Sorry to hear of Elite Dangerous/Odyssey problems

I wanted to just post that I am sorry to hear of Elite Dangerous' recent problems, player's leaving, Frontier being criticised etc. It's a shame, but probably no great surprise to a lot of people who have followed the development of this much anticipated game since Kickstarter, experiencing the highs of the first ever Beta development when the great combat, flight and base mechanics were first released, the dashed hopes and tribulations of the lacklustre development, and the recent lows of Odyssey. I hope Frontier can somehow pull it around and produce the game a lot of people are still waiting for.

I haven't properly played the game for a few years myself, I keep coming back to it on occasion hoping that its changed enough to interest me but I never usually play more than a few hours before getting bored. Multiplayer gameplay certainly restricts what can be done with the game compared to the earlier Elite/Frontier/First Encounters gameplay I feel.

But there is great promise here in this game. I still believe that atmospheric planets could be the key - adding weather, gravity and manual landings, with proper landing communications and base operations such as face to face ordering of refuelling/rearming and meeting prospective clients. But what about enabling the ability to employ AI escort ships and play escort missions in fighters? Adding the ability to walk around ships and design the interior cabins, boarding operations, improve piracy and stealth/blockade running mechanics, adding much desired new classic ships like the Panther Clipper and the Saker- all of these things could raise the gameplay to a new level, show the players that Frontier actually care.

But Frontier don't seem to agree, they seem to be happy to constantly add new ways to do the same grinding game. That is a real shame and that will probably see the death of the game, if not now in a years time. What Frontier say and do over the next few months could be very telling. Their recent work plan was very uninspiring and vague, it does not give any indication that they have any intention of developing this game with any sort of renewed dedication, but rather just aim to make more easy money by expanding the present lacklustre gameplay into the console market.

It's all very disheartening to be fair, but it's not come as any real surprise. A lot of the older mature players probably, like myself, saw the writing on the wall even during the Kickstarter, Frontier were hardly forthcoming on what their plans were even then, resulting in the Kickstarter almost failing, and this lack of communication has continued throughout the games development. Will Frontier ever change and start to show some love to this game like they did in the early Beta development????
 
You're probably right to try locking your sister thread. It's kinda off topic. But why not ask a mod to push it into off-topic? Then we could keep on chatting there?
 
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IMHO It really depends on who truly controls the power to "allow" / or "drive" the development to be fully realised with the money and other resources, unlike in game perhaps there is too much pressure dare I say "power play" from other entities be it w*****s oops! sorry ;), bankers, share holders or from board room or inter department intrigue etc. It seems it needs enough drive and force of commitment to be able say to all departments and staff tell me what you really need, ENSURE it is made available for them, THEN give notice, NOW! Go make this the BEST AND UNEQUALLED GAME EVER! No crap, No excuse's, work it, play the dammed game in house if you have to until everyone sees and knows the game inside out. see's what we see and what the issues are; A game of this complexity and POTENTIAL should be lavished with resources, love and quality.
 
I wanted to just post that I am sorry to hear of Elite Dangerous' recent problems, player's leaving, Frontier being criticised etc. It's a shame, but probably no great surprise to a lot of people who have followed the development of this much anticipated game since Kickstarter, experiencing the highs of the first ever Beta development when the great combat, flight and base mechanics were first released, the dashed hopes and tribulations of the lacklustre development, and the recent lows of Odyssey. I hope Frontier can somehow pull it around and produce the game a lot of people are still waiting for.

I haven't properly played the game for a few years myself, I keep coming back to it on occasion hoping that its changed enough to interest me but I never usually play more than a few hours before getting bored. Multiplayer gameplay certainly restricts what can be done with the game compared to the earlier Elite/Frontier/First Encounters gameplay I feel.

But there is great promise here in this game. I still believe that atmospheric planets could be the key - adding weather, gravity and manual landings, with proper landing communications and base operations such as face to face ordering of refuelling/rearming and meeting prospective clients. But what about enabling the ability to employ AI escort ships and play escort missions in fighters? Adding the ability to walk around ships and design the interior cabins, boarding operations, improve piracy and stealth/blockade running mechanics, adding much desired new classic ships like the Panther Clipper and the Saker- all of these things could raise the gameplay to a new level, show the players that Frontier actually care.

But Frontier don't seem to agree, they seem to be happy to constantly add new ways to do the same grinding game. That is a real shame and that will probably see the death of the game, if not now in a years time. What Frontier say and do over the next few months could be very telling. Their recent work plan was very uninspiring and vague, it does not give any indication that they have any intention of developing this game with any sort of renewed dedication, but rather just aim to make more easy money by expanding the present lacklustre gameplay into the console market.

It's all very disheartening to be fair, but it's not come as any real surprise. A lot of the older mature players probably, like myself, saw the writing on the wall even during the Kickstarter, Frontier were hardly forthcoming on what their plans were even then, resulting in the Kickstarter almost failing, and this lack of communication has continued throughout the games development. Will Frontier ever change and start to show some love to this game like they did in the early Beta development????
I've been still looking for this mythical grinding in ED but have never found it.

My advice, is don't play to chase the carrot. You'll have much more fun.

As to Odyssey, it has a load of great gameplay added, again, grind is purely optional and a choice, just like the base game.

Yes it has some issues such as missions not working properly and the frames per second is not where it should be, and the planetary tech doesn't work at times.

But on the whole, it's a very solid expansion even with the issues. I'm having a great time with it.
 
I would still hold that ignoring parts of the game that are poorly designed doesn't make them good and certainly doesn't mean they don't exist. I'd also say that if you're not really engaging deeply with progression mechanics you won't find any issues with them and are definitely not "looking for the grind".
I don't think anyone is saying ignore parts of the game, but the thing is with ED, it's such a vast game, that you can ignore parts of the game and still get your money's worth. Many people just play to explore and don't touch CZs or go bounty hunting, and to me that's the beauty of the game.
 
I'd also say that if you're not really engaging deeply with progression mechanics you won't find any issues with them and are definitely not "looking for the grind".
"Engaging deeply with progression mechanics"?

This sounds another one of those 'mechanics' that are able to be interpreted in differing ways.

Let's say, for example, you are discussing engineering & ranks - I have probably 20+ fully G5 engineered ships, have elite in the 'main 3' professions and am Admiral & King.
Took 4 years to get there, it is true, but at no point was I 'grinding' for any of the 'achievements' or for engineering. Does this indicate I didn't "engage deeply" as it wasn't grindy?

Just curious as it is an amazing little phrase, I may even steal it for future use!
 
"Engaging deeply with progression mechanics"?

This sounds another one of those 'mechanics' that are able to be interpreted in differing ways.

Let's say, for example, you are discussing engineering & ranks - I have probably 20+ fully G5 engineered ships, have elite in the 'main 3' professions and am Admiral & King.
Took 4 years to get there, it is true, but at no point was I 'grinding' for any of the 'achievements' or for engineering. Does this indicate I didn't "engage deeply" as it wasn't grindy?

Just curious as it is an amazing little phrase, I may even steal it for future use!
I think the better argument here is that without dedicated grinding, it took you four years to achieve that. I don't think that's a reasonable timeframe for any gamer. I'm not saying things should be doable in mere hours, but I don't like ANY game near enough to play for your years just to accomplish a specific thing ingame.
 
I think the better argument here is that without dedicated grinding, it took you four years to achieve that. I don't think that's a reasonable timeframe for any gamer. I'm not saying things should be doable in mere hours, but I don't like ANY game near enough to play for your years just to accomplish a specific thing ingame.
Indeed, it took me that long, solely as I didn't have any real need to go any quicker. It is just a game, even elite combat is just 'meeting a number' - which is the 'accomplishment' that took longest - the remainder I'd 'completed' in considerably less time. Unsurprisingly, really, as ship combat - while fun enough - needs a stupid amount of kills to reach that 'elite' when one isn't particularly bothered in doing it. I think it perfectly reasonable for me, which is the important bit, surely?

Incidentally, I have been playing for so long as I've been having fun, not 'chasing accomplishments', doing things that amuse me.

I agree that you may find taking your time and smelling the roses along the way a total waste of time. As long as both of us are enjoying the journey that is all that matters. ;)

ETA: Of course, now I'm having a ball playing ground-based 'stuff' in Odyssey - thank goodness I'd already got the 'big 3' elite titles behind me, had I not I could have been talking 5 years or more!
 
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I don't think anyone is saying ignore parts of the game, but the thing is with ED, it's such a vast game, that you can ignore parts of the game and still get your money's worth. Many people just play to explore and don't touch CZs or go bounty hunting, and to me that's the beauty of the game.
And that works great unless that's the game's biggest draw for you. Which is the point, saying you looked for the grond and can't find it seems like you're, probably unintentionally, throwing it in the face of those who are doing things with clear and direct engineering benefits. Or worse, it very well could be interpreted as "I didn't find it (therefore it doesn't exist and all complaints are invalid)."
"Engaging deeply with progression mechanics"?

This sounds another one of those 'mechanics' that are able to be interpreted in differing ways.

Let's say, for example, you are discussing engineering & ranks - I have probably 20+ fully G5 engineered ships, have elite in the 'main 3' professions and am Admiral & King.
Took 4 years to get there, it is true, but at no point was I 'grinding' for any of the 'achievements' or for engineering. Does this indicate I didn't "engage deeply" as it wasn't grindy?

Just curious as it is an amazing little phrase, I may even steal it for future use!
Stumbling through the game with your cargo scoop open will eventually lead to everything being unlocked and obtainable, yes. But Max and I have crossed words before and his advice tends to boil down to "play in a way that does without until you stumble into it."

Seems you follow the same logic from what you wrote so probably the answer would be yes, you have engaged with the upgrades but no you didn't engage with making full use of the gathering and unlock systems and that's why it took 4 years. Because if you are trying to more aggressively take advantage of those systems it's doable in far less time. It would also mean that whatever you did do without grinding proves the paired point of how unnecessarily time inflated these processes are.

Things have gotten far better than they were though. Which I can't help but interpret as FDev conceding how bad some of the mechanics have been.
 
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And that works great unless that's the game's biggest draw for you. Which is the point, saying you looked for the grind and can't find it seems like you're, probably unintentionally, throwing it in the face of those who are doing things with clear and direct engineering benefits. Or worse, it very well could be interpreted as "I didn't find it (therefore it doesn't exist and all complaints are invalid)."
Good god. The only grind in ED is the grind you bring with you.

I have plenty of engineered ships, and guess what, I have not had to grind anything to get those enginnered modules. Grind is a choice in this game. Sure , if someone wants to grind to get something ASAP, then knock yourself out. But they don't have a right to moan about it when they have have chosen to grind out gameplay themselves.

It's a choice, not a requirement.

And no, you do not forgo any gameplay by not grinding out mechanics, unless you are only into PvP, but as the game isn't a PvP centric game, I see no reason why it should be balanced around such people.
 
Good god. The only grind in ED is the grind you bring with you.
I didn't create the engineering system. I didn't bring it with me either. So that can't be right.

Systems are, or at least should be, meant to be used and pursued, not just eventually fallen into. Why would you design an incredibly beneficial system with the intent to have people not use it then rebalance parts of game content around having it?

Also, the game not being completely PvP centric shouldn't be an excuse to screw over PvP dynamics because open PvP is still a function the game supports.
 
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