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Thread: Virpil WarBRD, T-50 Throttle and Constellation grip video review

  1. #31
    Originally Posted by TorTorden View Post (Source)
    Monstertechs are just way overpriced.

    I would much rather spend $40 on the virpil mount rather than $130 for a monstertech.

    You could buy three of them for the price of one.
    No, they really aren't. They're over-specified, but the price is actually reasonable. I build basically copies of their design. Adding up the price of the parts alone, that is, the extrusions, clamps, screws and aluminium parts easily adds up to 40€-50€. One of these clamps costs ~20€. And I doubt they'll drive the price down significantly due to bulk orders. While most of that are standard parts just cut to length, their plates are custom made, which adds work hours.

    You're right though. If one can live with a less fancy and over-speced solution, the Virpil mounts are far more reasonable investments. The key advantage of the Monstertech mounts are the clamps they use. I've yet to see a better, more stable and quick solution for attaching a HOTAS mount to a table and detaching it again. But that advantage is most notable if you often have to stow the mounts away.

  2. #32
    I'l concede that point, but as history shows.

    No matter how lauded a company is for over engineering a product is, someone will come by, do it to a tighter spec for half the price and suddenly the first company doesn't have any customers what so ever.

    For the longest time now Monstertech's has been the only HOTAS mount product around outside of DIY.

    Personally I just banged together some pieces of wood in an afternoon and spent less than $30 for both.
    I'm setup in a dedicated corner anyways.

  3. #33
    Originally Posted by sovapid View Post (Source)
    Got my WarBRD with the Constellation grip over the weekend. It is pretty big for desktop use, height wise.

    Not sure this is gonna work. Will try it for a bit, might go for some monstertech mounts.... Down the rabbit hole...
    Why not get the Virpil ones? Way cheaper, and extremely well made. Not taking away from Monster Tech - they look to be an epic product,, but damn, the pricing difference...

    Originally Posted by BurnyBurns View Post (Source)
    No, they really aren't. They're over-specified, but the price is actually reasonable. I build basically copies of their design. Adding up the price of the parts alone, that is, the extrusions, clamps, screws and aluminium parts easily adds up to 40€-50€. One of these clamps costs ~20€. And I doubt they'll drive the price down significantly due to bulk orders. While most of that are standard parts just cut to length, their plates are custom made, which adds work hours.
    I agree with you there. the killer, for me, and the thing that stopped my order dead in it's tracks was shipping. Shipping to Aus was very close to the price of the mounts themselves. Nothing Monster Tech can do about that, as someone that is part of a business where shipping is an important part of the business, I can testify as to how hard it can be to get a good deal on shipping, unless you have huge volume to begin with. Of course, you don't get huge volumes without first being competetive on shipping... And the vicious circle goes as such.

    We got lucky, happened to sit down at a table at a bar whilst watching a World Cup game, and a courier company rep (as in one that manages Asia/Pacific, so fairly high up) was sat across from us. A few beers later... Deal struck.

    Moral of the story? Drink beer, improve your business!

    Z...

  4. #34
    The only blocker for me is the lack of an analog stick on the throttle. I use one on the F.16000 to control lateral thrust. Though I suppose I could get the Constellation to compensate...

    It would also be a fairly arduous transition. I'm used to using the hat switches on the Thrustmaster for nearly everything. For all the complaints about the TM joystick base buttons being useless, it seems the Virpil throttle faces the same issue.

    A bit off topic, but anyone know of recent developments with the VKB throttle?

  5. #35
    Originally Posted by NascentChemist View Post (Source)
    The only blocker for me is the lack of an analog stick on the throttle. I use one on the F.16000 to control lateral thrust. Though I suppose I could get the Constellation to compensate...

    It would also be a fairly arduous transition. I'm used to using the hat switches on the Thrustmaster for nearly everything. For all the complaints about the TM joystick base buttons being useless, it seems the Virpil throttle faces the same issue.

    A bit off topic, but anyone know of recent developments with the VKB throttle?
    There is a version of the T50 throttle in the works with an analog thumbstick - I'm waiting for that one.

    As for the useless buttons on the base - I'd agree, except...

    The T16000M does not match any other stick for number of bindings on the stick. If it had as many bindings as, say, the warthog, ANd it had the base buttons, fine.

    The VPC T50 has as many (more, actually) bindings as the CH Pro throttle *on the grip*, which, for me, right at this second, is the best throttle for ED that I can buy, with money. The VPC then adds a heap of buttons on the base in addition to this. Basically, I'm not losing buttons at my fingertips for buttons on the base.

    The layout of the T16000M buttons also makes it kinda hard to "feel your way" around them in the heat of battle. The VPC buttons are easier to navigate by feel, meaning a VR pilot is more likely to be able to get a hang of the locations quickly. Having said that, price difference, and I still think the T16000M is probably the best bang for buck stick out there for those with a limited budget, but looking for an accurate stick.

    Z...

  6. #36
    Originally Posted by Zeeman View Post (Source)
    There is a version of the T50 throttle in the works with an analog thumbstick - I'm waiting for that one.

    As for the useless buttons on the base - I'd agree, except...

    The T16000M does not match any other stick for number of bindings on the stick. If it had as many bindings as, say, the warthog, ANd it had the base buttons, fine.

    The VPC T50 has as many (more, actually) bindings as the CH Pro throttle *on the grip*, which, for me, right at this second, is the best throttle for ED that I can buy, with money. The VPC then adds a heap of buttons on the base in addition to this. Basically, I'm not losing buttons at my fingertips for buttons on the base.

    The layout of the T16000M buttons also makes it kinda hard to "feel your way" around them in the heat of battle. The VPC buttons are easier to navigate by feel, meaning a VR pilot is more likely to be able to get a hang of the locations quickly. Having said that, price difference, and I still think the T16000M is probably the best bang for buck stick out there for those with a limited budget, but looking for an accurate stick.

    Z...
    this virpil stuff is looking like the real deal!
    I'm keen to see what the Throttle with thumb stick is like. Personally, I've tried the CH pro throttle, the T16000M Throttle & the new x56 throttle.

    For me, the CH wins hands down because:
    • the analog stick is a THUMB stick, not forefinger like the T16000M. Thumbs more precise, multi-task better.
    • Every control is reachable with none, or minimal grip change required. The x56 sucks for this IMHO and i have big hands!


    sure, it feels less than smooth, and looks old skool, but when my new x56 had all the old known issues I was so relieved to be able to return it, and fall in love with the ch throttle again.

    so bring on the virpil one - I really hope they achieve those key design goals in particular.

    btw, thumbstick on the throttle for strafe thrusts essential for me. my brain does not compute when on the same hand as the main control stick.

  7. #37
    Originally Posted by Zeeman View Post (Source)
    There is a version of the T50 throttle in the works with an analog thumbstick - I'm waiting for that one.

    As for the useless buttons on the base - I'd agree, except...

    The T16000M does not match any other stick for number of bindings on the stick. If it had as many bindings as, say, the warthog, ANd it had the base buttons, fine.

    The VPC T50 has as many (more, actually) bindings as the CH Pro throttle *on the grip*, which, for me, right at this second, is the best throttle for ED that I can buy, with money. The VPC then adds a heap of buttons on the base in addition to this. Basically, I'm not losing buttons at my fingertips for buttons on the base.

    The layout of the T16000M buttons also makes it kinda hard to "feel your way" around them in the heat of battle. The VPC buttons are easier to navigate by feel, meaning a VR pilot is more likely to be able to get a hang of the locations quickly. Having said that, price difference, and I still think the T16000M is probably the best bang for buck stick out there for those with a limited budget, but looking for an accurate stick.

    Z...
    I wish it was so, but I have never heard or read anything from Virpil about this throttle version with an analog thumbstick.
    Is this a quick mod, or an actual new product, we don't know.
    If it is the latter then it will be at least two years away. I'm just not that patient...
    If it is a mod, something that the top thumb hat kind of looks like it could be, then that should be something I can swap in later.

    Originally Posted by SharkBiscuit View Post (Source)
    this virpil stuff is looking like the real deal!
    I'm keen to see what the Throttle with thumb stick is like. Personally, I've tried the CH pro throttle, the T16000M Throttle & the new x56 throttle.

    For me, the CH wins hands down because:
    • the analog stick is a THUMB stick, not forefinger like the T16000M. Thumbs more precise, multi-task better.
    • Every control is reachable with none, or minimal grip change required. The x56 sucks for this IMHO and i have big hands!


    sure, it feels less than smooth, and looks old skool, but when my new x56 had all the old known issues I was so relieved to be able to return it, and fall in love with the ch throttle again.

    so bring on the virpil one - I really hope they achieve those key design goals in particular.

    btw, thumbstick on the throttle for strafe thrusts essential for me. my brain does not compute when on the same hand as the main control stick.
    You should consider the Warthog throttle...
    It has at most five normal momentary buttons, only three of which is on the grip itself, and the main one under your pinky is so hard I have to shift so I push it with the ring finger.
    The main POV is under your index finger, and oddly so heavy I activate the sideways movements with my wrist..

    The rest are toggle switches.
    And hardly any games support toggle switches out of the box, not even DCS apart from the actual warthog a10 sims.
    So if you want to fly anything else you need to heavily program and script the unit so you can even start to use the buttons, or you are forced to activate each toggle twice.

    Oh, and most of the buttons on the base are often under hand of the actual throttle grip, so they swap being easily accessible to near impossible to reach depending on where the throttle itself is positioned...
    And if you like me use the throttle for helicopters as a collective, well you don't have the luxury of moving that around.
    The collective needs to be where it needs to be for the situation, and if it's not. You die five seconds later.

    I don't even try to use this for Elite. The virpil throttle at least seems to have all the necessary buttons and if they are like the ones on the mongoose, are just great, easy to engage for hours of play, with good tactile feel.

    Anyhoo, got a throttle and delta stick on order, no idea when I'l get them though..
    They claimed to deliver next month but don't really dare to hope.

    Also consider getting a second t-50 gimbal and use a twin stick setup for Elite.

    In the mean time, I'm also still using the CH throttle for elite.
    It just is too noisy for DCS, especially for using as a collective.

  8. #38
    Originally Posted by TorTorden View Post (Source)
    I wish it was so, but I have never heard or read anything from Virpil about this throttle version with an analog thumbstick.
    Is this a quick mod, or an actual new product, we don't know.
    If it is the latter then it will be at least two years away. I'm just not that patient...
    If it is a mod, something that the top thumb hat kind of looks like it could be, then that should be something I can swap in later.


    ...
    But it is so... It was stated when the throttle was announced, and has been stated several times since by Virpil reps.

    Z...

  9. #39
    Originally Posted by Zeeman View Post (Source)
    But it is so... It was stated when the throttle was announced, and has been stated several times since by Virpil reps.

    Z...
    I'm not doubting you.

    I just got too impatient to wait for anything.

    Besides I'm getting the delta stick with the thumbsitck as well, and I have intentions of ordering a second t-50 gimbal when they become available again.

    Curious if I should also get another delta stick or just run t-50 right handed and delta left handed..

    Decisions decisions.

  10. #40
    Originally Posted by TorTorden View Post (Source)
    I'm not doubting you.

    I just got too impatient to wait for anything.

    Besides I'm getting the delta stick with the thumbsitck as well, and I have intentions of ordering a second t-50 gimbal when they become available again.

    Curious if I should also get another delta stick or just run t-50 right handed and delta left handed..

    Decisions decisions.
    Fair enough. I have a CH Pro throttle for one of my rigs, and I make do with the Warthog throttle for the other (I explore when I use that system to minimise the need to deal with the throttle). Basically, I am in no rush - if I was buying something right this second though...

    Z...

  11. #41
    Marginally off topic, but what do you guys use for vertical and lateral thrust when not using a TM 16000 throttle? The paddle level and analog joystick work so well, I'm not sure what else I could use. Switching to digital buttons seems like a real step down.

    Any thoughts?

  12. #42
    Originally Posted by NascentChemist View Post (Source)
    Marginally off topic, but what do you guys use for vertical and lateral thrust when not using a TM 16000 throttle? The paddle level and analog joystick work so well, I'm not sure what else I could use. Switching to digital buttons seems like a real step down.

    Any thoughts?
    I have heard of maybe only, two-three people reccieving their throttle as of yet.
    It's not so much for Elite I buy it, but more for DCS. Until then I still have my CH throttle, which has a fully analog thumbstick, one that actually works well, hence why me and at least one other here stick with it.

    They say the Virpil throttle will get same eventually, I'm hoping this could be something I can swap in myself, until then,
    the Delta constellation grip has a thumbstick, seems to be similar and at least as good as to what is found on an xbx\ps controller.

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