Game Bashing On Steam

[Sublime]

The sad thing is that it's much better than Horizons today und runs well even on crap hardware again, but it will never get away from those 30ish percent Steam reviews again I guess.

And that might kill it in the end.

O7,

It is arguably not, and it most certainly does not, not compared to Horizons.

 

[Jack Winter]

I really like some reviews on amazon, some people write what a bad experience they had and give a good rating, while others praise the product and give a low rating... Shrug, people are strange sometimes...

 

[Sublime]

Well, sims are often like that. In FS you just kinda fly around with no gameloops at all. In Assetto Corsa you just drive around.

If that stuff is not your thing, that's cool though. But that is indeed just that, your opinion. ED offers quite a few things to do, and many spend easily hundreds of hours until they get bored. Is that enough? Your call.

My argument to that would be that simulators like FS strive to be as realistic as possible, so while there is a lack of gameloops, they are heavy on the content related to the simulation itself. This may be boring to some people but to fans of the simulation, it provides a ton of content and challenges for those looking for that realistic simulation experience.

ED by comparison is very light on the simulation factor, probably closer to an arcade game than a simulation. Even the flight model, for all the praise it receives, while fun, is nowhere near a simulation. Pretty much none of the challenges and hazards of space travel (even as we understand them today) are represented.

Take exploration for example. There are 400 odd billion star systems to explore, and they are all the same. None of them offer any challenges or risks, no survivability factors. There are only 2 things to worry about: overheating from a star, and planet gravity. Okay maybe running out of fuel if you’re not remotely careful is a 3rd risk.

Out of those things, overheating from stars is something one faces with every single jump, which is then mastered very quickly and pretty much discounted after that. There are no radiation or environmental dangers, no supplies to take into account, ship parts and equipment to worry about degrading, etc.

So it’s a simulation that’s missing much of the content that someone would expect to find in a simulation, and it’s also an arcade game (and now an arena FPS) lacking content and features expected in modern equivalents.

I can also mention the EDO visuals and performance compared to other games, but that’s a whole other story.

 

[babelfisch]

I also suspect that most people want to be positively biased about any game they purchase. If someone pays what is to them a non trivial amount of money for something, having it turn out foul just out of the gate is a trigger for regret, if the game is that bad it was your mistake. A majority of the positive reviews all talk about future positivity, so you can see this in action. Odd is priced more than a bad coffee so this probably in effect there.

Anyway Just engineered a second beluga on this cmdr after coming back from an exploration trip, this beluga for vip missions. Might even need a third for bulk economy. Always liked the space game. I haven't been mining in a while.. that's on the list too. I did burn myself out pre carriers on that so hopefully. And to think i was about to quit again. The trick is to not do anything else while playing elite. No podcasts, no audio books, just the game. Magic comes back.

Od(d)yssey costs less than I spent on an average meal for me and my wife. And that only lasts for a few hours... I just bought AC Unity because apparantly it should be a good (and it did cost less than a coffee) but I didn't want to play it for more than a few hours. If I would give out bad reviews for games I don't like to play - for me AC wasn't even worth a coffee - I probabaly should give it a bad review. But I don't because I realise that I just bought the wrong game and the reason I got it so cheap was because I already knew I wouldn't like it. Still, it's a good game that I don't like, while Odyssey probably is a bad game that I do like. So which one deserves a bad review? The game that isn't even worth €3,50 but gets good reviews or the game that costs €35 and which I am playing since 2014? I guess the truth is that we aren't reviewing the game, we are reviewing our expectations and hopes. And all the mediocre games (which, in my opinion is just almost every modern game) just have better chances with that. In the end, it probably is positive that reviews for the game are negative, because the masses just aren't known for good taste. Dead Man is a better movie than The Avengers and I guess I am pretty much alone with that as well.

 

[BigBANGtheory [VR]]

So it’s a simulation that’s missing much of the content that someone would expect to find in a simulation, and it’s also an arcade game (and now an arena FPS) lacking content and features expected in modern equivalents.

I can also mention the EDO visuals and performance compared to other games, but that’s a whole other story.

thing is some people on this forum only play ED and are completely oblivious to the world outside, its genuinely tough to get through to them folk. Maybe we can use short-wave radio?

 

[CMDR Harada]

Thank you too! Willfull, ignorant, trolling the community, blind, can't really cut it. Something else? At least you didn't write 'Latin' in lowercase. Wish you a very nice day too!

EDIT: All this from a dude who doesn't even own the game, btw, but judges from hearsay. Prove me wrong

O7,

You know... you got a point. Tonight I purchased Oddy.. played for an hour, CTD'd twice, and then requested a refund. Left a bad review too...

Happy now ?

 

[Banana's_Are_Good_For_You]

thing is some people on this forum only play ED and are completely oblivious to the world outside, its genuinely tough to get through to them folk. Maybe we can use short-wave radio?

Have you tried poking them with a stick?
I wouldn't expect a positive reaction though.

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

I agree that there's probably bias among people who have a game to be positive about it. But there's also bias among people who don't have a game to be negative. I've seen more and more of that in recent times.

I think if people can halfway run it, and they liked the game before, it's OK. But otherwise, it's real bad. So it's a case of one side having stronger feelings than the other. The positive side is going "yeah, it's OK", while on the negative side it's basically like mortal enemies.

I think the feeling for prior elite fans who didn't buy odyssey is more dodging a bullet than hate. If you like the game enough, having your thousands of hours and all your personal connection being just erased to nothing because of unable software is not a nice prospect.

The only "revenge" lead an average player has with elite is 1) Getting told your valid concern is invalid / being replied to in a rude, condescending way by a forum white knight. 2) Being exposed to community management messaging claiming a level of high regard and untouchability that isn't matched by the software. Thats it. The rest of the contact with the game is generally enjoyable experience. I think this would extend to reviews as well.

I do see some strong correlation between the "people can run it" score. At the core of the results, maybe its also displaying the real system stats of people who play elite. Not considering any technical fault of misleading system requirements. If the system requirements were 2060 4gb vram minimum / 2070 recommended, maybe people who couldn't run the game wouldn't buy it and the ratio would be the other way around.

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

Still, it's a good game that I don't like, while Odyssey probably is a bad game that I do like.

Well thats the difference in expectation isn't it. When you hear feedback different to your own, its a fairly assumption that its coming from players who still enjoy the game, but lack the "wanting to like it" element. Without an inherent want ontop of the software itself, the game itself has to do more before being worthy of promotion or defense. Its fair that just existence is enough for you, but not for me. My personal values that i project onto elite are probably "mutual respect" rather than "personal desire", so that explains all my text.

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

So it’s a simulation that’s missing much of the content that someone would expect to find in a simulation, and it’s also an arcade game (and now an arena FPS) lacking content and features expected in modern equivalents.

I think the only way to look at elite to be positive is very specific, in the low budget indie arcade simulator category. All the games on steam with the same font often used in the titles. Thats the only stable elite can claim full feature support in, yet because there's always been an undercurrent of larger company involved, somehow elite has added another later of frills and depth that push it to the top of the category.

The moment to try to promote elite to a mechanical A tier (up from b grade) it doesn't review well imo. In the b category its above average, excellent, shining star, worthy recommendation.

 

[Ian Skippy]

You know... you got a point. Tonight I purchased Oddy.. played for an hour, CTD'd twice, and then requested a refund. Left a bad review too...

Happy now ?

Honestly, of all the possible criticisms one can have "crashing twice within the hour" suggests either outdated drivers or 'creative writing'. EDO has performance issues, but it's pretty stable. I've had pretty much no crashes in any version outside of patch day. Also, you can't refund a dlc if you played the main game more than two hours, typically.

It ain't my problem, but it seems you are mostly trying to win an internet argument with him rather than genuinely care how EDO is. I would recommend spending your time on more enjoyable things instead. EDO or otherwise.

 

[Soon(TM)]

The original intention of the base game was to recreate the original 1984 game Elite with updated graphics and gameplay. In my opinion, they managed that.
Is the base game worth £15/20, definitely.

Are the expansions or Oddyssey worth the used toilet paper you wiped your butt with, HECK NO.

Steam reviews accurately reflect ED and its expansions IMO, the base game is passable, the expansions are embarrasing.

 

[TiberiusDuval]

Take exploration for example. There are 400 odd billion star systems to explore, and they are all the same. None of them offer any challenges or risks, no survivability factors. There are only 2 things to worry about: overheating from a star, and planet gravity. Okay maybe running out of fuel if you’re not remotely careful is a 3rd risk.

Out of those things, overheating from stars is something one faces with every single jump, which is then mastered very quickly and pretty much discounted after that. There are no radiation or environmental dangers, no supplies to take into account, ship parts and equipment to worry about degrading, etc.

So it’s a simulation that’s missing much of the content that someone would expect to find in a simulation, and it’s also an arcade game (and now an arena FPS) lacking content and features expected in modern equivalents.

I can also mention the EDO visuals and performance compared to other games, but that’s a whole other story.

Lets consider this. Most of Elite's ships have those nice shields (which are kind of magic, but common scifi trope). What they do? Well they are capable of stopping very very intense concentrated EM energy, kinetic energy and so on. Apart from stuff near neutron stars or black holes, nothing in nature would produce energies intense enough to actually punch through. Certainly not any typical common star. Only thing added danger mechanics would do is making game more tedious to play.

 

[Peter Mannion]

I can't even begin to explain how frustrating the viewpoint OP has shared is. This sort of mindset is one of the reasons why the quality in the gaming industry is in the toilet. The game bashing on steam is entirely justified. When you pay $40 for a product that isn't marketed as early access, you expect a level of polish associated with a fully released title. We received a game that essentially was in a state of early access, it couldn't run on recommended hardware, charging full price and the OP questions why there is negative reviews on steam ...

Idk whether OP understands anything about software development, but what usually happens is that you at least polish the software to a point where it is in an acceptable state for release. You don't just craft the software, skip any form of refinement and bug fixing and go straight to release. I bet you think the criticisms for CP2077 and BF2042 are also unjustified. Its a new trend in the gaming industry for devs to just produce low quality products for game franchises because the market audience is already established and will likely buy the game anyway. Unless people voice their opinions through reviews and make it clear when their software is garbage, they won't change and we will keep getting served poor quality products for the franchises we love. I highly doubt CDPR will ever release a game in as bad a state CP got released in, and I hope that Frontier will never release a game/expansion in the state Odyssey was in as the backlash, the negative reviews and the media criticism has hurt potential sales considerably.

 

[Erei]

I can't even begin to explain how frustrating the viewpoint OP has shared is. This sort of mindset is one of the reasons why the quality in the gaming industry is in the toilet. The game bashing on steam is entirely justified. When you pay $40 for a product that isn't marketed as early access, you expect a level of polish associated with a fully released title. We received a game that essentially was in a state of early access, it couldn't run on recommended hardware, charging full price and the OP questions why there is negative reviews on steam ...

Idk whether OP understands anything about software development, but what usually happens is that you at least polish the software to a point where it is in an acceptable state for release. You don't just craft the software, skip any form of refinement and bug fixing and go straight to release. I bet you think the criticisms for CP2077 and BF2042 are also unjustified. Its a new trend in the gaming industry for devs to just produce low quality products for game franchises because the market audience is already established and will likely buy the game anyway. Unless people voice their opinions through reviews and make it clear when their software is garbage, they won't change and we will keep getting served poor quality products for the franchises we love. I highly doubt CDPR will ever release a game in as bad a state CP got released in, and I hope that Frontier will never release a game/expansion in the state Odyssey was in as the backlash, the negative reviews and the media criticism has hurt potential sales considerably.

I only had minor glitches (graphical) with CP77 release. A few crash or bugs here and there but not much. It was annoying, but they worked REALLY hard on it ever since. Balance is still meh, but hopefully they can work on it now that most critical issues have been fixed. Performance was always very good to.
CDprojekt have an amazing track record when it comes to doing things right and free content. Witcher 3 was a buggy mess at launch, now it's a classic.

Elden Ring right now have FPS issues on PC, and it still acclaimed.

The issue was not so much how bad it was, I mean, it was really bad. But even behind the performance, it was lacklustre. It still is. CP77 and ER both are good game at their core. They have their flaws, sure, and maybe some issues here and there, but the core is solid.
The only thing I think Odyssey really add to the game is the exobiology. The FPS aspect of it is a cheap thing slapped on it.

 

[d8veh]

Wait, so are we officially concluding that odd has killed elite? I'm playing horizons so becoming oblivious to it all.

The other thing about those steam numbers is if you mouse over the reviews, its 76 reviews in 30 days. So even at the generous end of possibility, they're only selling a few copies of odd per day, probably not enough to pay for for brabes PA. Odd has also caused frontier to give up on consoles (which comes with people who buy every cosmetic in the store and are content creators) and frontiers stock price etc.

Hmmm....

(ps. Okay i did try 11.1 today. From having about 10-15 hours in horizons this week, overwhelming impression was odd is just unfinished software, shouldn't be spending time on it.. seems wrong)

The problem is that the few enthusiastic players playing Horizons doesn't bring in money. We're likely to become an extinct species in the not too distant future. Already, all the friends I used to play with have stopped, and I only play occasionally now. Many large player groups are reporting that their groups have been decimented. The forum used to be vibrant. Look at the newcomers section - about 2 new posts per day on average, while as a few years ago, every time you clicked on it, there would be new posts.

 

[Reggit]

There is a difference between a rant, and constructive criticism.
....Then again, we're on the internet - and if you don't have a 'thick skin', it's just a matter of time before someone somewhere offends you.
Take everything with a pinch of salt - life is too short to stress over video games - we'll see what happens with FDev going forwards.
(In the meantime - I'm still enjoying Elite! )

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

The problem is that the few enthusiastic players playing Horizons doesn't bring in money. We're likely to become an extinct species in the not too distant future. Already, all the friends I used to play with have stopped, and I only play occasionally now. Many large player groups are reporting that their groups have been decimented. The forum used to be vibrant. Look at the newcomers section - about 2 new posts per day on average, while as a few years ago, every time you clicked on it, there would be new posts.

Yeah. You can see 2 days worth in dd now now, never used to be the case.

We will just have to watch i guess.

Not sure what the general playerbase needs, but odd turning into a no mans sky... Im guessing if they gave up on consoles for the longevity of elite, its certainly a skeleton crew now until one of the other games adds more fat to frontier and they can try again? Yes you have to wonder about the alternate reality of david brabens dream actually being elite rather than frontier the publisher and how that would have gone.

 

[Greasetrap42]

There is a difference between a rant, and constructive criticism.

This thread is about game reviews.

When reviewing any product it is not necessary to include constructive criticism. Usually reviews consist of things found good or bad. Whether its a game, restaurant, movie, whatever. Sometimes people slip in "it would have been better if...". But in my experience reviews are just that.... they review the product. Sometimes that might be just a simple score or brief statement.

Passionate consumers that are highly frustrated or disappointed will rant, usually comprising a list of items that they thought bad. I think it is normal in internet or real world. If listened to rants can be a form of useful feedback. It clearly indicates someone was frustrated with a product or service. Someone was unhappy.


Edit: clarification. Obviously lots of reviews are awful because they are just garbage. fake reviews, click farms, etc. We all know internet reviews can be very unreliable. Just sayin passionate rants from actual frustrated customers is good feedback.

 

[William J Smith]

(In the meantime - I'm still enjoying Elite! )

STOP THAT we're not here to enjoy Elite

Seriously though, while we're in the 'bash elite/fdev' sort of thing... how many here still play seriously... say 7 hrs a week...


Bill

<<<currently a mindless monday zombie