View Entry Info: Delivery missions reward double the amount of military rank progression.

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Thread: Delivery missions reward double the amount of military rank progression.

  1. #1

    Delivery missions reward double the amount of military rank progression.

    Severity
    Severe

    Frequency
    All of the time (100%)

    Time of occurrence
    -

    Date of occurrence
    -

    VR?
    None / N/A

    Location
    -

    Ship/SRV?
    N/A

    Ship Type
    -

    Commander Name
    HaTeMe

    Description
    This bug probably exists for a long time now, but the increased progression through rep+++ reward choices made it very obvious that you get way more military rank progression for deliver missions compared to other mission types which not just comes down to their general casualness or the fact that you can get back and forth between two systems both offering data delivery missions.
    This is almost certainly a result of you getting rank progression for both, the rewarded rep from the mission giver, as well as the mission "receiver" on the other end, essentially doubling the potential military rank reward. Because of this it is entirely possible to go from no rank to max rank in the course of a few hours in one day.


    Steps to Reproduce
    -

    Additional files?

  2. #2

    Mission Reputation Too Generous

    Severity
    Minor

    Frequency
    All of the time (100%)

    Time of occurrence
    21:52 GMT

    Date of occurrence
    07/03/18

    VR?
    None / N/A

    Location
    Col 285 Sector YF-M c8-8 (Lebedev Installation)

    Ship/SRV?
    Ship

    Ship Type
    Cobra III

    Commander Name
    Skatez69

    Description
    Probably going to be unpopular, but this just *feels* wrong...

    I'm currently grinding my Fed ranking by running missions between Col 285 Sector YF-M c8-8 and Niu Hsing. Since 3.0, I've been selecting the option of Reputation to make this grind as short as possible. Having said that, 13th Feb, I was Lieutenant. It took me until 27th Feb to get to Lt Commander. I managed to get to Post Commander on 5th March, just a couple of days ago and I achieved Post Captain. That last ranking took just two days, and I'm already 33% through this rank too. The amount of time I spend on the game hasn't really changed in the last few weeks. With the mission options, I would have expected some kind of increase, but to go from a couple weeks per rank to a couple of days (and a higher rank at that), just feels like the balance is slightly off.


    Steps to Reproduce
    * Grind a rank running missions
    * Choose Reputation
    * Watch that rank grow


    Additional files?

  3. #3
    ... and now Rear Admiral about an hour later after just 3 round trips, and 22% completed for Vice Admiral too!

  4. #4
    I would like to point out that all commanders who completed the rank grind before the update only ever describe it as "soul crushing". The change to rewards system is a welcome and long-awaited one. I would feel very bad for new players if this change was reverted. I personally had 6 of my friends buy this game around launch and they all stopped playing a week after. They still joke that this game is more boring than EuroTruck Simulator, and they are somewhat right. That is 6 players that you lost FDev, and they are never coming back nor will buy your DLCs or ship-skins. And I cannot present any arguments that Elite became better over the years, if it keeps getting worse.

  5. #5
    I agree that parts of it are too grindy, and the old ranking was way too slow. I think that the axe has swung too far in the other direction on this one though. Theoretically a new player could go from Recruit to Admiral in a couple of days. Doesn't that seem just a little too quick?

  6. #6
    Originally Posted by Skatez69 View Post (Source)
    Theoretically a new player could go from Recruit to Admiral in a couple of days. Doesn't that seem just a little too quick?
    Nope, i believe it's fine, if anything might benefit player retention.

  7. #7
    Originally Posted by Shackram View Post (Source)
    Nope, i believe it's fine, if anything might benefit player retention.
    Except that someone got from 0 to king in .. lets say.. a couple of hours??


  8. #8
    First off the Ranks were going to offer a lot more to the game than just be a gate. But they have never spent another iota on trying to enhance what players would get out of it.

    If you look at the changes that came about over many patches you will see mostly all that happened was players were able to see how much rep they were getting. When before, we had no clue other than what they paid or how much we donated.

    I did my Imperial grind before 2.3... It took me a LONG time to work at it. I earned a few lore based system permits offering zero gains over any other systems in the areas. I gained access to a few ships. I did my Federal grind during 2.3

    I do not have a single iota to gain by letting other people not have to work for weeks and weeks at a grind when in the end, it just means they can buy another ship.

    The Alliance will have no rank grind. They specifically stated they do not want to make players have to progression grind for such little gains again. They put in the reputation options to gain it. They put in influence gains for people that want to do power play.

    Why do you care that someone has to spend weeks just to buy a ship that will bleed their credits out? They are not making a lot of money if they are choosing reputation. Do you honestly think they made the 200m+ for a cutter in 4 hours running data missions? No, they didn't.

    If you value your walk up a hill through a mile of snow, then you go ahead and do it. But just because they invented a snow plow does not mean you should force everyone else to walk up a hill through a mile of snow to be annoyed by it like you were. They being smart people would elect to choose to 'play' in the snow or keep walking through the cleared side walk.

  9. #9
    fsdraconis, all this is very good and well, but neither you or me got a say here, it is FD's choice at the end.

  10. #10
    I switched from PS4 to pc in time for Beyond and the greatest reluctance in doing so was not from loss of Elite ranks (which I was very proud of and feel I earned), or even my ships but the Soul Crushing fed grind. I've resigned myself for the time being of just not buying imperial ships, tho I did love my clipper. The new system, much faster yes. Still excruciating frankly and not a "couple hours" thing. If, and only if perhaps the ranking meant ANYTHING except ship and boring systems unlock I might say King in however long was to quick. But it's about the most meaningless grind one could choose to undertake in the game. If it had any merit, any point, any benefit, any impact on the game At all, perhaps, maybe, it would be to quick. As the ranks are completely pointless aside from the unlocks, if you could get it by one mission it would still be almost to much.

    The change otherwise is a positive as far as rep grinds. The system is built to encourage you to get chummy with a system, yet one of the elements of the game I enjoy is it's scope and majesty. Everything is scattered to far and wide to live anywhere aside from a handy place to keep most of your ships. Being able to rep up decently without dedicating a night to it, as I do actually try and do other things occasionally, is a godsend.

  11. #11
    I remember the times when I was aware of all the systems around because getting anywhere farther than 40ly was 'leaving your surroundings'.. now, with engineers, synthesis and neutron stars, I changed my home to a system that in one jump I can go as far as +100Ly.. and now I don't recognise my 'home' anymore.

  12. #12
    I would argue that both you and I have a say Ilo. We don't have a choice on who Frontier will ultimately listen to. But we can and should vocalize what we believe in. If we don't, then we rely on someone else to advocate our interests.

    In my opinion I support the current design. If we remove choice, then what was the point of designing a system if we were ment to have a choice. This is literally one of the few places you can see a clear cut example of reducing player grind through player choice.

    The ranks do nothing for players other than act as 14 gates to pass through. The 12th gate being the one that unlocks the biggest ship. Zero gains for getting through all 14. The Governments won't treat you as anything different before the grind. You just get some lame permits and access to buy ships. We don't get discounts. We don't get respect. We don't get better profits for our rank. I didn't gain any appreciation for the effort I had to put in. I don't feel hurt that new players do not have to work as hard and as long at it as I had.

    To me, this is an improvement.

    Originally Posted by ilo View Post (Source)
    fsdraconis, all this is very good and well, but neither you or me got a say here, it is FD's choice at the end.

  13. #13
    Originally Posted by fsdraconis View Post (Source)
    I would argue that both you and I have a say Ilo. We don't have a choice on who Frontier will ultimately listen to. But we can and should vocalize what we believe in. If we don't, then we rely on someone else to advocate our interests.

    In my opinion I support the current design. If we remove choice, then what was the point of designing a system if we were ment to have a choice. This is literally one of the few places you can see a clear cut example of reducing player grind through player choice.

    The ranks do nothing for players other than act as 14 gates to pass through. The 12th gate being the one that unlocks the biggest ship. Zero gains for getting through all 14. The Governments won't treat you as anything different before the grind. You just get some lame permits and access to buy ships. We don't get discounts. We don't get respect. We don't get better profits for our rank. I didn't gain any appreciation for the effort I had to put in. I don't feel hurt that new players do not have to work as hard and as long at it as I had.

    To me, this is an improvement.
    I can only in all you said, however I can't agree in the 'effort/time'. from weeks to hours.. I think there is a very noticeable change in the pace I'm not sure FD realised with the new design that might need a balance, just that.

    In my opinion, going back to weeks? that is too much, however, just a couple of hours? too little

  14. #14
    I do agree that what the ranks gets you is very limited. It is, however, akin to "levelling up" in a game, despite its lack of reward. I see it as something to strive towards, something to challenge me. A few weeks per rank - yes, that's grindy and not enjoyable. An hour per rank - makes the whole thing completely meaningless and unrewarding. I'm not one of these people who thinks "I had to suffer, why can't you?". It's more along the lines of "I enjoyed the challenge of this, it would be nice if you too could enjoy the challenge".
    Don't get me wrong, I love the new system of choice in rewards, but as ilo and I have said, the balance just feels off on this.

    So what would be balanced? Well, perhaps a few hours in the lower ranks and a couple of days in the higher ranks would be more realistic. It balances between not being a seemingly unending grind, but still being a stretch and something to work towards. Could the rewards be any better? Personally, yes I think they could, although you could now argue that if it just takes a few hours or so to get the top ranking, have any rewards been actually earned? That's a discussion for another day though.

  15. #15

    Faction Ranking going up WAY TOO FAST

    Severity
    Severe

    Frequency
    All of the time (100%)

    Time of occurrence
    12:00

    Date of occurrence
    27/02/18

    VR?
    None / N/A

    Location
    wise

    Ship/SRV?
    Ship

    Ship Type


    Commander Name
    AldrickExGladius

    Description
    the missions that offer little Influence and little Credit reward but with a "+++" or higher Rep reward is giving WAY TOO MUCH rep at one time. its not even funny how fast a person can move thru the ranks now. makes the game WAY TOO short and needs to be taken back to the original system

    Steps to Reproduce
    1) take mission
    2) do mission
    3) select Rep reward after handing it in
    4) get WAY TOO MUCH Rep


    Additional files?

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