Info on Thermal Conduit effect.

Pigletslastand

Pigletslastand
Let's keep this discussion to the TC issue at hand. I agree that TC should not be applied BEFORE you hit 100% heat on your ship and that should be fixed.. There is such a fine line between builds that if you nerf TC even slightly you just make everyone run rail build instead and we move into an era of point and click which to my mind would be horrid. If they do introduce the sliding scale I believe that would be fair but it may already just make enough people decide to switch.

Personally I think they should introduce at a level like was mentioned but with a review after 3-6 months. It will become clear if the community at large is happy with the change or not. Balancing issues really need a high degree of community involvement as the tolerences between making something totally OP and totally useless are very fine.

Far more important to overall balance is the fact that hulltanks have almost entirely got shafted by the shield meta but that's a discussion for another day.
 

TEBORI

TEBORI
hmm constructive post i partially agree @Pigletslastand

why do you think there is so big threat for rail meta. flying 4 rails in combination with a heavy prisma build FDL is no fun and i dont think all will become super aces and fly close orbit with srb rails either.
even with 3 rails it stays tricky on the power distributor.
if they change for heatsinks, to keep the rails happy, they loose a lot of HP defense and if they go for bi weave or even hull tank all the disadvantages kick in.

atm one just loads his wep distributor changes to pips for shields and engines aligns the shot and relaeases the devastating plasma volley then rinse and repeat.
Rails need much higher time on target therefor a lot more time in the wep distributor.
did you fly 4 rails on a prisma build when you are also under attack. i did, a lot and its not a walk in the park if you want to keep energy in shields and also keep the pressure on the opponent.
 

StellarKnight

S
Rails are easy to learn and hull tanks get shattered because it is dead easy to ram them with a FDL in 1v1s! Also they are not an option in wing fights because of heavy duty shield boosters stacking and the ridiculous MJs that it achieves. It just that they have so much lower health pool compared to a stacked shield tank.

We are speaking about the weapon requiring most skill to use -> Plasma Accelerators. On top of that you add another layer to keep the ship hot in acceptable levels - between 100-160 in order to apply it consistently, otherwise sensors/life support/thrusters burn down:
  • you need to be able to tail your target - jousting or reversing does not work;
  • you need to be able to shoot often - requires a lot of mental capacity to keep the WEP pips charged

Why shouldn't the hardest weapon to use be the best damage dealer?
 

Pigletslastand

Pigletslastand
Rails are unavoidable once the person is within range. Do you really want all the best range controllers in the game to suddenly switch from Plasma builds to something you will not be able to dodge?

Plasma is not as simple to land as you make it sound. It actually requires similar levels of range control, the differnce being that it can miss. It takes quite a decent amount of skill to use. Everyone under focus has very similar problems in not being able to output damage. If you want to bring other weapons into viability you have to be very careful as I believe rails and plasma are quite close in effectiveness at the moment.

I can agree with you that heat shouldn't be applied before a shot is taken and I would be ok with them introducing a sliding scale on the damage buff but again.. it would need to be done without a heavy hand.
 

TEBORI

TEBORI
I can agree with you that heat shouldn't be applied before a shot is taken and I would be ok with them introducing a sliding scale on the damage buff but again.. it would need to be done without a heavy hand.
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we have a consensus here nice
@Pigletslastand

one can dodge rails by staying close. for the difference of what one hears about me i am flying long range rails BUT with a close range style from 500 to 2.5 km building mainly on my evasion and orbit technics.
and there are effective counters atm against long range rails spammers.
i am not really worried if some veterans change to (srb) rails.
 

CaptainPugwash

CaptainPugwash
Pigletslastand said:
Apparently the heat being applied to the shileds used to be compounded by however many ships were in instance.. a fun bug! But yeah.. if they made it a sliding scale I think it would be perfect because the balance of the meta is extremely fine.. If they make TC useless by nerfing it more than that ..everyone will just use quad rails
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+1 for the sliding scale.
 

TEBORI

TEBORI
Legendary Keks said:
So we all admit that the bug that tc applies to the shot that just has been fired is crap. But we also all agree that i nerv would change the meta to rails and we all agree that a rail meta would be bad. Right?
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no!
this change in combination is also badly needed
linear increase of the outgoing damage from 101% and the increase of the damage was limited to a maximum of 30% at a very high heat level (about 150%) of the firing ship.
so
1) no more triggering of TC if the ship is not over 100% related to the shot of the very first plasma weapon
2) no more static buff to 60% from 101%
 

TEBORI

TEBORI
Legendary Keks said:
Do you want a 1v1 this evening with a ship of your choice?
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yeah if you agree we check your bandwith first, the really deciding fact in elite pvp is the network and not the skill.
so in case you are fine we both run a software which monitors our bandwith to the game during the fight then i am happy to fight you cause it will be challanging and fun.

but as @Pigletslastand stated we should stick to the topic.
 

Pigletslastand

Pigletslastand
Hulltanks are in a dire state thanks to other factors. Let's keep this discussion civil and on topic. We are quite close to consesus and do not need to attack one another's abilities. Akuma will obviously plump for a rail meta because that's what he wants, others will plump for their side which is opposite, from my own observations there are more that would dislike a rail meta than the current just from listening to alllll the convos on the subject for a long time.
 

TEBORI

TEBORI
Akuma will obviously plump for a rail meta because that's what he wants
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@Pigletslastand
i gracefully disagree and i dont want a rail meta. i would like to see many different builds and options coming back in organic pvp.
but in addition i dont think a rail meta will come in wide scale. or in other words not everyone who flies a meta plasma tc fdl now will change to (srb) rails.
 

Pigletslastand

Pigletslastand
TEBORI said:
@Pigletslastand
i gracefully disagree and i dont want a rail meta. i would like to see many different builds and options coming back in organic pvp.
but in addition i dont think a rail meta will come in wide scale. or in other words not everyone who flies a meta plasma tc fdl now will change to (srb) rails.
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It's so finely balanced that that would be the next logical meta if TC gets nerfed in any way more than we mentioned. As it is there are quite a few rail builds running around right now so maybe we could argue it's already balanced?

The bug of the heat being applied before the shot needs to go though!
 

TEBORI

TEBORI
Pigletslastand said:
It's so finely balanced that that would be the next logical meta if TC gets nerfed in any way more than we mentioned. As it is there are quite a few rail builds running around right now so maybe we could argue it's already balanced?

The bug of the heat being applied before the shot needs to go though!
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i am afraid not as long as the heat system is not reworked and i dont see this coming shortly. one has no problem to constantly overheat his ship to get the 60% buff on every volley without having problematic penalties at all.
so imho the damage increase has to be changed as well.
 
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