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Thread: Your opinion on Open-Only PP ... by your time pledged?

  1. #106
    1, Yes
    2, D

    I am Flimley

  2. #107
    Joining FDev in harvesting salt. Will salt become a solo only commodity (G1) to enable PP upgrades?

    PP should be open only, then again, the game should be open only. Just my opinion, take it or leave it, no problem to me.

  3. #108
    1. Yes
    2. C

    I pledged initially with ALD way back on release of Powerplay, mainly for the credit bonus but defected after a month or so to Mahon and I stayed with him until things got sour and the first iteration of Engineers came about. After that, I just unpledged and went to derping about in Mobius/Solo until I came back to Open about a year ago though. Haven't been able to take Powerplay seriously though due to the horrible decay mechanics and mind numbingly dull fortification and undermining. (Other than some brief defections to 2 other powers for the modules)

    If the updates make mission running a viable alternative to the current mechanics of hauling cargo / killing NPCs (which I have serious doubts TBH) I would re-pledge in a heartbeat (everything done in Open of course).

  4. #109
    Originally Posted by Kaocraft View Post (Source)
    They already do have a mode just for PP in that sense. The PP ships don't appear unless you yourself are pledged to a power. If you don't want to see PP ships all you have to do is unpledge.
    I've never pledged, but our hazres's are filled with PP NPCs. Are you sure about this?

  5. #110
    Originally Posted by Mengy View Post (Source)
    1. NO (but kind of YES, see below)
    2. D


    In theory I actually think that making PP Open only is a good thing. Itís meant to be an end game PvP centric feature and it serves to strengthen the meat of it if all PP players are in the same mode as each other, because this allows interactions between the pledgees.

    However, in reality itís not going to work like people wish it would. There are many issues which would make an Open only PP far less effective than it theoretically could be:

    • Console would players need to pay a monthly fee to participate in the PP content.
    • Each platform is in its own server, so the PS/Xbox/PC players can never meet each other, even if they are all in Open. PP players still wonít see most of the other PP players, so itís not solving anything.
    • By simply blocking other PP players a pilot can play PP in Open essentially alone anyway, this easily defeats the intent of the change.
    • By using some router settings a PP player can easily turn their Open into Solo anyway, again defeating the intent of this.
    • A lot of solo and PG players participate in PP, and a lot of them will not switch to Open, they would rather give up on PP instead. Iím not sure if excluding paying customers from content they enjoy is a wise move for Frontier.



    In light of this, Iím against FDev actually going through with the change. Not because it isnít a good concept, but because itís probably not going to work like everyone thinks it will.

    Thatís just my opinion though, in truth I only tried PP for a week and promptly left it forever as I did not like the feature at all, so personally I donít care what they do with PP. Part of me is curious and wants to see FDev pull the trigger just to see how it falls out, LOL.
    You know, I think this is now me, after sifting through the rage and salt and groundless vindication (the newest stuff, not the tired old stuff we've always had here >__> ) ; theory sounds good, but will likely be .___@ in implementation, and I doubt anyone will get what they're looking for.

    Didn't care about PP from the outset because it felt like Bolt-on SpaceRisk combined with the Mercenary Toy Collection Circuit and it never really got away from that for me; and I haven't seen any talk of improving PP itself so it doesn't suck so hard in the first place.

    I don't see a mode exclusivity making any of the existing mechanics of PP play out any better, and like you mentioned, there are a goodly selection of non-mode-based reasons, intentional and otherwise, to never see another living soul ever again even with 100% Open play. It's a potentially pointless change that's just stirring everybody up like a stick in an anthill.

    I kind of also want to see them pull the trigger on this one just to see what happens. I don't think I care if it works or not at this stage, though obviously for FD it'd be great if it did. Popcorn might not cut it, but we just got a quarter-cow in the freezer so I'll bbq us up some steaks and burgers. Bring a salad or something.

  6. #111
    The problem is that we shouldn't be have a discussion about whether or not to cut a feature from modes but rather a discussion on how we can balance it across all modes. As well as a better way to detect and eliminate bots.

    That I think would be a much better use of time then to just fight about why it should stay in open only or be part of all three.

  7. #112
    Originally Posted by CMDR MadRaptor View Post (Source)
    The problem is that we shouldn't be have a discussion about whether or not to cut a feature from modes but rather a discussion on how we can balance it across all modes. As well as a better way to detect and eliminate bots.

    That I think would be a much better use of time then to just fight about why it should stay in open only or be part of all three.
    That for the most part is not how this forum operates. We get the best factional combat available right here; IDK if any types of PP improvements could come close.

  8. #113
    Originally Posted by Cheese Helmet View Post (Source)
    Look at all the solo mode powerplayers who have no idea they are why powerplay is crap. Hilarious.
    Oh, they know, they just don't care. And.. I include myself in this group.

    Everyone playing Elite just wants to enjoy themselves, this is a game after all. For some people this includes the social aspect, but for others (like me) it doesn't. Each to their own.

    The only time this hedonistic pursuit of enjoyment becomes a "problem" is when one players actions have a negative impact on another. Typically we hear about "gankers" and how they ruin the game for others. But, it can actually go the other way, in this case I agree solo mode PP players have a negative effect on PP. This is why, despite being a solo mode PP player, I support the change to open-only. I've always known my participation in PP was not "as intended" but, as I said earlier, I just wanted the CR and nice weapons.

    I'm hoping they will move those weapons to the tech broker, but wouldn't be too bothered if not. Instead, I would actually participate in powerplay, in open, if I wanted them.

  9. #114

  10. #115
    Yes

    D

    I pledged to Hudson at one time during the early days of the Horizons expansion. Unfortunately I found that I couldn't stand being constantly harangued by the PP NPCs in Res sites. This was also around the time that the NPCs themselves became unnaturally tough. My friends had been trying to convince me to pledge for ages and come undermining in Lugh with them, but when I did, they all unpledged because undermining became next to impossible for them, and they've not gone back since. At one time they were both Tier 5 for several months, but the NPC situation made it untenable.

    Without any more experienced wing mates to help me, I also unpledged - due to the aforementioned harassment by NPCs. I did try the various activities but quickly found them too samey, and carrying on as a lone wolf was daunting.

    Since then I have pledged to Aisling Duval to get Prismatics (which I no longer use) and had a much easier time of it due to the changes to PP NPC behaviour... But otherwise that was that, I haven't gone back to power play.

    I will be keeping an eye on it though, as linking in missions is excellent, and the Open only aspect adds danger to the mix.

  11. #116
    1. Are you in favour of Frontier's Open-only Powerplay proposal?

    YES, most emphatically.

    2. What proportion of your in-game time do you estimate that you have been pledged?

    B

    I pledged for RP reasons mainly, and although i have rarely done PvP in this game i can definitely say that PP belongs in Open, if anything to give adversaries a sporting chance to defend from attacks/undermining/5c and introduce more chances for emergent gameplay, a sorely-needed feature. Also, and very importantly, limit or altogether get rid of botting for PP purposes. There are a few things more frustrating when one cannot do anything to avert a course of action just because said action is done covertly in Solo/PG. Open PP is a step in the right direction to make things fairer (FDev working on instancing and multiplayer tools/capabilities is another).

    I have to admit that generally speaking i pretty much suck at combat and I'm not the type of player to grind for meta engineer builds etc. My support for the Empire has primarily been diplomatic, through the BGs and prepping.

    Will an Open only Powerplay make me abandon it ? I doubt it, tbh. I suppose it will make me want to engage even more with it and if that means i gotta take some extensive combat lessons from people willing to be patient with me, so be it. I'll adapt.

    Something will have to be done with the PP modules though and their accessibility. Personally i wouldn't mind if they were removed altogether or moved to a more universally accessible mechanic like the tech broker.

    (I'd love it if at some point some kind of support vessel was introduced - or signal jammers and countermeasures launched by small support ships.i loved healing others with beams)

    o7 cmdrs




  12. #117
    Originally Posted by Mengy View Post (Source)
    There are many issues which would make an Open only PP far less effective than it theoretically could be:

    • Console would players need to pay a monthly fee to participate in the PP content.
    True, but this charge is (I believe) based on network bandwidth usage which is higher when engaging in online multiplayer content. Solo mode in Elite must fall below some sort of threshold OR have some sort of special dispensation to avoid the charge. Console players know that they have to pay for online/multiplayer in all of their games, being able to do something which is almost multiplayer without paying for it is almost cheating the system.

    Originally Posted by Mengy View Post (Source)
    • Each platform is in its own server, so the PS/Xbox/PC players can never meet each other, even if they are all in Open. PP players still wonít see most of the other PP players, so itís not solving anything.
    I don't think there are any powers which are solely players from a single platform though, right? So, as long as each power has players from each platform, those players will be competing directly. Chances are things will be fairly balanced, as there shouldn't be any reason a given platform will prefer a given power, and so purely by the law of averages we ought to see a similar percentage of each power on each platform. The change is definitely an improvement, as we currently have who knows how many solo/PG players which cannot be instanced with others at all.

    Originally Posted by Mengy View Post (Source)
    • By simply blocking other PP players a pilot can play PP in Open essentially alone anyway, this easily defeats the intent of the change.
    Blocking, as it currently operates, can be used to avoid enemy commanders. And, while some people will probably use this I think the absolute number will be few, so it should not have a very large effect overall. But, Frontier could address this by changing how blocking works for power pledged players. For example, what if blocking didn't prevent instancing with those players in power systems? Blocking would continue to block messages from those players, so it would still be effective against abuse, and outside power systems it would continue to block completely (as normal).

    Originally Posted by Mengy View Post (Source)
    • By using some router settings a PP player can easily turn their Open into Solo anyway, again defeating the intent of this.
    I am almost certain that this violates the terms of service and if it can be detected could result in a ban. Regardless, the number of players with the skill and motivation enough to bother doing this will be few, so it should not have a very large effect overall.

    Originally Posted by Mengy View Post (Source)
    • A lot of solo and PG players participate in PP, and a lot of them will not switch to Open, they would rather give up on PP instead. Iím not sure if excluding paying customers from content they enjoy is a wise move for Frontier.
    Paying customers have already gotten their money's worth, IMO. Frontier cannot afford to stagnate for fear of upsetting what I imagine will only be a few players . Changes like this are not grounds for refunds, so at worst those few players will stop buying new skins etc. That said, Frontier don't do things like this without good cause, but I believe they have that in this case.

  13. #118

  14. #119
    1. Yes

    2. A (i've been pledged to Utopia since week 2 of powerplay existing and have remained pledged every single day since uninterrupted.


    This is a feature that should have never been made in a game where the developers have designed the game almost specifically to circumvent or opt-out of every aspect this mechanic could possibly utilize.

    But, assuming it is staying in the game and not being trashed, it really needs to be open-only. It's the only way it can salvage any of it's potential. It's been absolutely garbage since release because of how it's been implemented and other development decisions. It's time some logic is tried out to see if anyone will start to care about it.

  15. #120
    1. Yes
    2. Hard to say. B or C. I'm often pledged to a power with the intention of eventually grinding out the module one week (which I rarely ever actually do.)

    I would love more people in power play. I'm a Fed to the core, but as BGS guy, I find myself often irritated and annoyed with Federal PPers. Some new blood actually dedicated to the cause would be a nice change of pace.

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