To Solo Play Players: If You Could Disable PVP, Would You Play in Open Play Mode Instead?

[Robert Maynard]

I think we're discussing a fundamental conflict between good game design and the pressures of modern game communities in MMOs, who generally have no idea what good game design even means. They only know what they want, and that is plentiful and very diverse. Developers then have to try to balance all these different desires with something that still looks at least halfway like a game. The result is all too visible.

It would seem that Frontier were well aware that players have different wants before they pitched the game - as they chose to make other players (and therefore PvP) entirely optional without being asked.

 

[Alaska Sædelære]

You can roleplay an armchair psychologist on a public forum about other people's intentions and motivations in a video game, but it's uttely pointless because other people's intentions and motivations are totally beyond your control (and frankly it's not even your business).

What you can control is your own actions within the rules and mechanics of the video game in question.

This is just a truckload of hypocrisy. You were informed about other peoples' own intentions and motivations that -you- had dismissed as non-existent immediately before. They don't go away just because you say so, exactly as you say. That may be a tad convoluted to grok.

 

[Kamiyoda]

Solo mode offers a roll that a pure open only game can never provide.

The submarine.

 

[galahad2069]

This is just a truckload of hypocrisy. You were informed about other peoples' own intentions and motivations that -you- had dismissed as non-existent immediately before. They don't go away just because you say so, exactly as you say. That may be a tad convoluted to grok.

I'm not sure what made you think I dismissed other people's intentions and motivations as nonexistent - I was only talking about them being beyond your control, therefore irrelevant. Other players absolutely have intentions and motivations, I never denied that, it's just that they're none of your business, to put it bluntly.

I'm not really sure about your intentions and motivations here either, but you seem to be pretty upset to be honest. You want to talk about it, or you just want to blow up my pixel spaceship? Go for it buddy if you want, the rules of the game totally allow it, good luck.

 

[Brrokk]

Of course they are aware of this, and I don't want to speculate now whether they did it out of pure altruism or rather out of economic necessity. What I'm saying, and of course this is a very subjective and personal point of view, is that I've learned to appreciate the more niche game concepts that only benefit a very dedicated and relatively small community of players. From that standpoint, it's hard to see how this concept of "satisfying everyone equally" could ever lead to a compelling game. That such an attempt is possible at all is only imaginable in the world of games. Imagine something like this in the sports world, where you cram a mixture of soccer, tennis, and basketball into a single game. To be honest, such a thing actually exists in the form of a mixture of boxing and chess. But see for yourself how popular this promenade mixture actually is.

As a rule, it's much better to make a clear decision and know what you want, and then follow through. Not this wishy-washy that ends up satisfying no one completely.

Why do you think this game satisfies no-one completely? I think it's great. (I play solely PvE). I've read PvP players saying that the flight model is the best ever for combat and heard about their Discords for organising, so I'd count them as satisfied too.

As I see it there's only one group of players who aren't happy: the ones who want to affect others' play and can't. That's what we keep seeing in all these threads. Here, I think FD have made the right decision (although implemented it in a clunky way, leaving the provision of PvE play to a private group).

 

[Andy13460]

Hell 54 pages on the usual subject of I want to play in open and not get shot at unless I say it's ok. For a start lets break it down to you are mainly going to get shot at in probably Deciat, Shin, San Tu and the CG wherever it is. I do PVP organic and the odd organised though personally I'm not a great fan of the organised as it's mainly wing fights. I do PVE and have a few friends in Mobius that I often see doing the combat CG's & wing up with. (That would be the Eurasia group) When I used to explore with others in the beginning we used the FleetComm group. I've done the guardian sites with others in Fleetcomm when we were doing guardian boosters. For the life of me I'm trying to think what your all going to do with each other in a none combat open world that cant be done in a group. Or is it you just don't like that feeling of been destroyed by someone in another ship if it's a human but your ok with AI sending you to the rebuy screen? Or thats the feeling I get. These sort of post's actually make me want to shoot the first hollow square I see usually. If your not in Open in the above systems your chances of getting shot at are slim, maybe add sol to that list. How many safe systems do you all want?

 

[Brrokk]

Hell 54 pages on the usual subject of I want to play in open and not get shot at unless I say it's ok. For a start lets break it down to you are mainly going to get shot at in probably Deciat, Shin, San Tu and the CG wherever it is. I do PVP organic and the odd organised though personally I'm not a great fan of the organised as it's mainly wing fights. I do PVE and have a few friends in Mobius that I often see doing the combat CG's & wing up with. (That would be the Eurasia group) When I used to explore with others in the beginning we used the FleetComm group. I've done the guardian sites with others in Fleetcomm when we were doing guardian boosters. For the life of me I'm trying to think what your all going to do with each other in a none combat open world that cant be done in a group. Or is it you just don't like that feeling of been destroyed by someone in another ship if it's a human but your ok with AI sending you to the rebuy screen? Or thats the feeling I get. These sort of post's actually make me want to shoot the first hollow square I see usually. If your not in Open in the above systems your chances of getting shot at are slim, maybe add sol to that list. How many safe systems do you all want?

The thread title poses the question "to Solo players". Best not to ask the question if we're not going to like the answers.

 

[Rebel Yell]

Hell 54 pages on the usual subject of I want to play in open and not get shot at unless I say it's ok. For a start lets break it down to you are mainly going to get shot at in probably Deciat, Shin, San Tu and the CG wherever it is. I do PVP organic and the odd organised though personally I'm not a great fan of the organised as it's mainly wing fights. I do PVE and have a few friends in Mobius that I often see doing the combat CG's & wing up with. (That would be the Eurasia group) When I used to explore with others in the beginning we used the FleetComm group. I've done the guardian sites with others in Fleetcomm when we were doing guardian boosters. For the life of me I'm trying to think what your all going to do with each other in a none combat open world that cant be done in a group. Or is it you just don't like that feeling of been destroyed by someone in another ship if it's a human but your ok with AI sending you to the rebuy screen? Or thats the feeling I get. These sort of post's actually make me want to shoot the first hollow square I see usually. If your not in Open in the above systems your chances of getting shot at are slim, maybe add sol to that list. How many safe systems do you all want?

It's like speaking about kids learning to ride a bike without side wheels... some one's been hurt for a bruise and never wanted to ride a bike again, some one else didn't mind about the scratch on the knee and tried again until he learnt to ride. And yeah... "being blown up by a pirate NPC whilst afk" results in a "awww, oh nooo... let me do it again" whilst if it happens of being disintegrated by a random plasma-FDL player reults is "** ! !!! ****!".

 

[Andy13460]

Most gankers don't care about the rebuy screen. They certainly don't feel dominated by it.

Most gankers have learnt to avoid the rebuy screen even when a wing of SPEAR drops in. But you are correct when they are off doing PVP wing or 1v1's they could end up with several rebuys for each session. Hell a load of us spent weeks on a carrier in the summer just killing each other every stop. I would say a lot went over 1/2 a billion or more in rebuys

 

[Andy13460]

Yeah, I've never encountered another player in it. I'd say only a tiny fraction are online regularly. (The number is for total members, not those currently active)

So Do you do CG's? I see MOBIUS players at every combat CG. I'm UK time and on PC. There are 4 people on my friend list that never play in any other mode ever.

 

[TiberiusDuval]

It's like speaking about kids learning to ride a bike without side wheels... some one's been hurt for a bruise and never wanted to ride a bike again, some one else didn't mind about the scratch on the knee and tried again until he learnt to ride. And yeah... "being blown up by a pirate NPC whilst afk" results in a "awww, oh nooo... let me do it again" whilst if it happens of being disintegrated by a random plasma-FDL player reults is "** ! !!! ****!".

There is one big difference. Pirate NPC attacks only if you have something to pirate. Ganker does not care about that. Meaning say I deliver exploration data, NPC just may interdict me, and come to conclusion nothing interesting here, and leave me be. Ganker would not. Ganker breaks immersion.

 

[Rebel Yell]

There is one big difference. Pirate NPC attacks only if you have something to pirate. Ganker does not care about that. Meaning say I deliver exploration data, NPC just may interdict me, and come to conclusion nothing interesting here, and leave me be. Ganker would not. Ganker breaks immersion.

There's no difference at all... both have the same right to blow up the ship (as the game allows it).

And also, no need to remark that delivering data has potential non-interactive PvP consequences, something an NPC can't be aware of.

 

[Brrokk]

There's no difference at all... both have the same right to blow up the ship (as the game allows it).

And also, no need to remark that delivering data has potential non-interactive PvP consequences, something an NPC can't be aware of.

You know, I'm getting very tired of that deflection.

Yes, "the game allows it". Fine, blaze your own trail, explode whatever you like, have fun. No-one cares enough to dispute this; I hope you have a good time.

But that's not the source of the salt or the reason for all these threads. The other side of the coin is that the game also allows other people to choose not to play with you. This is also by design.

Check the title again. These interminable threads aren't created by people wanting to restrict PvP. They're all started by people who want others to move from Solo to Open and be available for exploding.

"The game allows it" works both ways, by design.

 

[Robert Maynard]

"The game allows it" works both ways, by design.

Quite - which includes delayed menu exit and the block feature, the mode shared galaxy that every player affects, as well as the ability to shoot at anything one instances with.

That some accept the last of these while rejecting one or more of the first three is neither here nor there.

 

[Andy13460]

.

 

[Andy13460]

I'm under the impression that a lot of people, including myself, prefer to play Solo mode all the time, not because we don't want to play with others, but simply because we don't want to PVP others. Is how this 55 page now post started. Open is called open for a reason. Elite at least gives you menu log and block. If you really don't like getting shot at go and play in Mobius or Fleetcomm. Leave all the others that like open for whatever encounters they have good or bad to get on with it. Or just stay out of open in the usual hot spots. I see new learner gankers every day in Deciat. I also see lots there just for the danger and the fun of escape. I see people go there just to fight SPEAR. These are all interactions between people in open. As far as I know there are to physical methods of initiating interaction in this game, the chat system and interdiction. You have the chat in all modes.

 

[Vedmo]

Most could be confused for AI chatterbots, afflicted with various unflattering -isms, if it were not for their ability to cheat in ways that blatantly break the fourth wall.

Beautiful sentence, thanks!

The actual problem is the failure of a certain faction to recognize that (which fulfills the scientific definition of psychopathy, the inability to have empathy), or otherwise an even greater pleasure felt by a killer knowingly exercising their dominance over an unconsenting subject. Because if they had entered battle with consent, it would not be as interesting.

Clicking on OPEN is consenting to human interaction in the game, regardless of your opinion of or desire for whatever form it takes, so long as is remains within Frontier’s rules. There is no such thing as an “unconsenting subject” in regards to PvP combat in open.

Can you give us a psychological profile on those who expect others to play by the rules of a personally defined reality known only to them?

 

[Brrokk]

Beautiful sentence, thanks!

Clicking on OPEN is consenting to human interaction in the game, regardless of your opinion of or desire for whatever form it takes, so long as is remains within Frontier’s rules. There is no such thing as an “unconsenting subject” in regards to PvP combat in open.

Can you give us a psychological profile on those who expect others to play by the rules of a personally defined reality known only to them?

Yeah, same again. We know what Open is. No-one is disagreeing. Look around you: the complaints aren't coming from gank victims. They're from people who want everyone herded into Open. Can't we just accept that the game has three modes and anyone can use whatever mode they like, and stop growing these ridiculous threads?

 

[Helvellyn]

Beautiful sentence, thanks!

Clicking on OPEN is consenting to human interaction in the game, regardless of your opinion of or desire for whatever form it takes, so long as is remains within Frontier’s rules. There is no such thing as an “unconsenting subject” in regards to PvP combat in open.

Can you give us a psychological profile on those who expect others to play by the rules of a personally defined reality known only to them?

OK then put it another way. Some people are jerks. Being a jerk in the game isn't against the rules (well from the shooting perspective, I'm guessing being abusive in chat is). Quite a lot of other people aren't interested in playing with jerks, so they play in Solo instead.

 

[Ettanin]

Quite a lot of other people aren't interested in playing with jerks, so they play in Solo instead.

Which leaves a bitter aftertaste considering a playerbase unwanted by a larger group of player holds multiplayer hostage...

Only because FDev hasn't figured out a proper way to provide MP with randoms without PvP. (Hint: A much smaller studio named Hello Games actually managed to do it)