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Thread: Handling Fleet Carriers in 2018 - Fleet Carrier Concept

  1. #61
    Brilliant stuff. Repped ;-)

  2. #62
    Originally Posted by andrak View Post (Source)
    Instead of being critical of Frontier, I'm offering a detailed concept, with mock up images, on how I'd like FD to implement fleet carriers in 2018. As said in the video, this is my opinion, what I want to see and I'm not claiming I speak for everybody.

    Mods, I'd appreciate it very much if you could please let this run for a while in dangerous discussion.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6arhWcrGSp8


    The concept covers:
    • Outfitting
    • Module Attachments
    • Storage
    • NPC Crew Positions
    • Squadron Goals
    • Squadron Missions
    • Carrier Damage and Consequence
    • Carrier Relocation
    • Livery


    I'd like to address the following issues:
    • Content, challenge, reward for end game players
    • Material, data, credit and time sinks
    • Player storage limits
    • Player custom home bases of operations
    • Conveniences and costs associated with them
    • Keeping players of different skill levels and play times together



    Hopefully this sparks some more ideas and debate and it would be interesting to see what others think.

    Thanks go to CMDR Ashelai and CMDR Porky McBacon for their input.
    Excellent ideas. I'd be happy with Squadrons if they rolled out like that.

    +Rep

    I hope FD take notice of these ideas and incorporate them in some way.

  3. #63
    Great stuff OP, like it. The one thing that I find ambiguous is whether squadrons is also available in solo or not.

  4. #64
    It's a really interesting concept with great execution, thank you.

    To have a purpose other than vanity a carrier needs to offer more than a space station, otherwise it has no reason to exist as your fleet can just park at a station without costing a credit.

    My issue with carrier damage etc is if it costs anything to repair them and other players can attack them then this will become salt mining heaven.

    It gets damaged and jumps out. Simply keeps following it and attacking it, until it bankrupts the squadron

    If there is a rebuy/repair cost for destruction, same again.

    In theory banding your squadron together to defend a carrier sounds great but logically, they will need to exist in solo, pg and open modes so squadron members can dock and interact with them. Otherwise there will need to be a special squadron only instance players swap to before exiting SC

    So what if I create my own PG, only invite people not in the squadron's who's ship I want to attack then what is the squadron going to do about it Or if I drink lots of caffeine, gets some like minded mates and do it at 2am

    Destructible assets that costs materials or credits to repair just wont work.

    Saying that there needs to be a restriction to stop carriers clogging up a system

    One thing not touched on is will it be possible to join more than one squadron. I have a huge list of private groups I play in as and when friends are available. Will I now have to choose. The trend is in MMO's to be able to join multiple clans/guilds so will ED follow this trend.. Dunno, but it would be darned useful.

  5. #65
    Originally Posted by Shanaeri View Post (Source)
    It's a really interesting concept with great execution, thank you.

    To have a purpose other than vanity a carrier needs to offer more than a space station, otherwise it has no reason to exist as your fleet can just park at a station without costing a credit.

    My issue with carrier damage etc is if it costs anything to repair them and other players can attack them then this will become salt mining heaven.
    The cost for repairing can be (if not already suggested in the video) to speed up the repair. For instance it could take a day or two to get the ship repaired, but with money and materials it can get repaired sooner than that (either by 100% with all the materials and credits provided, or by a smaller percentage proportional to the materials and credits provided). In this case though, the problem would be how much is reasonable to wait in consideration to the capabilities of different player groups. There could be different carriers for different amount of players involved in their management.

  6. #66
    Originally Posted by Besensec View Post (Source)
    The cost for repairing can be (if not already suggested in the video) to speed up the repair. For instance it could take a day or two to get the ship repaired, but with money and materials it can get repaired sooner than that (either by 100% with all the materials and credits provided, or by a smaller percentage proportional to the materials and credits provided). In this case though, the problem would be how much is reasonable to wait in consideration to the capabilities of different player groups. There could be different carriers for different amount of players involved in their management.
    If the cost to repair(either in credits or materials) is cosmetic only then it becomes optional(in that case, what's the point of having the damage). BUT if functionality is decreased then it goes back to my point. I'll just keep attacking it, and rendering it less functional until you pay up and fix it. And then I'll just start all over again until you're broke or you cba to fix it rendering it just a useless hulk in space.

  7. #67
    Originally Posted by Shanaeri View Post (Source)
    If the cost to repair(either in credits or materials) is cosmetic only then it becomes optional(in that case, what's the point of having the damage). BUT if functionality is decreased then it goes back to my point. I'll just keep attacking it, and rendering it less functional until you pay up and fix it. And then I'll just start all over again until you're broke or you cba to fix it rendering it just a useless hulk in space.
    Okay we understand what you are saying, but how will you get to the damaged Carrier after it wakes out as the OP suggested. Unless you know the location of the last jump, it could be in a sphere of 2,000 LY (well whatever the maximum jump range of Carrier). And we don't even know if it would leave a high wake signature to track, it could be a different type of FSD.

    So yes, you could go and attack it after it fled, IF you could not only find it, but get there before it is repaired!

  8. #68
    Originally Posted by M00ka View Post (Source)
    Okay we understand what you are saying, but how will you get to the damaged Carrier after it wakes out as the OP suggested. Unless you know the location of the last jump, it could be in a sphere of 2,000 LY (well whatever the maximum jump range of Carrier). And we don't even know if it would leave a high wake signature to track, it could be a different type of FSD.

    So yes, you could go and attack it after it fled, IF you could not only find it, but get there before it is repaired!
    Easy. watch on streams to see where people go. follow on discord, friends lists, infiltrate the squadron etc. Just look at how players find other players now and theres your answer.

  9. #69
    Originally Posted by Shanaeri View Post (Source)
    Easy. watch on streams to see where people go. follow on discord, friends lists, infiltrate the squadron etc. Just look at how players find other players now and theres your answer.
    And you will manage to do that in the finite time of repair. Okayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy .....

  10. #70
    Originally Posted by M00ka View Post (Source)
    And you will manage to do that in the finite time of repair. Okayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy .....
    Ignoring the obvious "So you know how long it's going to take then?" response...

    If the repair time is too short, then paying for repair becomes pointless, which in turn makes damage pointless.

    I can guarantee high profile player groups(esp those who stream) or well known player's carriers will be found in less than 12h after jumping away.

    and even if I cant find it, the threat of it being found would be enough for players to stay away from it, in case it is. Thus denying it being used. Again causing hassle and salt

    The salt mining incentive will be far too great to resist.

  11. #71
    Oh just watched the video, rep all round love the concepts and would love to have a mobile home.

    My god it's not going to be like this is it... but please FD make it somewhere close to it

  12. #72
    Originally Posted by Shanaeri View Post (Source)
    Ignoring the obvious "So you know how long it's going to take then?" response...

    If the repair time is too short, then paying for repair becomes pointless, which in turn makes damage pointless.

    I can guarantee high profile player groups(esp those who stream) or well known player's carriers will be found in less than 12h after jumping away.

    and even if I cant find it, the threat of it being found would be enough for players to stay away from it, in case it is. Thus denying it being used. Again causing hassle and salt

    The salt mining incentive will be far too great to resist.

    There's also the option of making carriers only visible to the squadron that owns them. A unique POI for that squadron. This prevents griefing of carriers multiple times and large squadrons going around noob stomping.

    If 2 squadron's want to war it out in an epic battle they could maybe declare some kind of war on each other through whatever squadron communication methods must be coming to support these ships. When one squadron decides enough is enough or their carrier reaches a damage threshold then the battle is over. The winning squadron cannot then instance with the losing squadron's carrier over and over, since the battle is over and instancing returns to default.

  13. #73
    Originally Posted by andrak View Post (Source)
    There's also the option of making carriers only visible to the squadron that owns them. A unique POI for that squadron. This prevents griefing of carriers multiple times and large squadrons going around noob stomping.

    If 2 squadron's want to war it out in an epic battle they could maybe declare some kind of war on each other through whatever squadron communication methods must be coming to support these ships. When one squadron decides enough is enough or their carrier reaches a damage threshold then the battle is over. The winning squadron cannot then instance with the losing squadron's carrier over and over, since the battle is over and instancing returns to default.
    Yeah, that's the solution that works best I think, with the loop hole that it doesn't stop sabotage. I'd prefer the POI option with undamagable carriers for sure.

    To have carriers that can be damaged by players is a just a recipe for grief, salt and mayhem

  14. #74
    Originally Posted by Achibot View Post (Source)
    I disagree with most of your post but this is the only part I especially want to address. It is such a negative and detractive way of looking things. Why would you *want* something to be less than it could be? What sort of prepare for failure mindset is that? Perhaps that may well end up being the reality, I wouldn't know because I'm not prescient. Are you?
    "Prepare for the worst, hope for the best and never be disappointed."

    A little mantra that takes the sting out of life's little curve balls. I never once said I *want* anything to be less than it could be, but if you think you saw that, do quote it back. I said I don't expect it.

    And we do have something of a proven track record of things being released that have fallen short of there potential - the fact that season 3 is slated to be an expansion of the existing careers, because they fell short of their potential is evidence itself.

    It is not a "prepare for failure mindset", it's a "don't set your expectations to such heights that anything else will be an utter disappointment" mindset. People do it all the time - especially here.

    One doesn't need to be prescient to use the past to gauge the future.

  15. #75
    Thanks for all the kind words guys. It seems to have went down really well here and on reddit too.

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