Modes The Solo vs Open vs Groups Thread - Part the Second [Now With Added Platforms].

[Robert Maynard]

Forget for a minute what FDEV may or may have not said. They also said a great many things in the DDF.

How would you cater, in game (and not just with words), for the concern of those players that perceive that Powerplay is broken because of the opportunistic option to switch modes avoiding blockades at will etc?

Real or not, dont you think that this concern / perception has a serious potential to erode trust overall in the game mechanics and for Powerplay in particular?

If we are to forget everything that Frontier have said (may not have, really?) then we have what we have - a group of players trying to have the game changed to suit their particular playstyle.

The issue at hand is that there is a group of players who perceive the group switching / equal contributions in all modes features to be a problem. To satisfy them, something would need to be done to the group switching feature and / or change the contribution of one or more modes. The group that is seeking these changes may not be terribly large but it is quite vocal, I would argue disproportionately so (obviously without any statistical backup).

Back to what Frontier have definitely said: Powerplay has been introduced for all players in all modes and, since then, we have a new platform - it's for all of those players too - players that will affect the single shared galaxy state but will probably never be crossplayed with.

I guess the word "blockade" can carry too much of a visual impact. A blockade can be as simple as a wing of 4 players (weather a part of an org or not I dont really care) trying to stop another wing from Undermining one of their control systems for example, or preventing an enemy wing from delivering Powerplay material back at their own control system. Any gameplay scenario really (big or small) where a player in Open can opportunistically avoid by simply switching to Solo/Private, basically.

Again, an example of a group of players who favour a particular playstyle complaining that the group switching feature undermines their gameplay - gameplay that is obviously not able to be forced on other players as the game has included the mode switching feature from the outset. Frontier has designed, developed and delivered a game that has the specific aim of *not* corralling players in one mode to be content for others and has achieved this aim by allowing players to choose which game mode to play in on a session-by-session basis. In my opinion, the benefits to the player-base as a whole of group switching outweigh the disadvantages that it brings to players whose playstyle relies on forcing other players into situations that they don't want to be in.

 

[Cody]

Can we have another category added to the Solo vs Open vs Groups title - filthy casuals!

 

[Jockey79]

Can we have another category added to the Solo vs Open vs Groups title - filthy casuals!

If that title gets any longer, it will be a thread in its own right

Now, back in your cupboard until Asp turns up with the biscuits and extra bucket of <chortles>

 

[Cody]

This cowardly, cheating, filthy, casual, Solo player knows his place! <heads for cupboard>

 

[why fi at all]

your pleasure is not my pleasure. it is my misery.

I only ever play in Open.

I doubt very much, however, if I would join an "Only Open, Like Everr" game mode unless it was that Iron Man concept.


So why would I not join an "Only Open" mode, given that I only ever play in open?

For the simple reason that I'd expect to meet 100% of the eve-tastic intergalactic ego gods, spouting "toughen up, princess", "get out of our space, scrub", "another dumb pubbie, blah blah", "learn to play, blah blah", "never come here again, we have your name, blah blah", "You're on our clan KOS list, blah blah", etc.


Today, in Open Play, I meet and interact with all sorts of players. I help them if they need it, fight them if appropriate, flee from them if required. I never know who I'll meet, or what their background and playstyle is likely to be. But the vast majority are fun, don't trash-talk, don't talk gang crap, and it's great.

I have zero desire to see a game mode where the predominant player type is one who "role-plays a murderous at".


See you in Open... until Iron Man comes along (if ever............)

+! rep

and thank you for this description of a small but dominating personality in many MMO's that seems to have gotten their way by using those same tactics in forums.

it seems to me that these are the people complaining about not having enough easy kills in open because the easily killed have a place to go to get way.

they say that open is an empty wasteland.
well they made it that way.

perhaps what was described as how griefers would be dealt with is actually happening in the game.
it was said that people that people that do allot of killing will be on instances away from those who do not.

if this is how open is organized then these frequent-killers-of-the-weak find themselves out of the company of the less-frequent-killers-of-the-weak and only in the company of other frequent-killers-of-the-weak.
the fact that there are so few fellow frequent-killers-of-the-weak in the game may be why they see so few people in open.

that brings up the question of how they actually do end up back in the company of less-frequent-killers-of-the-weak once in a while.
maybe it's a time factor.
it's been a while since you killed someone significantly less powerful than you, so you get to come back to normal society again.
of course they can't resist the voices in their head and they immediately find a soft target to torment, get a few moments of the pleasure of someones misery.
a few times of that and it's back to the land of the frequent-killers-of-the-weak for them.
till some time passes.

so they do get to "play the game the way you want to", just not as often as those NOT made miserable seeing other people QUIETLY enjoying themselves.

 

[Jockey79]

+! rep

and thank you for this description of a small but dominating personality in many MMO's that seems to have gotten their way by using those same tactics in forums.

it seems to me that these are the people complaining about not having enough easy kills in open because the easily killed have a place to go to get way.

they say that open is an empty wasteland.
well they made it that way.

perhaps what was described as how griefers would be dealt with is actually happening in the game.
it was said that people that people that do allot of killing will be on instances away from those who do not.

if this is how open is organized then these frequent-killers-of-the-weak find themselves out of the company of the less-frequent-killers-of-the-weak and only in the company of other frequent-killers-of-the-weak.
the fact that there are so few fellow frequent-killers-of-the-weak in the game may be why they see so few people in open.

that brings up the question of how they actually do end up back in the company of less-frequent-killers-of-the-weak once in a while.
maybe it's a time factor.
it's been a while since you killed someone significantly less powerful than you, so you get to come back to normal society again.
of course they can't resist the voices in their head and they immediately find a soft target to torment, get a few moments of the pleasure of someones misery.
a few times of that and it's back to the land of the frequent-killers-of-the-weak for them.
till some time passes.

so they do get to "play the game the way you want to", just not as often as those NOT made miserable seeing other people QUIETLY enjoying themselves.

People may have spread out. It is a big galaxy after all.
When I went to Diso (in open) while the corn was on offer, it was manic there. I even went afk for 30 minutes outside the station, as bait - to see what would happen. I drifted about 30Km.

The problem isn't killers have run out of targets. It is they are too lazy to move where the targets move to. Seen some folks putting up system names with the old "wasteland" comments, but people were fed up being killed and moved, they didn't move after them and stayed in an empty system, whining it was empty - go figure.

So it's not just easy kills some folks want, they actually want people to travel to them to be killed. And while they wait, people spread out more and more (which FD said people would spread out - so it's not as if it was not expected) and will become harder and harder to find.

Heck, just read GalNet on all the combat areas now and events going on. Different people will flock to different areas of the current weekly news areas listed, dividing the player base even more than it is.

Killers need to get out there and look for kills, not just camp one system for "lulz".

 

[ZandZack]

Powerplay had to be restricted to open

I dont want to re-start the discussion for closed/group/open play.

The Powerplay takes count also from solo or group mode.
The effects can be everywhere, but if you want to alter a power it should be restricted to open.
In Solo- or group-mode you can farm and trade merits, support expansions without anybody can do something against.
Its like the Soloplayer can cheat down the open-Players.
No strategie, no roleplay - only the amount of merits traded are counting !

If restricted to open only the player think twice if and how he supports a power.
Merchants will order a wing support for safety, might a player'police' will make the mainsystems safe or help to underrun the enemys systems !
Uncountable new possibilitys of gameplay ...

Powerplay got to restricted to open only!

 

[rckstr]

Are you a magician...?

Manipulating influences of factions and powers, shaping and forging the Future of the Galaxy where we want to live and fight reminds me more and more of the movie "The invisible man/ Hollow man".

Going into a system that is being Undermined with the ambition to stop the enemy forces from doing that gives you the Choice to fortify the hell out of it until the trigger value is reached, or just go into another system where you can undermine yourself.
You want to go into a system where you want to stop traders from fortifying? Same as above.
Systems with preparation or expansion going on? You guess it. It's all the same. "Everybody" is going into Solo/Group mode and plays Elite: (put anything but Dangerous here). The only people you might meet are a couple of organized players, or some people with a spark of decency to recognize the bad impact of this behavior.

What do you think would happen if you could do the same in games like Fifa, Mortal combat or many other games the depend on stopping your enemy from doing anything unwanted.

To react on an event properly you have to be in the position to do so. Right now no one has.
The same happens with Nanomam (for example) right now. It is independent. People doing a hell of a bunch missions for the federation. First the influence grows and suddenly it feels like all the effort you do is counted to to influence of your enemy. If there are people at Nanomam pushing the independent factions i want to see them and i want to stop them. Right now i can't, no one can.

Yes, this might be a rant and another Solo/Group vs Open thread.

But don't you see this? Do you really think this is something you wish to be working as intended? I understand that Combatquitting is a big no-no! But i'd rather have some combatquitters that i can at least interrupt, then havin to deal with Hollow man!

Fly Safe

cmdr rckstr

 

[SteveLaw]

I suspect that it feels emptier for people because Power Play has spread them out more. Previously all systems were essentially as valuable as each other. Some attracted more people because they attracted more people, if you see what I mean. PP has given a significance to much larger number of systems. Players will spread out across the Powers and they will further spread out across that Powers and their multiple enemies' various Control, Expansion and Preparation systems.

There are no longer a small number of "go to" systems, players need to be in any number of systems at different times.

Oops, I got surrounded by a merge.

 

[Gidio]

...What?

 

[Kosmo-not]

We need to have it so that we have one character for open play and one character for solo/group. Being able to hop between the two is similar to combat logging in a way.

 

[Schmack]

I don't see anything in your post that pinpoints what you are trying to say. Can you boil it down to a couple bullet points? I think people playing in Solo or group can do whatever they want, because it's their game. Even in open, the same is true. Your goals are just yours, not everyones. If they want the galaxy to be a mess, so be it. The players don't move in group lock step.

We aren't a team, just a bunch of video gamers who get what they can out of the game before they move on.

 

[Ikari]

I think PP needs changing because currently it really encourages "farming of merits" and to do that in any economical way you have to do it in solo or group.

It's not a matter of it being fair as the option is open to everyone and it's common sense when faced with things like "decay" which shows its not the modes that need to change but how PP rewards the players.

To clarify rewards do not need to be different between Solo or Open more PP needs a big re-think.

 

[Deleted member 38366]

--- Deleted ---

 

[Robert Maynard]

Yes, this might be a rant and another Solo/Group vs Open thread.

Indeed - merged accordingly.

 

[Cody]

Welcome to the new mergees!

 

[SteveLaw]

What do you think would happen if you could do the same in games like Fifa, Mortal combat or many other games the depend on stopping your enemy from doing anything unwanted.

The difference is that Elite does not depend on you directly stopping your enemy. It gives you counter tasks to do that. Counter tasks that are just as effective in any mode. If you fortify a system it cannot be undermined even if your enemy does it from Solo. PP was designed with the modes in mind.

 

[rckstr]

I know that time of day would reduce the chance to see a specific person and stop this specific person. The same with instancing. But with open being the only mode to really affect the galaxy it would increase my chance of being able to stop someone. My goal and everyone's goal shouldn't be to just fortify your system. Your goal should also be to stop people from undermining it!

President: "Hey Admiral, let's Attack another Country!"
Admiral: "Hello Mr. President, yes let's do this. But let us not do this in open, they could stop us actively from doing that!"
President: "Uuuh, yeah this sounds like hell lot of fun"

this is just bonkers.

 

[SteveLaw]

But with open being the only mode to really affect the galaxy

All modes on all platforms affect the galaxy equally.

 

[rckstr]

All platforms affecting the galaxy equally is ok. All platforms would have the possibility to stop the enemy on their platform.

But just let me give you another example. Basketball. The only way to win would be standing below the basket and throwing more balls in it then the other team. You'd have nothing else in the game then. Is this really what's desired?