C&P and ATR need some tuning + rumor of a loophole to avoid paying the hefty rebuy?

LeKeno · Mar 4, 2018

Edit: So before everyone make up stuff on my behalf:
- I'm not asking for more magical, insta-death buffed ATR.
- I like open and its danger, and I think that the game needs outlaws. Otherwise I would be bored. So, no I'm not a Mobius advocate.
- But if this is supposed to address "repeat murder spree" as said on the stream, it's doing poorly.
- So, either get rid of ATR and find a different way to protect the noobs (e.g. system lock down) or make them react faster and competitive with engineered ships so that they are actually a believable threat without being overpowered (perhaps remove the station guns then).

At the community goal in Arek, I saw Harry Potter in supercruise.
Unsurprisingly, he was wanted.
Surprisingly, he had a 150m bounty on his clipper.

I sent him a "lol, that bounty!"
And Harry Potter replied: "best part is ATR don't spawn, yea... going to get it to 200m then show how I don't have to pay it".

So, I decided to find out what he was doing and trying to get him to pay for his crimes.

[video=youtube_share;laVStULXwAM]https://youtu.be/laVStULXwAM[/video]

Looks like C&P and ATR need some tuning:

ATR did spawn but damn they are so slow to react.
Also, ATR seemed unable to keep up with his clipper. Even my 2.4 Imperial Courier with a 737 boost speed had trouble.
Allegedly, Harry destroyed about 150 ships in 1.5 days, and, I'm guessing, without suffering even one heavy rebuy.

Harry, since you had a 250m bounty on your head when I went after you, mind telling fdev "how you don't have to pay it"?

Extract from my Player Journal:

Code:

{ "timestamp":"2018-03-04T12:58:09Z", "event":"ShipTargeted", "TargetLocked":true, "Ship":"empire_trader", "Ship_Localised":"Imperial Clipper", "ScanStage":0 }
{ "timestamp":"2018-03-04T12:58:14Z", "event":"ShipTargeted", "TargetLocked":true, "Ship":"empire_trader", "Ship_Localised":"Imperial Clipper", "ScanStage":1, "PilotName":"$cmdr_decorate:#name=Harry Potter;", "PilotName_Localised":"CMDR Harry Potter", "PilotRank":"Elite" }
{ "timestamp":"2018-03-04T12:58:16Z", "event":"ShipTargeted", "TargetLocked":true, "Ship":"empire_trader", "Ship_Localised":"Imperial Clipper", "ScanStage":2, "PilotName":"$cmdr_decorate:#name=Harry Potter;", "PilotName_Localised":"CMDR Harry Potter", "PilotRank":"Elite", "ShieldHealth":100.000000, "HullHealth":97.154739 }
{ "timestamp":"2018-03-04T12:58:18Z", "event":"ShipTargeted", "TargetLocked":true, "Ship":"empire_trader", "Ship_Localised":"Imperial Clipper", "ScanStage":3, "PilotName":"$cmdr_decorate:#name=Harry Potter;", "PilotName_Localised":"CMDR Harry Potter", "PilotRank":"Elite", "ShieldHealth":100.000000, "HullHealth":97.154739, "LegalStatus":"Wanted", "Bounty":149850900 }
{ "timestamp":"2018-03-04T12:58:40Z", "event":"SendText", "To":"Harry Potter", "Message":"lol, that bounty!" }
{ "timestamp":"2018-03-04T12:58:51Z", "event":"ReceiveText", "From":"Harry Potter", "Message":"best part is ATR don't spawn", "Channel":"player" }
{ "timestamp":"2018-03-04T12:59:17Z", "event":"ReceiveText", "From":"Harry Potter", "Message":"yea... going to get it to 200m then show how I don't have to pay it", "Channel":"player" }
{ "timestamp":"2018-03-04T12:59:32Z", "event":"SendText", "To":"Harry Potter", "Message":"why are they not showing up?" }
{ "timestamp":"2018-03-04T12:59:50Z", "event":"ReceiveText", "From":"Harry Potter", "Message":"no clue tbh", "Channel":"player" }

znôrt · Mar 4, 2018

loading popcorn ...

(i suppose it's needless to say this is working as predicted)

LeKeno · Mar 4, 2018

So before everyone make up stuff on my behalf:
- I'm not asking for more magical, insta-death buffed ATR.
- I like open and its danger, and I think that the game needs outlaws. Otherwise I would be bored. So, no I'm not a Mobius advocate.
- But if this is supposed to address "repeat murder spree" as said on the stream, it's doing poorly.
- So, either get rid of ATR and find a different way to protect the noobs (e.g. system lock down) or make them react faster and competitive with engineered ship so that they are actually a believable threat without being overpowered (perhaps remove the station guns then).

jasonbarron · Mar 4, 2018

If you're plan was to give Harry the perfect platform to gain publicity for his demonstration yesterday, you're doing a very good job

Ouberos · Mar 4, 2018

That is one fast Clipper.

SentineI · Mar 4, 2018

And some people were complaining(?) about the lack of gankers after 3.0...

Arguendo · Mar 4, 2018

jasonbarron said:
If you're plan was to give Harry the perfect platform to gain publicity for his demonstration yesterday, you're doing a very good job

His Masterplan (oh, LeKeno is truly cunning when it comes to those!) afaik, is to give FDev a kick in the butt to make something that is actually working as intended. ATR and the new C&P was created to deter players from doing exactly what HP has been doing the last couple of days. Well, guess what, it doesn't.
When HP also claims there's a loophole that makes it possible for him to avoid paying for his crimes if he dies in his ship, then that's either something FDev missed, or a bug. Either way, they should be made aware of it, and I seriously doubt HP is gonna tell them...atleast not until he's had his fun and someone has outed him on it, like LeKeno did here. That's SOP, you know

PS: It's "your"

jasonbarron · Mar 4, 2018

CMDR Arguendo said:
His Masterplan (oh, LeKeno is truly cunning when it comes to those!) afaik, is to give FDev a kick in the butt to make something that is actually working as intended. ATR and the new C&P was created to deter players from doing exactly what HP has been doing the last couple of days. Well, guess what, it doesn't.
When HP also claims there's a loophole that makes it possible for him to avoid paying for his crimes if he dies in his ship, then that's either something FDev missed, or a bug. Either way, they should be made aware of it, and I seriously doubt HP is gonna tell them...atleast not until he's had his fun and someone has outed him on it, like LeKeno did here. That's SOP, you know

PS: It's "your"

ATR ships are already cheap to the point of being nasty, I really don't think Frontier needs anymore encouragement to make them any more magically implausible than they already are. Maybe they should consider sending these ships to the front lines of all the battle zones of various wars around the galaxy instead of using them for cheap rentacops.

Thanks for the grammar lesson though

besieger · Mar 4, 2018

This thread is great...

Wasp0 · Mar 4, 2018

2 things to note from your Vid LeKeno....
1. I bet you wish you had another Weapon other than 3 Mines...(Oh for a MC/Rail/Anything) and at 4% that bounty would have been yours. Bad Luck!

2. Oh My Blinking Flippity Flip, that is one fast Clipper Mr Potter has there. Anyone (Or Mr P himself??) care to guess what Max Boost Speed is on it?

Better luck next time Lekeno

sovapid · Mar 4, 2018

Wasp0 said:
2. Oh My Blinking Flippity Flip, that is one fast Clipper Mr Potter has there. Anyone (Or Mr P himself??) care to guess what Max Boost Speed is on it?

Mine is right around 610 with a pvp loadout.

besieger · Mar 4, 2018

Wasp0 said:
2 things to note from your Vid LeKeno....
1. I bet you wish you had another Weapon other than 3 Mines...(Oh for a MC/Rail/Anything) and at 4% that bounty would have been yours. Bad Luck!

2. Oh My Blinking Flippity Flip, that is one fast Clipper Mr Potter has there. Anyone (Or Mr P himself??) care to guess what Max Boost Speed is on it?

Better luck next time Lekeno

Arguendo · Mar 4, 2018

jasonbarron said:
ATR ships are already cheap to the point of being nasty, I really don't think Frontier needs anymore encouragement to make them any more magically implausible than they already are. Maybe they should consider sending these ships to the front lines of all the battle zones of various wars around the galaxy instead of using them for cheap rentacops.

Yes, but that was never LeKeno's point. His point was that HP claimed they don't spawn, which would be a bug. Then they actually do, but they are unable to deter someone like HP from doing what he does because he's got a legacy build that ATR can't touch. ATR don't need those Station Guns. They do however need to scale in Combat skill, Engineering, Numbers, Type of Ship, and Response Time to eventually make the wanted player leave the system. If they don't do those things, they may as well not exist for players like HP.
Oh, and then there's the NPC amnesia, but that goes for everything that is programmed in the game [where is it]

Thanks for the grammar lesson though

You're more than welcome

jasonbarron · Mar 4, 2018

Removing legacy modules, not just from Harry, is some serious common ground. Guns/drives that are impossible to obtain with the current system is a train wreck in place of a design decision. Its so bad that I'm actually embarrassed for Fdev.

Arguendo · Mar 4, 2018

jasonbarron said:
Removing legacy modules, not just from Harry, is some serious common ground. Guns/drives that are impossible to obtain with the current system is a train wreck in place of a design decision. Its so bad that I'm actually embarrassed for Fdev.

You and me both man!

Wolf Starslayer · Mar 4, 2018

jasonbarron said:
Removing legacy modules, not just from Harry, is some serious common ground. Guns/drives that are impossible to obtain with the current system is a train wreck in place of a design decision. Its so bad that I'm actually embarrassed for Fdev.

They hung that albatross around their own necks, grandfathering modules was a terrible idea.

jasonbarron · Mar 4, 2018

Wolf Starslayer said:
They hung that albatross around their own necks, grandfathering modules was a terrible idea.

The irony is that scads of people (including myself) who owned some of these godrolled secondary imbued modules did everything but beg frontier to strip them from the game.

ryan_m · Mar 4, 2018

I actually begged them multiple times, on DJTruthsayer's stream with them watching, in multiple emails, and in multiple Reddit/forum threads.

UmbraRex · Mar 4, 2018

ATR needs, IMHO, some serious reworking.

First, they need to NOT be using ships available to players. They are the top end elite system security personnel. They need full on military grade ships. Yes, stuff players (pirates every one of em!) can't get.

Second, they need THE TOP END engineering, plus a smidgen.

Third, they need to deploy as wings and work together, not as a group of independent pilots. They need wings that are designed to work together to take out the best and the baddest criminals can throw at them.

And last, but not least, they need persistence. If the criminal low wakes, the existing wing should follow them, as well as call in reinforcements, following the criminal and interdicting them non stop until they high wake out. And following even then if to another med or high sec system.

Arguendo · Mar 4, 2018

UmbraRex said:
ATR needs, IMHO, some serious reworking.

First, they need to NOT be using ships available to players. They are the top end elite system security personnel. They need full on military grade ships. Yes, stuff players (pirates every one of em!) can't get.

Second, they need THE TOP END engineering, plus a smidgen.

Third, they need to deploy as wings and work together, not as a group of independent pilots. They need wings that are designed to work together to take out the best and the baddest criminals can throw at them.

And last, but not least, they need persistence. If the criminal low wakes, the existing wing should follow them, as well as call in reinforcements, following the criminal and interdicting them non stop until they high wake out. And following even then if to another med or high sec system.

That last two I can agree with for sure (except the "follow to another system" part).
The first two are debatable, to put it mildly. And if the last two points are worked correctly, there will be no need for the first two.