Wasn't part of the idea of the new C&P to simplify the bounty system and now that complexity is just being passed off to another mechanic?
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- Thread starter Sandro Sammarco
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I'm sure I've had it when running cargo for CGs without any active missions.
rootsrat
Volunteer Moderator
Not really. The bounties/fines system is simpler now. As in the law system. The KWS mechanics is a separate thing, albeit connected by the bounties issued in the new law system (which, again, is simpler than the old one).
This new KWS mechanics are not really complex either, if you read the OP.
hehe...well simpler than the last 3 proposals - though most of this looks like the 3rd with some tweaks to simplify. If a new player asks "what does the KWS do? Do I need to use it" I think I can provide a reasonably sensible and short response.
Obviously I'd likely miss out rep trickle down and things, and just focus on "all bounties in system" "rep with those factions, cash from those factions"
I mean some of the complex stuff to do with rep etc was currently happening and I've never had to explain that or seen anyone ask so I think just the "all bounties in system and permission to kill in the same superpower if it has superpower bounty" bit should generally be sufficient... I hope!
I guess we should just get Sandro to clarify?
Sandro: What situations can interdictors spawn in unclaimed systems and would they come with bounties in those situations or would we not get cash for killing them but not wanted either?
EG:
Related to missions? Do they come with bounties associated with source/destination systems?
Pledged to CGs? Do they come with bounties associated with the CG system if so?
Running random cargo not wanted? Would the pirate have bounties if KWS in an empty system?
any other situations....
Judging by previous experiences with such changes, I'd like a dedicated beta for this.
Sandro,
The new system sounds good to me, except for one little bit in relation to the old system:
Those bounties were the only ones that had any real impact on superpower reputation, which is critical because superpower reputation decays from Allied down to Friendly (75%) at a fairly significant rate (seems to be around 2% per day of real time, logged in or not - if logged out for a long period, the loss will be applied very shortly after you launch/enter supercruise/jump (i.e. change zones).
I think it took about 1.2 - 2 million credits of these bounties to go from 75% to 100%. It takes about 400,000 credits to go from 90% to 100%. In a good bounty hunting spot, you should be able to make the latter in about an hour, the former in 2 hours of bounty hunting.
Meanwhile, in that same amount of time, doing missions or trading (which only affects the controlling faction) will move that percentage from 0% (just offset down tick) to maybe a 2% gain.
If the superpower rep gain from bounty hunting was too much in the old system - not working as intended - I can understand bringing in that back in line. However, in the pre-3.0 system bounty hunting was the only way to effectively maintain/regain superpower reputation - because of the decay - without having to play every single day for 3-4 hours (and spending all that time on reputation gaining activities). Allied status with a superpower is very valuable as it allowed you to gain local aligned faction reputation (via any means - bounty hunting, trading, missions) much faster. So I'm very concerned about how hard it is going to be to maintain allied status with one or more superpowers - unless one has no life and plays ED for long periods every day.
Other than that, the new system sounds great.
Thanks.
The new system sounds good to me, except for one little bit in relation to the old system:
Those bounties were the only ones that had any real impact on superpower reputation, which is critical because superpower reputation decays from Allied down to Friendly (75%) at a fairly significant rate (seems to be around 2% per day of real time, logged in or not - if logged out for a long period, the loss will be applied very shortly after you launch/enter supercruise/jump (i.e. change zones).
I think it took about 1.2 - 2 million credits of these bounties to go from 75% to 100%. It takes about 400,000 credits to go from 90% to 100%. In a good bounty hunting spot, you should be able to make the latter in about an hour, the former in 2 hours of bounty hunting.
Meanwhile, in that same amount of time, doing missions or trading (which only affects the controlling faction) will move that percentage from 0% (just offset down tick) to maybe a 2% gain.
If the superpower rep gain from bounty hunting was too much in the old system - not working as intended - I can understand bringing in that back in line. However, in the pre-3.0 system bounty hunting was the only way to effectively maintain/regain superpower reputation - because of the decay - without having to play every single day for 3-4 hours (and spending all that time on reputation gaining activities). Allied status with a superpower is very valuable as it allowed you to gain local aligned faction reputation (via any means - bounty hunting, trading, missions) much faster. So I'm very concerned about how hard it is going to be to maintain allied status with one or more superpowers - unless one has no life and plays ED for long periods every day.
Other than that, the new system sounds great.
Thanks.
rootsrat
Volunteer Moderator
Sandro - can you confirm if bounties claimed by a player from a player (PVP) are still hard-capped to 2 mln Cr, regardless of actual bounty value, other factions, jurisdiction etc.? So that the highest amount of bounty you can ever claim from another Commander is 2 mln Cr, regardless of circumstances?
You just said exactly the same thing I did but with more words except I didn't say the new KWS system was really complex just more so than the old system which is part of the reason the C&P system was simplified.
"Retiring"?!!
I knew it, what generation are you?
2.4 Bounty Hunter: I used to do your job. .................I was good at it.
3.0 Bounty Hunter: Things were simpler then.
2.4 Bounty Hunter: Why are you making it complicated?
3.0 Bounty Hunter: I didn't figure you as one for balderdash!
2.4 Bounty Hunter: What is it you want?
3.0 Bounty Hunter: I just want to ask you for some feedback.
Yeah, agreed - it means you can fine-grain which factions you actually choose to give influence to, but you can still claim the bounties for those you don't, at reduced cash, from the factors... but at no risk of helping anyone you don't want. That's actually great.
@ Sandro Labernato: Well, even if my english is not so bad I don't understand anything. I only remember this: When you kill warrant scan your target, you not only gain the local bounties but also other bounties and gain more credits. Not sure what the other 500 lines want to tell me. Once again it probably looks a bit too simple. Can't you make it a bit more complicated. 
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Hi Sandro,
Cheers
You say "it really does not make sense". I disagree, in fact I think you've got the equation the wrong way around. It makes sense for the factions to receive influence - after all, their bounty led to a criminal being terminated and therefore the faction should now be in better shape. It does not make sense at all for the Commander to get any rep, because it is actually the Interstellar Factors representative who is claiming the bounty with the faction, not the Commander. I hope you can see this contradiction and plan to fix it in 3.1.
When you say "basic scan" do you mean we can reveal interstellar bounties without using a KWS, in the same way that we reveal local jurisdiction bounties as the ship being "Wanted" from a basic scan?
Cheers
This looks workable thanks Sandro. I like the idea (if I've understood correctly) that I can use local bounties to either increase influence or if I choose, claim it via a factor & have no influence increase applied.
I also quite like the idea of there being more benefit to claiming the bounties locally (rather than via factors).
I also quite like the idea of there being more benefit to claiming the bounties locally (rather than via factors).
Hi Sandro, i have a question which is somehow attached to the KWS but not completely:
Is it on the to do list for Frontier to focus on the ability to actually track with precision targets via the wake scanner or other mechanics ? (both PvE and PvP) and if Yes, do you know when approximately ? (this year or later)
Is it on the to do list for Frontier to focus on the ability to actually track with precision targets via the wake scanner or other mechanics ? (both PvE and PvP) and if Yes, do you know when approximately ? (this year or later)
Please no.. messes up the way we use the KWS to support specific factions without destroying our own reputation.
Not to mention, Sandro said they don't keep track of where you make the kills, just who you made the kill for. So if you're going to give influence points, the game doesn't know which system to give the points in (assuming that minor faction is in multiple systems).
Nice!
And I'll add this one too, because this was literally the first thing that popped into my head when I read the new "clear and simple" KWS changes...
[video=youtube_share;pXw7LYWNi5E]https://youtu.be/pXw7LYWNi5E[/video]
This is how I see it at the moment.
Let me see if I have this right.
A bounty hunter that normally plays in solo will "Require" a kws just to legalize their action to attack a wanted ship. It sounds like if we do not do so. We are committing a crime by not using a kws.
Wanted npc's will have less value than wanted commanders.
As someone who isn't that interested in power play. This sounds like the basic npc bounty hunter will get paid less and be required to use a kws just to legalize bounty hunting.
If we are going to an Interstellar Factor and losing all of the influence. Shouldn't we get a credit bump for that influence? It is clear it should have value. (While the background sim may not actually do it. In a real universe the factors would be taking that data in large volumes to sell probably to the super powers. Giving them a large profit.)
A bounty hunter that normally plays in solo will "Require" a kws just to legalize their action to attack a wanted ship. It sounds like if we do not do so. We are committing a crime by not using a kws.
Wanted npc's will have less value than wanted commanders.
As someone who isn't that interested in power play. This sounds like the basic npc bounty hunter will get paid less and be required to use a kws just to legalize bounty hunting.
If we are going to an Interstellar Factor and losing all of the influence. Shouldn't we get a credit bump for that influence? It is clear it should have value. (While the background sim may not actually do it. In a real universe the factors would be taking that data in large volumes to sell probably to the super powers. Giving them a large profit.)
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