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Thread: Here's a topic no one likes to talk about, even though it's a constant problem. Griefers.

  1. #226
    Originally Posted by courperationX View Post (Source)
    Someone plays Warframe.
    Don't we all? Also KSP.

  2. #227
    Originally Posted by GreyAreaUK View Post (Source)
    Doesn't Xbox have issues with PGs?
    Yeah they didn't even exist for awhile. We have them again now.

  3. #228
    Originally Posted by courperationX View Post (Source)
    Yeah they didn't even exist for awhile. We have them again now.
    I think they're limited in the number of members though. I've got 1,000 in my head, vs the 32,000-ish for the PC PGs

  4. #229
    Originally Posted by courperationX View Post (Source)
    The only people talking about restricting gameplay are shining beacons of hope like yourself.
    You brought greifing up in your OP, suggesting being randomly killed is being griefed, is costing frontier money and should be stopped.

    I'm saying you were in the wrong mode, unprepared and poorly equipped to undertake what you wanted to do at that time. Accept you got it wrong and move on rather than try to suggest open should have some form of player honour instilled on it.

    There is no adequate c+p system and for whatever reason FD seem in no rush to add one, maybe just maybe its wai?

  5. #230
    Originally Posted by Crimson Kaim View Post (Source)
    False flagging maybe? People pledged to a faction may just want to oppose it. That's nothing else than reality. Maybe you were just mistaken with another CMDR with a similar name? Maybe that other CMDR destroyed another one and the one who destroyed you was just after him and confused the names? Maybe the one he was after was just a combat logger or used heat or healing weapons? There are so many reasons that fall under the type of "Wrong place, wrong time." or simply said bad luck. It happens from time to time. Sure, there are people out the just brainlessly destroying every CMDR that come in their way. However, most of them are full gimbal users as their targets are often less challenging than NPCs.
    Anyways. I can't help you if you refuse to live by the rules of the game. You WILL lose your ship eventually and you WILL lose it to players and NPCs the like. Just a single wrong shot at the popo and suddenly a whole instance of NPCs is after you. Let's assume yo uare out of banks and your shields are low and voilla! You are in danger. I once was blown up by NPCs because I wanted to scoop some very rare material and that's perfectly fine as it was my dumb mistake to stay >40 m/s with a cargo scoop deployed while having no banks left, shields offline and ~ 50% hull integrity.
    Pay the rebuy and keep going. Others died because they rammed an asteorid. The next one because he crashed into a planet. And then there are unlucky people who get stuck inside a station and get shot by it for loitering. Bad luck doesn't consider the skill of a player after all but the skill of a player determines the chances of survival in such scenarios. In my cases it was just my own stupidity. Either I wasn't paying attention (once my FSD was fully charged while under fire by like 6 CMDrs but I felt it was a good idea to write something in local before I intended to jump. Then I didn't pay attention and my shields broke ,FSD malfunctioned and I lost my Vette. So what? Pay rebuy, keep going. It didn't even hurt me.) or was just insanely stupid.

    Also:





    Yes, you actually did. Hence people will say so.
    Yes but that's a separate option like solo or open... it's still not turned off.

    As for the first part... I envy your faith in others. But he was the only other player there.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Originally Posted by Siobhan View Post (Source)
    Don't we all? Also KSP.
    Warframe is my cocaine.

  6. This is the last staff post in this thread. #231
    Lead Designer- Elite: Dangerous Frontier Employee
    Hello Commanders!

    At the risk of adding fuel to the fire (I've only had time to skim read this thread), a couple of points:

    * There's normally a raging debate over what constitutes "griefing". It's a relatively subjective concept, and, like statistics, its meaning is normally quite easy to manipulate to serve any number of agendas (even opposed ones ).

    * What we can look at in a far more objective manner, is criminal behaviour. This is more or less watertight and mechanically visible.

    * Most "griefing" in Elite tends to also be criminal.

    So we're looking at ways to improve the crime system especially regarding Commander-on-Commander crime. One aspect we're investigating is the Pilot's Federation Bounty, which would be valid in pretty much any system except anarchies. We're also looking at ways to mitigate the "Sidewinder switch", where criminals transfer to a very cheap ship to avoid potentially large re-buy costs when being destroyed because of bounties.

    Then we have the concept of a "karma" system, to track behaviour over time, which could then be used to mete out punitive (and importantly, in-game) consequences for criminal or unwanted behaviour.

    I can't give ETAs or guarantees (as anyone who knows me will testify), but I can say that we're *currently* looking at some of this stuff.

    Hope this info helps.

  7. #232
    Originally Posted by {SAS}Stalker View Post (Source)
    You brought greifing up in your OP, suggesting being randomly killed is being griefed, is costing frontier money and should be stopped.

    I'm saying you were in the wrong mode, unprepared and poorly equipped to undertake what you wanted to do at that time. Accept you got it wrong and move on rather than try to suggest open should have some form of player honour instilled on it.

    There is no adequate c+p system and for whatever reason FD seem in no rush to add one, maybe just maybe its wai?
    You should probably read past the first paragraph.

  8. #233
    Originally Posted by Sandro Sammarco View Post (Source)
    Hello Commanders!

    At the risk of adding fuel to the fire (I've only had time to skim read this thread), a couple of points:

    * There's normally a raging debate over what constitutes "griefing". It's a relatively subjective concept, and, like statistics, its meaning is normally quite easy to manipulate to serve any number of agendas (even opposed ones ).

    * What we can look at in a far more objective manner, is criminal behaviour. This is more or less watertight and mechanically visible.

    * Most "griefing" in Elite tends to also be criminal.

    So we're looking at ways to improve the crime system especially regarding Commander-on-Commander crime. One aspect we're investigating is the Pilot's Federation Bounty, which would be valid in pretty much any system except anarchies. We're also looking at ways to mitigate the "Sidewinder switch", where criminals transfer to a very cheap ship to avoid potentially large re-buy costs when being destroyed because of bounties.

    Then we have the concept of a "karma" system, to track behaviour over time, which could then be used to mete out punitive (and importantly, in-game) consequences for criminal or unwanted behaviour.

    I can't give ETAs or guarantees (as anyone who knows me will testify), but I can say that we're *currently* looking at some of this stuff.

    Hope this info helps.
    Ok, fine, but did you like Hercules?!... *gets sedated by tranq dart again*

    Where are these coming frrrrrr *thud*

  9. #234
    well it was very long, full of "i wont buy this and that" threats, a few "the game will die" hyperbole and quite dramatic but rest assured that I did.

  10. #235
    Originally Posted by Sandro Sammarco View Post (Source)
    Hello Commanders!

    At the risk of adding fuel to the fire (I've only had time to skim read this thread), a couple of points:

    * There's normally a raging debate over what constitutes "griefing". It's a relatively subjective concept, and, like statistics, its meaning is normally quite easy to manipulate to serve any number of agendas (even opposed ones ).

    * What we can look at in a far more objective manner, is criminal behaviour. This is more or less watertight and mechanically visible.

    * Most "griefing" in Elite tends to also be criminal.

    So we're looking at ways to improve the crime system especially regarding Commander-on-Commander crime. One aspect we're investigating is the Pilot's Federation Bounty, which would be valid in pretty much any system except anarchies. We're also looking at ways to mitigate the "Sidewinder switch", where criminals transfer to a very cheap ship to avoid potentially large re-buy costs when being destroyed because of bounties.

    Then we have the concept of a "karma" system, to track behaviour over time, which could then be used to mete out punitive (and importantly, in-game) consequences for criminal or unwanted behaviour.

    I can't give ETAs or guarantees (as anyone who knows me will testify), but I can say that we're *currently* looking at some of this stuff.

    Hope this info helps.
    Awesome!
    It takes a lot to bring Mr Sammarco into a thread. Glad to know it's getting thought time.

  11. #236
    Originally Posted by Sandro Sammarco View Post (Source)
    Hello Commanders!

    At the risk of adding fuel to the fire (I've only had time to skim read this thread), a couple of points:

    * There's normally a raging debate over what constitutes "griefing". It's a relatively subjective concept, and, like statistics, its meaning is normally quite easy to manipulate to serve any number of agendas (even opposed ones ).

    * What we can look at in a far more objective manner, is criminal behaviour. This is more or less watertight and mechanically visible.

    * Most "griefing" in Elite tends to also be criminal.

    So we're looking at ways to improve the crime system especially regarding Commander-on-Commander crime. One aspect we're investigating is the Pilot's Federation Bounty, which would be valid in pretty much any system except anarchies. We're also looking at ways to mitigate the "Sidewinder switch", where criminals transfer to a very cheap ship to avoid potentially large re-buy costs when being destroyed because of bounties.

    Then we have the concept of a "karma" system, to track behaviour over time, which could then be used to mete out punitive (and importantly, in-game) consequences for criminal or unwanted behaviour.

    I can't give ETAs or guarantees (as anyone who knows me will testify), but I can say that we're *currently* looking at some of this stuff.

    Hope this info helps.
    Terminatrixx... Your days are numbered... Get your trading ship out...LOL

  12. #237
    This user was unable to follow the forum rules and ended up banned or suspended! :(
    Originally Posted by Sandro Sammarco View Post (Source)
    Hello Commanders!

    At the risk of adding fuel to the fire (I've only had time to skim read this thread), a couple of points:

    * There's normally a raging debate over what constitutes "griefing". It's a relatively subjective concept, and, like statistics, its meaning is normally quite easy to manipulate to serve any number of agendas (even opposed ones ).

    * What we can look at in a far more objective manner, is criminal behaviour. This is more or less watertight and mechanically visible.

    * Most "griefing" in Elite tends to also be criminal.

    So we're looking at ways to improve the crime system especially regarding Commander-on-Commander crime. One aspect we're investigating is the Pilot's Federation Bounty, which would be valid in pretty much any system except anarchies. We're also looking at ways to mitigate the "Sidewinder switch", where criminals transfer to a very cheap ship to avoid potentially large re-buy costs when being destroyed because of bounties.

    Then we have the concept of a "karma" system, to track behaviour over time, which could then be used to mete out punitive (and importantly, in-game) consequences for criminal or unwanted behaviour.

    I can't give ETAs or guarantees (as anyone who knows me will testify), but I can say that we're *currently* looking at some of this stuff.

    Hope this info helps.
    It certainly helps to improve things, but please fix all the bugs before release new content and game mechanics.
    And what get the griefers in return? To maintain a balance! Double jumprange, extra hull hardness, infinite ammo? Something like this.

  13. #238
    Originally Posted by Sandro Sammarco View Post (Source)
    Hello Commanders!

    At the risk of adding fuel to the fire (I've only had time to skim read this thread), a couple of points:

    * There's normally a raging debate over what constitutes "griefing". It's a relatively subjective concept, and, like statistics, its meaning is normally quite easy to manipulate to serve any number of agendas (even opposed ones ).

    * What we can look at in a far more objective manner, is criminal behaviour. This is more or less watertight and mechanically visible.

    * Most "griefing" in Elite tends to also be criminal.

    So we're looking at ways to improve the crime system especially regarding Commander-on-Commander crime. One aspect we're investigating is the Pilot's Federation Bounty, which would be valid in pretty much any system except anarchies. We're also looking at ways to mitigate the "Sidewinder switch", where criminals transfer to a very cheap ship to avoid potentially large re-buy costs when being destroyed because of bounties.

    Then we have the concept of a "karma" system, to track behaviour over time, which could then be used to mete out punitive (and importantly, in-game) consequences for criminal or unwanted behaviour.

    I can't give ETAs or guarantees (as anyone who knows me will testify), but I can say that we're *currently* looking at some of this stuff.

    Hope this info helps.
    Don't mind the guys screaming about me wanting to ban PVP. I think the unpredictable nature is a great feature! A fair solution is all we want. Right now we're generally in agreement that the system simply favors those who go on murder sprees. The vics lose everything, the perps lose nothing. When it reality, such a crime would put someone at great risk, even in lore. Better balancing would discourage pointless murder. Some are up for the idea of a separate mode option for players that want to avoid PVP, but people seem to be leaning more towards a more realistic/fair crimes and punishments. No one with any sense is trying to ban a players ability to go on a murder spree if that's really what they wanna do, just pondering ways passive players don't have to pay for it. I think the long term ideas you mentioned sound great.

    Thanks for taking the time to look through and try to address concerns. Some attention to the issue is all we really want. It's greatly appreciated.

    EDIT: I'd also like to add that I think the same logic should be applied to PVE, I can get away with serious crimes in the next system way too easy, I'm guilty of taking advantage of that.

  14. #239
    The reason that FDev do not introduce an 'Open PvE' mode is simple; doing so would turn regular open into 'combat ships only' mode, and the concept of a living, diverse galaxy would be all but destroyed (hard to be a pirate in a galaxy with no traders).

    Besides, Open PvE would only encourage griefy-types to find new and obscure ways to trigger players anyway. Remember, it wouldn't be Mobius, players would have to be found violating FDevs rules to be restricted or banned. Open PvE players would suddenly be thrown into an environment where they have to deal with people annoying them (there are many ways to use the environment against players), even if they cannot kill.

  15. #240
    Originally Posted by TERMINATRIXXX View Post (Source)
    It certainly helps to improve things, but please fix all the bugs before release new content and game mechanics.
    And what get the griefers in return? To maintain a balance! Double jumprange, extra hull hardness, infinite ammo? Something like this.
    I fed this into Google Translate and it came back with:
    Noooooooooooooooooooooo! Please don't nerf my seal clubbing......

    No idea why it would say that though.

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