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Thread: Pimax 4K VR and ED

  1. #1

    Pimax 4K VR and ED

    Is anyone in here using the Pimax 4K VR and would like to comment on their experience with ED? I know it has no controllers but that's a non-issue here as its only for ED, the price atm is £250. Reviews seem mixed ranging from excellent to rubbish, but then again the same can be said for both the Vive and the Rift, so no real help there. Any input would be much appreciated. (oh and I wear glasses). (I keep hearing about god rays, screen door, poor tracking, uncomfortable, hassle setting up, monster computer needed, steaming up lenses, headaches, eye strain etc etc and must admit I begin to wonder if the tech is really there yet).

  2. #2
    I can remember playing Elite on a DK2 with my mediocre computer a couple of years ago and wondering why everyone was saying that the tech wasn't there yet because what I was experiencing was brilliant!

    All the talk about screen door effect, god-rays, and tracking are basically nit-picking for connoisseurs and/or cautionary tales for those who find such things unacceptable.

    None of us can tell you if you'll find virtual reality great, in the same way that none of us can tell you that chocolate cake is delicious. It's all down to personal taste. All we can do is tell you that we ourselves enjoy the taste of chocolate cake, and that we don't consider some cakes any good because they're not coated in chocolate. In this extended analogy that means positional tracking is part and parcel of the VR experience, and however tasty the chocolate sponge of the PIMAX headset, if it's not coated in the crispy chocolate shell of positional tracking then it's not really a chocolate cake.

    Your taste and others may vary.

    Rule (1) of Fighter Club is "We do not talk about Fight Club"

    https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showth...18#post4688218

  3. #3
    Thats a nice analogy and gave me my first smile in morning. Thanks for that.

  4. #4
    Hmm thx for that made me feel hungry, I like chocolate cake. Yeah I did go for the demo at Overclockers in march when I bought my super duper PC, it was a Vive demo and both me and my Mrs were very impressed. I must confess the demo was a bit on the short side but possibly because of the initial impact of VR I did not see ANY of the problems I mention in my OP, such was the impact, that if the price of the Vive had been where the rift is now I would have just paid for it there and then. So my impression so far, based on what I experienced on that day is to agree with your comment about people nit-picking. And thanks for your comments on positional tracking, so is positional tracking that important for ED, are the gyros not enough. I will input all feedback into my computer (brain). Any comments from Pimax users would also be appreciated!

  5. #5

    Let them eat cake

    I've not had a go at Pimax but I have tried a Google Cardboard with a very good screen. I can see how people could argue that such a headset would be superior for dogfighting in Elite. But there's something more to VR than just a monitor and head tracker strapped to your head. John Carmack said the magic happened at 100Hz, but I definitely glimpsed what he was talking about in my DK2 at 75Hz.

    It is a massive plus to Oculus that they have someone like John Carmack onboard and I'm sure he did some sort of voodoo magic to get the headset working as well on my fairly normal PC.

    If you've got a superduper PC then you can tweak things a little to get some supersampling going. I don't think you'll be disappointed with the CV1. But if you go for a Pimax you might find yourself regretting that you don't have any wave-yer-hands-about controllers.

    Rule (1) of Fighter Club is "We do not talk about Fight Club"

    https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showth...18#post4688218

  6. #6
    Ok thanks for sharing that info with me Frank.

  7. #7
    I've been using Pimax for half a year now. I had used Cardboard, Vive and Rift before that.

    Pimax pros:
    - Image quality. Everything else available is just crap compared to Pimax.
    Pimax cons:
    - No positional tracking/no controllers: really non-issue in ED, better yet Headlook targeting works perfect without positional tracking. There are other games though.
    - Drifting head tracking. I tried playing with built-in tracking for an hour, then switched it off and attached separate tracker I had from cardboard days. You probably don't have one.
    - Anything less then gtx980/1060 is probably no go. Gtx1080/1080ti is highly recommended.
    - Software/drivers quality is low though latest versions have got much better.

    To sum up: as it is probably your first VR headset, I'd recommend getting Rift now for the best VR experience.

  8. #8
    Originally Posted by ejka View Post (Source)
    I've been using Pimax for half a year now. I had used Cardboard, Vive and Rift before that.

    Pimax pros:
    - Image quality. Everything else available is just crap compared to Pimax.
    Pimax cons:
    - No positional tracking/no controllers: really non-issue in ED, better yet Headlook targeting works perfect without positional tracking. There are other games though.
    - Drifting head tracking. I tried playing with built-in tracking for an hour, then switched it off and attached separate tracker I had from cardboard days. You probably don't have one.
    - Anything less then gtx980/1060 is probably no go. Gtx1080/1080ti is highly recommended.
    - Software/drivers quality is low though latest versions have got much better.

    To sum up: as it is probably your first VR headset, I'd recommend getting Rift now for the best VR experience.
    Thanks for sharing your Pimax experience, what we need is a VR headset with the pro's from both the rift and the Pimax and the cons of neither............ <looks towards the horizon with some doubt>.

  9. #9
    Hi Brandon,

    I used to play ED with a Pimax 4K a couple of months ago and was very satisfied with it (on an i5-3550, 8 GB RAM @ GTX 1080).
    Meanwhile, I re-tried the Rift CV1 once again one week ago, and after having had a lot of doubts about pro’s and con’s, I’ll finally go back to the Pimax.

    Pro’s CV1:
    + Full Positional Tracking, perfectly working
    + Absolutely no tearing at all
    + Slightly better, saturated colours
    + No drift

    Con’s CV1:
    --- SDE !!! Even when turning up SS to 1.8, text isn’t as sharp as with the Pimax, and clear far sight still keeps to be too blurry for my taste.
    - Godrays

    Pro’s Pimax 4K:
    ++ Absolutely no SDE at all! Everything from text to far sight pin-sharp.
    + No Godrays

    Con’s Pimax 4K:
    - No Positional Tracking
    - Slight tearing when moving the head too fast – but for ED, it didn’t noticed this too often
    - A bit of a drift, so I had to re-center the view 1-2x per minute, sometimes more, sometimes (much) less.

    = Colours with the Pimax 4K didn’t bother me since they fit absolutely to my normal, usual monitor / TV image. On the contrary, the Rift’s image was quite a bit too bright for my taste.

    Conclusion:
    From my personal point of view, the Pimax 4K is a suitable alternative for cockpit simulations such as ED. And until Oculus doesn’t have a HMD with at least 2K, I would prefer the Pimax 4K.
    That’s why I brought the Rift CV1 back to the store and continue playing with the Pimax.

    What VR means to each of us individually, is exactly this: An individual choice based on individual priorities and preferences. In the end, even though I might miss the Rift’s perfect positional tracking, I prefer the Pimax’ excellent resolution and pin-sharp image. But things might change with the next generation

  10. #10
    Originally Posted by Cmdr Marc Hamilton View Post (Source)
    Hi Brandon,

    I used to play ED with a Pimax 4K a couple of months ago and was very satisfied with it (on an i5-3550, 8 GB RAM @ GTX 1080).
    Meanwhile, I re-tried the Rift CV1 once again one week ago, and after having had a lot of doubts about pro’s and con’s, I’ll finally go back to the Pimax.

    Pro’s CV1:
    + Full Positional Tracking, perfectly working
    + Absolutely no tearing at all
    + Slightly better, saturated colours
    + No drift

    Con’s CV1:
    --- SDE !!! Even when turning up SS to 1.8, text isn’t as sharp as with the Pimax, and clear far sight still keeps to be too blurry for my taste.
    - Godrays

    Pro’s Pimax 4K:
    ++ Absolutely no SDE at all! Everything from text to far sight pin-sharp.
    + No Godrays

    Con’s Pimax 4K:
    - No Positional Tracking
    - Slight tearing when moving the head too fast – but for ED, it didn’t noticed this too often
    - A bit of a drift, so I had to re-center the view 1-2x per minute, sometimes more, sometimes (much) less.

    = Colours with the Pimax 4K didn’t bother me since they fit absolutely to my normal, usual monitor / TV image. On the contrary, the Rift’s image was quite a bit too bright for my taste.

    Conclusion:
    From my personal point of view, the Pimax 4K is a suitable alternative for cockpit simulations such as ED. And until Oculus doesn’t have a HMD with at least 2K, I would prefer the Pimax 4K.
    That’s why I brought the Rift CV1 back to the store and continue playing with the Pimax.

    What VR means to each of us individually, is exactly this: An individual choice based on individual priorities and preferences. In the end, even though I might miss the Rift’s perfect positional tracking, I prefer the Pimax’ excellent resolution and pin-sharp image. But things might change with the next generation
    Thanks Marc all good stuff to know - with regard to "re setting the view 1- 2x per minute"? So that infers you have to press a key every 30 secs or so to keep your view centred correctly, or am I misunderstanding you on that?

  11. #11
    Yes, correct.
    Sometimes, it's once per 30 secs; sometimes only once in 5 minutes; then again twice in 30 secs... depends a bit on how often I move my head. As long as I look straight forward, no problem at all. But it seems as if the gyroscope sometimes looses center when moving the head. Not always, but sometimes.

    Rift CV1 is far better here, no drift at all.

    But I'd go for the Pimax 4k however.

  12. #12
    Originally Posted by Frank View Post (Source)
    I can remember playing Elite on a DK2 with my mediocre computer a couple of years ago and wondering why everyone was saying that the tech wasn't there yet because what I was experiencing was brilliant!

    All the talk about screen door effect, god-rays, and tracking are basically nit-picking for connoisseurs and/or cautionary tales for those who find such things unacceptable.

    None of us can tell you if you'll find virtual reality great, in the same way that none of us can tell you that chocolate cake is delicious. It's all down to personal taste. All we can do is tell you that we ourselves enjoy the taste of chocolate cake, and that we don't consider some cakes any good because they're not coated in chocolate. In this extended analogy that means positional tracking is part and parcel of the VR experience, and however tasty the chocolate sponge of the PIMAX headset, if it's not coated in the crispy chocolate shell of positional tracking then it's not really a chocolate cake.

    Your taste and others may vary.
    Your making me fat
    The sde in the Rift isn't a biggie issue and most forget about it in short order and don't see it anymore. I am NOT saying you wouldn't see the difference in direct comparison to the Pimax screen. However, just like you can't tell people what VR is-they have to see it, you can't explain why 360 tracking and Touch class controllers are integral to the VR experience in so many ways. Even those who say things like "I only play seated games" or "I only want it for Elite" and have never experienced this will find themselves playing things with "hands in game" that they would never have considered in non-VR games. I find I use play with Touch as much as hotas and wheel. I don't miss WSAD. I pick up 2 guns and point and shoot. I throw things. I shoot billiards and stroke the cue. I play golf and swing the clubs. I climb mountains. I control a wingsuit while flying down a mountainside and none of these had I considered until I got "hands in game. At my age, I play at lot of games that are considered roomscale from a "seated" position.
    Pimax, even in it's sdk early state, may well suffice for a lot of seated gamers, but they should not kid themselves that they won't want tracked controllers. Immersion goes off the scale. Vive users were pointing that out to Rifters for a long time.
    Since Oculus has set the new bundle's post sale price at $499, Pimax will need to come to the party, soon.
    I5 6600K @4.3, Gigabyte GA-Z170XP mobo, Corsair H80i Liquid Cooler, MSI GTX 1080 ti Gaming X gpu (factory OC), SoundBlaster X-F1 sound card, 16 gig Corsair Vengeance ddr4 ram @ 3200 , 3 ssd hds, EVGA 650 Gold Power supply, Saitek X52 Hotas and rudders, Oculus CV1 (2sensors) 16 gig, 2 AuraSound AST-2B-4 Pro Bass Shakers/110 watt Sony amp.

  13. #13
    what others have mentioned about Pimax 4k is true so I'm not going to repeat.
    that said I've got mine back in Feb for 250 bux and other than drift loving it!
    btw, the drift seemed lessen for me lately. only thing that changed was SteamVR updates...

  14. #14
    Hi - New to Elite and just got my Pimax

    So far I am loving the experience with the headset ! - i have a button on my HOTAS bound to re-center - so the drift is not that big a deal for me at the moment

    I just found out there is apparently two versions of the headset - according to their forums, there is a "BE" edition that is lower resolution but is OLED display with higher refresh rate (apparently its more expensive than the original 4k) - it seems that they messed up shipments and somehow these got sent for retail to gearbest (the place I got mine)

    so, while the resolution is not 4k, its still more than the RIFT/Vive and it plays real smooth. I am two minds to get it replaced for the actual 4k one - anyone got one and have any thoughts on this

    Apparently, if your Serial # starts 102, then you have the "BE" headset

  15. #15
    i have a button on my HOTAS bound to re-center - so the drift is not that big a deal for me at the Moment
    Did it this way as well. Pressing this button once or twice in a minute isn't a matter for me, either, doing it almost automatically meanwhile.

    @loribee:
    So you did get a BE (Business Edition)?
    How is the overall image quality and sharpness? As far as I experienced with the "default"/"real" Pimax 4K, a little border of appr. 1-2cm stays a bit blurry which makes it a bit difficult to focus objects located in the image's edges. In contrast to this, the Rift's OLED image is 100% homogenous, even in the border area. So I wonder, if the Pimax OLED solves this issue as well?
    On the other side, it well might not be an TFT/OLED, but a lense issue... As long as Pimax does not adapt the lenses in the OLED edition, the result might be the same than with the normal 4K. ...?

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