with a PvP player so they will get sent back to the station every time they encounter one of these more skilled characters. (FD are again trying to address this with nursery systems, however I can see some feel this may limit their game scope.)

Personally in real life there will be some people you meet that you will need to do your best to avoid. You can't just go where you want and expect everyone to be balanced so you can beat them fairly easily, you make decisions on where it's safe to go. Therefore my personal preference is option 1 the game as FD are currently developing it and I will avoid systems and run from better PvP players when I encounter them. Running is a skill as well.

However I have voted for option 4 where I assume there will be some magic infinite shield/weapon lock to prevent PvP to support those people that can never accept that sort of impact on their game.

Allowing movement between PvP and PvE is not an option. Some PvP tykes will use it to improve themselves at little risk before switching to the main PvP group. It will become a get there ahead with lower risk mechanic.

 

[jabokai]

However I have voted for option 4 where I assume there will be some magic infinite shield/weapon lock to prevent PvP to support those people that can never accept that sort of impact on their game.

The back story for PvE can be as simple as all members of the pilot's federation carrying equipment, as part of their membership, that will not fire upon fellow members. Such "friendly fire" systems already exist, no?

That could deal with collisions in a similar way - the equipment phases the shields such that they utterly repel.

 

[Tiwaz]

We're going to have to rely on players' goodwill a little. Will the community possibly be a little more seasoned/grownup than the COD community? I certainly hope so. Random trolling should (fingers crossed) not be a huge issue. Raises, the uncertainty of all first-time interactions is surely part of the appeal? Itchy trigger fingers and mutual distrust exist in real life. Surely the vastness of the playing arena will amplify certain behaviors and impulses. There's your realism and your fun. I don't want to get blown away any more than the next man, but we'll all run the same risks.

Trust in humanity?
All I trust in gaming community humanity is that socipathic behaviour will flourish unless it is through game mechanics completely disabled.

Why? Because game after game after game has proven it. When you can be *******, lots of people will do that. I seriously doubt that some miracle would happen with ED.

Police system does not work, it just makes this sociopathic group to opt for hard hitting alpha so they blow you to bits before blown up.

They care nothing of immersion, say "Yarr, I be pirate. Thy cargo or thy life".
They simply kill, kill, kill and find as many ways to ensure they can kill as many people as possible as they can.

Welcome to reality of gaming humanity online.

 

[OillyRag]

Switch between Single-Player & Multi-player PVP

I am quite disappointed to find that Elite dangerous is to be multi-player at all. Why this obsession with multi-player? the whole industry seems to be going this way :S

For me, If you want to be social, join a chat room or go to the pub. I get all the bull i can deal with in my real life, on the roads or at work there is always some plonker trying to ruin my day, why should i have to deal with all that when i am playing a game and looking for some escapism and maybe the odd mental challenge.

I think most people ( with respect ) are missing the point about multi-player. it's not being killed by other players that annoys people its the childish abuse, swearing etc etc that goes along with it (for reference please see most other MMo's) and i think this will go on whether you have PVP or PVE so for me the whole argument is moot.

Having said all that i have voted for:
'I can move between one of two groups: a PvE group or a PVP group'

but what i really want is the ability to switch between single player (within the evloving universe) and PVP. this would give me the ability to make some progress in the game and if i do want to go back to the school playground i can do that too.

oh and one last thing i read the player groups proposal in the design forum the other day. my god that is complicated, I've never considered myself to be a stupid man but I've read and re-read it and i cant make head nor tail of it: so for god sake what ever you decide to do in the end, please keep it simple.


Cheers. (sorry for ranting a bit)


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[jabokai]

...so for me the whole argument is mute.

This argument is anything BUT mute! I think you meant moot.

but what i really want is the ability to switch between single player (within the evloving universe) and PVP.

What you want exists with the private/solo group proposal.

 

[OillyRag]

This argument is anything BUT mute! I think you meant moot.

LOl yep

post suitably edited


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[Zplintz]

Having said all that i have voted for:
'I can move between one of two groups: a PvE group or a PVP group'

but what i really want is the ability to switch between single player (within the evloving universe) and PVP. this would give me the ability to make some progress in the game and if i do want to go back to the school playground i can do that too.

So you would build up your ship and equipment in single player (not PvE?) and then switch to PvP (presumably when you see an easy kill/soft target) and then switch back to single player where you are safe?

You have SP online and offline options as the proposals stand now - you don't have to MP at all - although to be honest, you would probably need to be MP to PvP wouldn't you?

Would you need to be Solo Online (with the evolving universe) if there were a PvE option? Wouldn't that option mean you could play MP Online?

 

[Alien]

i think this will go on whether you have PVP or PVE so for me the whole argument is mute.

This argument is anything BUT mute! I think you meant moot.

For me the whole arguement is moo ... or maybe baaa.

 

[OillyRag]

So you would build up your ship and equipment in single player (not PvE?) and then switch to PvP (presumably when you see an easy kill/soft target) and then switch back to single player where you are safe?

No that's not what i would do.
please don't judge me by your own standards.

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[jabokai]

So you would build up your ship and equipment in single player (not PvE?) and then switch to PvP (presumably when you see an easy kill/soft target) and then switch back to single player where you are safe?

That wouldn't be possible, you won't see any other PCs at all if you're in a solo group.

 

[Zplintz]

No that's not what i would do.
please don't judge me by your own standards..

I will play in PvP mode, All Players Group with as few people on my ignore list as possible (and quite possibly spend quite a lot of time running away or failing that buying new ships ).

I was just trying to understand your reasoning behind playing solo and then dropping into PvP (keep in mind you wouldn't be able to attack someone first or you would end up back in the All Players group with a bounty).

That wouldn't be possible, you won't see any other PCs at all if you're in a solo group.

FYI the current group proposal will actually allow you to play Solo using your Private Group with everyone else excluded (and therefore avoid any PvP). If you remove the exclusions from your Private Group you would then be in the All Player Group with PvP. What Paul2303 is asking for is already available you regardless of whether MP PvE is made available in some way or not.

 

[jabokai]

FYI the current group proposal will actually allow you to play Solo using your Private Group with everyone else excluded (and therefore avoid any PvP). If you remove the exclusions from your Private Group you would then be in the All Player Group with PvP. What Paul2303 is asking for is already available you regardless of whether MP PvE is made available in some way or not.

I bolded the bit that I was referring to not being possible. :smilie: I understand how the groups work under the proposal.

 

[OillyRag]

I will play in PvP mode, All Players Group with as few people on my ignore list as possible (and quite possibly spend quite a lot of time running away or failing that buying new ships ).

you might well be right, that might be the best way to play the game, it will certainly be the most exciting and almost certainly the way that most people will start out playing. i genuinely hope that it doesnt get spolied.

I was just trying to understand your reasoning behind playing solo and then dropping into PvP (keep in mind you wouldn't be able to attack someone first or you would end up back in the All Players group with a bounty).

I just think i might need some peace away from the fray for a while

FYI the current group proposal will actually allow you to play Solo using your Private Group with everyone else excluded (and therefore avoid any PvP). If you remove the exclusions from your Private Group you would then be in the All Player Group with PvP. What Paul2303 is asking for is already available you regardless of whether MP PvE is made available in some way or not.

Ok thanks Jabokai has also pointed this out to me, i will go and try to make some sense out of the player groups proposal

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[Zplintz]

I bolded the bit that I was referring to not being possible. :smilie: I understand how the groups work under the proposal.

Yup yup missed the boldness - fully on board now and I agree you wouldn't be spotting anyone else while in SP.

 

[Serpentstar]

PVE/Single player

I am at a loss as to what part of Single Player is NOT PVE?

As for the rest of all this long overly debated issue, my preferences are this.

I would much rather play, as a general rule, where there was a PVP or PVE flag that could be disabled during entrance into the gaming session. This flag would be enabled/disabled at login. If, in the case of the PVP flag, it is unselected at login, then the entire existence for that logged in session would be PVE only.

In the case of a PVE flag, I don't want to see anyone who has a PVP flag enabled.

I do not understand why this would be such a difficult task or why some consider it immersion breaking.

With one group not being visible to the other, I do not understand the issue with this play option.

 

[DigitalDuck]

With one group not being visible to the other, I do not understand the issue with this play option.

Indeed, that's what option 4 is (effectively).

 

[DarkWalker]

Just out of interest - if you die (because you suicide) anyway - why not at least try to defend yourself (after all you may win) - what do you gain by suicide?

Well, there are a couple levels to this:

- If I'm not in the mood to engage in PvP then I will not find PvP, at that moment, fun. Or, rather, the frustration of being forced into a PvP situation against my will more than cancels any fun I could have with the fight. Killing myself means I "waste" less time with an activity that won't provide me with fun and can get back to something that will be fun for me faster.

- If the other player attacked me unprovoked, in a situation where I haven't explicitly consented with the risk of being attacked, then I consider that the other player wants to get his fun by ruining my fun. In this case I don't want to provide entertainment for the other player, so I will not fight back, call for help, or do anything that can provide enjoyment to my attacker; my intent is making fighting me against my will about as entertaining as beating at a target dummy.

BTW, in Elite: Dangerous I would, most likely, suicide by engaging afterburners and ramming the attacker

 

[Cody]

... in Elite: Dangerous I would, most likely, suicide by engaging afterburners and ramming the attacker

Full speed ahead... and damn the torpedoes!