Toxic community. Why so?

[Cosmos]

I wouldn't call the community toxic at all. It is however extremely polarised and thats largely the responsibility of Frontier; I won't go into it any further because I'm done arguing and discussing certain issues. That said, there are folks on both side of the fence that are far from pleasant. With that said I'm seeing encouraging changes in the moderation of late and the vibe has improved.

What most share in common is a passion for the game and naturally opposing views result in conflict. ED does somethings amazingly well and it draws us in but once in we often find things that are frustrating. Sometimes you have to read between the lines but its quite obviously something Frontier have recognised as per their request to seek quality of life improvement suggestions.

There is always a bit of disgruntlment after any update goes live but I've seen things far, far worse. I don't get a negative vibe at all at the minute and Ed and Zac do a great job in connectiing with the playerbase and being a shock absorber for various grievances.

Nah, as it stands I think we are in much better shape. No one is perfect, I have my moments too, and the same applies to Frontier, but the team at Frontier are a good one; have nothing but best wishes for them and the company and that wasn't always the case. Another thing we might all take for granted is how accessible the devs and community managers are. Thats quite a rare thing frankly and we are kind of in a special position re the game in that we actually all know one another.

I might not like some people but they are few in number.. On the whole I think were doing aight.

 

[Lunchmoney]

Welcome to the internet.

 

[Dimensions]

I don't remember the community being like this when ED started, but it has increasing become more antagonistic as more updates are added. I think the root cause is people really enjoy Elite and realise it has huge potential, but have very different visions of its future direction and gameplay elements. This polarisation looks set to be a much bigger headache further down the road.

 

[CMDR Pugwash]

I wouldn't call the community toxic at all. It is however extremely polarised and thats largely the responsibility of Frontier; I won't go into it any further because I'm done arguing and discussing certain issues. That said, there are folks on both side of the fence that are far from pleasant. With that said I'm seeing encouraging changes in the moderation of late and the vibe has improved.

What most share in common is a passion for the game and naturally opposing views result in conflict. ED does somethings amazingly well and it draws us in but once in we often find things that are frustrating. Sometimes you have to read between the lines but its quite obviously something Frontier have recognised as per their request to seek quality of life improvement suggestions.

There is always a bit of disgruntlment after any update goes live but I've seen things far, far worse. I don't get a negative vibe at all at the minute and Ed and Zac do a great job in connectiing with the playerbase and being a shock absorber for various grievances.

Nah, as it stands I think we are in much better shape.

Hey, that was far too considered and insightful. You are not the real Donald Trump, you can't fool me.

 

[The Wallet Inspector]

Considering that the player base is in the order of 1.5 million, statistically 1% of players become active on forums and of those 1% a few post occasional rants and a - literally - handful constantly post negatively on these forums.... That is one almight strong toxin you are experiencing!

It only takes one rotten apple though, to make the whole batch stink.

 

[CMDR Sheehy]

I don't remember the community being like this when ED started, but it has increasing become more antagonistic as more updates are added. I think the root cause is people really enjoy Elite and realise it has huge potential, but have very different visions of its future direction and gameplay elements. This polarisation looks set to be a much bigger headache further down the road.

You don't remember Offline Mode?

At least this place has outstanding moderators who have no qualms telling people where to go, and giving us the slaps in the right places to keep us in-line.

Hey, we are dealing with Humans. Some of us need a humour implant, but then again, when something matters to someone...

 

[verminstar]

Because playing yer own way means not playing the way others want ye to play...some take exception to that. And because this is the internet and this is fairly mild compared to others...games within games ^^

 

[Andovar]

This isn't a toxic community at all trust me, if you look at the vast bulk of the posts, look across the sub-forums (Ships, Outfitting, Community Goal, Horizons, Engineers, Powerplay, Wings etc etc) most people are kind, helpful and have a sense of humour.

On the Reddit 99% of people again are good people.

Elite honestly has one of the best communities I've ever been part of in a game.

Granted we're in the honeymoon of Elite, where it's long enough after initial release to be have a fleshed out game, but not so far away that we're all tired of it but still playing.

What he said... word for word.

Sorry K-rose, apparently i need to spread more rep around. I'll rep you later.

 

[Ian Skippy]

I haven't run across any other players, yet in the game. If you lot play like you post here, I think I'd Just assume give it a pass.

It seems like every time I visit this forum, there's some raging ... let's call it a "debate", going on. The fact that Someone recently felt inspired to make a thread called "The Positive 2.2 thread" speaks volumes.

It is, what it is. I have to wonder why, though.
It's really hard for me to believe that a game like this naturally attracted a toxic player base, and I definitely don't think that the people who are getting so hot here, are always that way. There's got to be something else at play.

Is this a new thing? From the language of the posts, I'd guess it's been going on long enough for the community to be thoroughly divided into adversarial groups several times over.

At this point, Has it just been generally accepted as the local etiquette, to meet opposition with nastynes?

Could it be something to do with the way the forum is arranged, or designed? Something else related? I don't know.

Maybe, it's something as simple as being a message board for a game with the word "Elite" in the title.
I wonder.

1) After >1500 hours in Open I can say that the Open community is great.
2) I have been to over 20 countries in real-life, and have never, ever, encountered a culture where "Hey, why are you guys so toxic?" is considered an acceptable way for more or less sane people to start a discussion. I wonder why you think this is the kind of interaction people would be interested in, and why that is so much better than what you vaguely accuse an entire community of.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

Frontier advertise the game in such a way as it appeals to various player types, some of which are at polar opposites to each other.

What some players demand in the game, or it will surely fail, would practically ruin it for others.

Some players feel a large portion of the playerbase "cheat" by not playing in open as they cannot be stopped doing "stuff". Other players depend on this feature as it was advertised back in kickstarter.

Some players came back to Elite despite not generally being big games players, but came in based on the promise of a new elite after a 20 year wait... other players have no interest in what elite was and have their own ideas on what elite dangerous should be.

The developers made a very optimistic list of features which sounded really really cool.... some of these features are taking longer than expected (by some) to make it into the game, other features appear to be on the cutting room floor, but FD do not state which are coming but a bit late and which are gone... this generates a certain concern from some quarters.

The losses in ED are VERY asymmetric and i think most would agree the law and order does not really work right now. a couple of players in close to starter ships can put back a trader 10 hrs or more just for lolz and they face only a 6k fine and historically there have been a number of exploits/loopholes abused to gain even more of an advantage. The people doing this are doing nothing "wrong" per se its just the game does nothing to balance it.... this tends to get some people a bit irate.

These are a few of the issues... there are more i am sure... but if you think this is bad, look at the star citizen forums or look up Mechwarrior online 3rd person view.



some of us get a bit heated but over all IME its a fairly friendly place... the issue is often not with what people say, but HOW they say it.

PS I realise my bias above is clear, but its all in good spirits

 

[Tono Kopec]

Plenty of good posters on this forum imo. Help and advice are usually quickly offered when asked for.
Of course, there are childish squabbles over entrenched positions and sometimes posters might choose to be a little more polite, but that's the same as the internet anywhere.

 

[Macy]

It always amazes me why people click on a thread to complain about reading "yet another thread on this". Why frikkin click it then? If i see "another" thread on something that doesn't interest me, i scroll on by. Obviously people enjoy complaining.

 

[deleteduser]

This is how forums work 99.99% of the time.

There isn't a forum thread in the galaxy that, should it remain unlocked for long enough, wont end up with at least two users bickering about nonsense, especially when the subject matter is in any way subjective.

Whilst occasionally unseemly, it is a useful venting strategy that can relieve a considerable amount of pent-up tantrum; not an excuse, just an explanation. I wouldn't bet my house on many of the 'raging' members here, and I'll include myself as a typical forum user, on bearing any relation to their apparent forum personas.

I rather enjoy the wit that is often displayed in rage threads, and believe the internet would be a poorer place without it, whether E: D related or not.

 

[Crimson Kaim]

Naturally it's just the interpretation of 'toxic'. Personally I do not find this community toxic at all. Some exceptions are always there but in general there are way worse communitites. However, they balance eachother out.
It would prolly come down to the carebear vs hardcore debate. Do we care for eachother or do we say survival of the fittest? I am more towards survival of the fittest as everyone is resposible for their own problems. Thus, not being a carebear as of ignoring problems of others is considered to be toxic as far as I interpret that.

If you consider negativity as toxic then this is your personal, subjective interpretation but this doesn't apply for me. Hence there are misunderstandings. While one person says something, in his/her eyes completely valid, the other person feels insulted. A certain level of resilience is required here and usually the level of resilience makes a person more toxic or more careful.
Take me for example, I wouldn't care if people insulted me. They can say whatever they want to it wouldn't bother me much or at all. But then others feel pretty insulted when I even use the term "carebear". I don't know why but it's like that. I acknowledge the fact that this happens but won't change my tone/language for that as long as I don't see a logical reasoning behind that other than me believing someone is mentally weak.

And here comes the carebear vs hardcore debate. Do we care for those who are mentally weak (as of easily insulted and hurt verbally) or do we just go on and let nature do its stuff?

Not takign any side here. There are both advantages and disadvantages to go towards one side or another. The individual itself has to decide how it responds to a certain environment. Trying to adapt or trying to change the environment? Both is perfectly reasonable and can work out well.

 

[Mysturji]

I haven't run across any other players, yet in the game. If you lot play like you post here, I think I'd Just assume give it a pass.

It seems like every time I visit this forum, there's some raging ... let's call it a "debate", going on. The fact that Someone recently felt inspired to make a thread called "The Positive 2.2 thread" speaks volumes.

It is, what it is. I have to wonder why, though.
It's really hard for me to believe that a game like this naturally attracted a toxic player base, and I definitely don't think that the people who are getting so hot here, are always that way. There's got to be something else at play.

Is this a new thing? From the language of the posts, I'd guess it's been going on long enough for the community to be thoroughly divided into adversarial groups several times over.

At this point, Has it just been generally accepted as the local etiquette, to meet opposition with nastynes?

Could it be something to do with the way the forum is arranged, or designed? Something else related? I don't know.

Maybe, it's something as simple as being a message board for a game with the word "Elite" in the title.
I wonder.

Welcome to the internet.
In my (admittedly limited) experience, every forum is like this. That's why there are moderators.
Just ignore the idiots, and you'll find lots of useful info and helpful advice here.
Likewise, in-game, there is no shortage of idiots, but they aren't everywhere, and chances are if you go somewhere else, you won't see any for a while.

 

[CMDR Sheehy]

It always amazes me why people click on a thread to complain about reading "yet another thread on this". Why frikkin click it then? If i see "another" thread on something that doesn't interest me, i scroll on by. Obviously people enjoy complaining.

Elite was born in a country that likes to complain.

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/lat...-people-complain-more-than-70-times-week-each

It's a healthy thing which maintains our mental health. Without it, we turn in to Europeans. (no insult intended.)

 

[Andovar]

It only takes one rotten apple though, to make the whole batch stink.

If that's the barometer for a toxic community, then every game community from now until the end of time will be considered toxic.

 

[who?]

IMO, the longer any forum (gaming or otherwise) exists the more the users become possessive of it.

It starts off: "Hey, this game is great! This community is great, thanks for letting me be part of it!"
Moves onto: "I don't really like Feature X. And I think we who have been on the forums a while know better than you newbies.."
And ends up: "THIS FEATURE MUST BE REMOVED. Company Y is showing complete disregard for their userbase by adding a feature I wasn't consulted on!?!"

ED is a 7 year game. 'nuff said.

 

[rootsrat]

I haven't run across any other players, yet in the game. If you lot play like you post here, I think I'd Just assume give it a pass.

It seems like every time I visit this forum, there's some raging ... let's call it a "debate", going on. The fact that Someone recently felt inspired to make a thread called "The Positive 2.2 thread" speaks volumes.

It is, what it is. I have to wonder why, though.
It's really hard for me to believe that a game like this naturally attracted a toxic player base, and I definitely don't think that the people who are getting so hot here, are always that way. There's got to be something else at play.

Is this a new thing? From the language of the posts, I'd guess it's been going on long enough for the community to be thoroughly divided into adversarial groups several times over.

At this point, Has it just been generally accepted as the local etiquette, to meet opposition with nastynes?

Could it be something to do with the way the forum is arranged, or designed? Something else related? I don't know.

Maybe, it's something as simple as being a message board for a game with the word "Elite" in the title.
I wonder.

To reply to the OP - I think due to the fact that Elite is a diverse, complex and massive game, allowing for many different play styles, activities and approach to these activities, every one of us has their own idea of what Elite should be and how it should be made. The toxicity comes from stirring emotions, and emotions come from the passion for Elite. It's great to see - it means people LOVE this game!

Apart from the toxicity of course, but that's unfortunately a part of every single community, be it RL or online. It's quite normal in communities - unfortunatey. Each and every one of us had a moment where the emotions take over and we say things to other, we'd normally not say at all. Human nature, is all.

I've been a mod for a while now and I can tell you that I've seen people arguing to death about one aspect of the game, to then stand together in line and defend a different aspect next day. All in all - we all love this game (there will be exceptions to this rule of course) and we want it the best it can, but we all have a different idea of what "the best" means

It's just my personal opinion though, but based on the 10 years experience in administration and moderation of online communities

 

[Macy]

Elite was born in a country that likes to complain.

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/lat...-people-complain-more-than-70-times-week-each

It's a healthy thing which maintains our mental health. Without it, we turn in to Europeans. (no insult intended.)

LOL quite right sir, we're British you know.
Now lets complain about the weather.