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Thread: tough love

  1. #31
    Originally Posted by PCMR4Life View Post (Source)
    When in the last 10 years have you seen the PC get a better version of a game than consoles received? Never. Usually games are exactly the same across all platforms. Frontier is not going to give the PC something the consoles can't handle. It's just not going to happen. It also ridiculous that you expect them to essentially produce two different versions of the same game. [...]
    Far Cry 2 is an example which had more possibilities in the map editor on PC. I never said they should make a whole different version. They could simply release bigger maps for PC now. Console players already paid for the game and as you correctly said, have no right to cry about it, if we get bigger maps after release. So imo Frontier has nothing to lose with this. Now the majority is upset, but they can get the PC players on their side. Which should be their main focus anyway.

  2. #32
    Originally Posted by PCMR4Life View Post (Source)

    All multi-platform games suffer from simplification/dumbing down. This is nothing new and people should really be used to it by now. This game should have been a PC exclusive but it isn't. If you are playing this game on a console and complaining about certain issues than you have no right to complain. Cause you are basically helping support the dumbing down of games. You are helping consoles destroy gaming. The game is good, it would have been better as a PC exclusive. At the end of the day it is what it is. All the whining, crying and fit throwing isn't going to change things cause some things cannot be changed or "fixed".
    I think what you are saying is quite right to some extent. I know you’ve mentioned bits and parts here and there. So far I get your points about decoration/customisation and map size. Would you mind list down the others as well? Would like to know what you think and just want to have a better understanding of what we’re up against to set expectations accordingly.

  3. #33
    Originally Posted by SonOfTheSun View Post (Source)
    Far Cry 2 is an example which had more possibilities in the map editor on PC. I never said they should make a whole different version. They could simply release bigger maps for PC now. Console players already paid for the game and as you correctly said, have no right to cry about it, if we get bigger maps after release. So imo Frontier has nothing to lose with this. Now the majority is upset, but they can get the PC players on their side. Which should be their main focus anyway.
    A map editor in a game isn't really the best example cause most people would be buying the game for the single player and multiplayer. This was all the same across all three platforms. The only difference is the PC version of Far Cry 2 looked better. Otherwise all 3 versions were the same.


    So Frontier should anger and risk losing the console owners? You don't seem to grasp what the issue is. They made the game multiplatform cause consoles gamers outnumber PC gamers, It isn't profitable to depend on PC gamers alone, not anymore. Frontier needs the console market. Matter of fact most of their games are on consoles. Elite Dangerous is, Zoo Tycoon is and now JWE is as well. The only one that isn't on consoles is Planet Coaster. They will not give PC gamers something they can't also put in the console version of JWE cause it would be seen as slight against console players and it would be viewed extremely negatively. They simply can't afford to lose the console market. It would be bad for business.


    So no, they will never do that. Not in a million years.


    Also some of the changes people want would make the game an entirely different game.

  4. #34
    Originally Posted by JohnMiller1132 View Post (Source)
    I think what you are saying is quite right to some extent. I know you’ve mentioned bits and parts here and there. So far I get your points about decoration/customisation and map size. Would you mind list down the others as well? Would like to know what you think and just want to have a better understanding of what we’re up against to set expectations accordingly.
    I would say the map sizes have more to do with console hardware. I am using a i7 6700 and R9 390 and I can't get a steady 60 fps with this game on max settings. Matter of fact it doesn't matter what settings I use. If I turn everything down to low I can get a steady 60, with a quiet GPU and low heat. On max my GPU sounds loud and it goes up to 83 Celsius. While that's not an issue for the R9 390 cause they run warmer than most cards the noise is annoying. I counter this by locking the frame rate to 30 with MSI Riva Tuner. It's not an fps so I don't need a steady 60 frame rate.


    If my hardware has this level of difficulty with this game I can only imagine what obsolete console hardware must be like. Increasing the buildable areas sizes would mean there is more that has to be rendered. So even if they did manage to increase the sizes of buildable areas some how I wouldn't expect it to be too large. You will never get a full island cause that is impossible.


    As far as decorations and other customization options go it would be difficult for people playing with a controller. Having to place down every single trash can, bathroom building/stall, flower bed or fountain. As person who has played this game using a wired 360 controller I can say that it did work ok, but not great. But I wouldn't want to have to deal with placing down all those items individually with a controller. If they do as some kind of decorations to the game expect them to be simplistic. Don't expect Planet Coaster like options.

  5. #35

    Consoles arent a problem

    Originally Posted by PCMR4Life View Post (Source)
    As far as decorations and other customization options go it would be difficult for people playing with a controller. Having to place down every single trash can, bathroom building/stall, flower bed or fountain. As person who has played this game using a wired 360 controller I can say that it did work ok, but not great. But I wouldn't want to have to deal with placing down all those items individually with a controller. If they do as some kind of decorations to the game expect them to be simplistic. Don't expect Planet Coaster like options.
    I have to interject a bit here. (Literally had to create an account to do so)

    I disagree with what you're saying about console players almost entirely. I played JPOG on Xbox and PC for example and was completely fine with placing trash bins, bathrooms etc. I actually prefered early Sims titles on console and would play the newest if I hadn't returned it for feeling it didn't offer anything new. I loved building houses and was never bothered by a controller. Honestly, I think its a load of garbage to say consoles hold back the game market. I play Cities Skylines, Railway Empire, Zoo Tycoon, Tropico, Prison Architect, all on my Xbox One X. Mind you, those are just some of the world building games alone. Those are all very enjoyable games to me. Mind you, I had many of same gripes with Frontiers Zoo Tycoon originally as everybody else. The original game had space limitations on Zoo's that killed it. They fixed it and it is a great game now.

    I have been playing world building games on console since Sim City on SNES and the only thing that I have ever seen hinder games is bad developers. Maybe, relax on the console bashing a bit. After all, we all know what is REALLY hurting the games industry right now... Mobile/Freemium games are the real enemy. Command and Conquer mobile..grrr....

    For the OP... I keep coming back to these forums every few days HOPING for more official news. About 20 times I wanted to comment but was to lazy to create an account lol. I agree with the mantra of "Just be patient" but find it's harder and harder to do. I wish they would at least give us something more as far as details and timetables. I don't think tough love is needed. I do think that the company needs daily reminders that we, as well as all those who play, read, but remain silent ... Well we are all still here. We are all still waiting for you to do what you promised, deliver an amazing park builder. So far the consensus is that the game is okay with a huge amount of potential.

  6. #36
    While I think we need to be as honest with Frontier as we can in terms of the unfinished quality of the game, I don't want us to descend into the toxicity of r/JWE

  7. #37
    Originally Posted by Agron View Post (Source)
    I have to interject a bit here. (Literally had to create an account to do so)

    I disagree with what you're saying about console players almost entirely. I played JPOG on Xbox and PC for example and was completely fine with placing trash bins, bathrooms etc. I actually prefered early Sims titles on console and would play the newest if I hadn't returned it for feeling it didn't offer anything new. I loved building houses and was never bothered by a controller. Honestly, I think its a load of garbage to say consoles hold back the game market. I play Cities Skylines, Railway Empire, Zoo Tycoon, Tropico, Prison Architect, all on my Xbox One X. Mind you, those are just some of the world building games alone. Those are all very enjoyable games to me. Mind you, I had many of same gripes with Frontiers Zoo Tycoon originally as everybody else. The original game had space limitations on Zoo's that killed it. They fixed it and it is a great game now.

    I have been playing world building games on console since Sim City on SNES and the only thing that I have ever seen hinder games is bad developers. Maybe, relax on the console bashing a bit. After all, we all know what is REALLY hurting the games industry right now... Mobile/Freemium games are the real enemy. Command and Conquer mobile..grrr....

    For the OP... I keep coming back to these forums every few days HOPING for more official news. About 20 times I wanted to comment but was to lazy to create an account lol. I agree with the mantra of "Just be patient" but find it's harder and harder to do. I wish they would at least give us something more as far as details and timetables. I don't think tough love is needed. I do think that the company needs daily reminders that we, as well as all those who play, read, but remain silent ... Well we are all still here. We are all still waiting for you to do what you promised, deliver an amazing park builder. So far the consensus is that the game is okay with a huge amount of potential.
    Tolerating something doesn't mean it's good. Some of the complaints people have with JPOG is how it was too simplified for consoles. Just cause you were able to tolerate using a controller to play a game that would have worked better with a keyboard and mouse doesn't mean anything. Frontier is a professional game development studio and many of the design choices they made for the game were done for a reason. Obviously they kept things simple for the console players. This is obvious in the fact that so many people complaining about the lack of decorations compare the game to Planet Coaster which is a PC exclusive.


    I played JPOG, I have played Sim City games on consoles and the PC, I have played Theme Hospital on the PS Vita. Playing these games on consoles was terrible in comparison to how they were meant to be played, which is on a PC with a Keyboard and Mouse. If a console is all you have and can afford then of course you will tolerate some terrible controls. Depending on how badly you want to play the game. I played Wolf 3D and Doom on the SNES as well. It was a terrible experience compared to the PC. This isn't console bashing. This is the truth. Consoles have basically ruined games. I don't consider mobile games or free2play games a threat cause they are mostly garbage. Anyone who is really into gaming and wants a quality experience should know where to go and how to get it and the phone isn't one of them.

  8. #38
    Originally Posted by PCMR4Life View Post (Source)
    …Tolerating something doesn't mean it's good...
    My dad holds the exact same opinion as you. Decades ago, when I wanted a PlayStation, he said no. He would rather save up money to go for a better PC. He said PC is the future and I shouldn’t dumb things down. I think I have been brainwashed by him so I haven’t really owned or played any console games. It’s nice to see debates like this as I haven’t really had any experience with it.

    Originally Posted by Agron View Post (Source)

    …I keep coming back to these forums every few days HOPING for more official news. About 20 times I wanted to comment but was to lazy to create an account lol….
    Welcome to the JWE Forum, Agron! It’s nice to hear your voice! Please… don’t be lazy, now that you got your account, you should keep writing whenever you feel like it.

  9. #39
    Originally Posted by JohnMiller1132 View Post (Source)
    My dad holds the exact same opinion as you. Decades ago, when I wanted a PlayStation, he said no. He would rather save up money to go for a better PC. He said PC is the future and I shouldn’t dumb things down. I think I have been brainwashed by him so I haven’t really owned or played any console games. It’s nice to see debates like this as I haven’t really had any experience with it.



    Welcome to the JWE Forum, Agron! It’s nice to hear your voice! Please… don’t be lazy, now that you got your account, you should keep writing whenever you feel like it.
    I had consoles as well. But some games are just better on the PC. It's shame that the PC no longer gets many exclusive games.

  10. #40

    Expected

    Originally Posted by PCMR4Life View Post (Source)
    Tolerating something doesn't mean it's good. Some of the complaints people have with JPOG is how it was too simplified for consoles. Just cause you were able to tolerate using a controller to play a game that would have worked better with a keyboard and mouse doesn't mean anything. Frontier is a professional game development studio and many of the design choices they made for the game were done for a reason. Obviously they kept things simple for the console players. This is obvious in the fact that so many people complaining about the lack of decorations compare the game to Planet Coaster which is a PC exclusive.


    I played JPOG, I have played Sim City games on consoles and the PC, I have played Theme Hospital on the PS Vita. Playing these games on consoles was terrible in comparison to how they were meant to be played, which is on a PC with a Keyboard and Mouse. If a console is all you have and can afford then of course you will tolerate some terrible controls. Depending on how badly you want to play the game. I played Wolf 3D and Doom on the SNES as well. It was a terrible experience compared to the PC. This isn't console bashing. This is the truth. Consoles have basically ruined games. I don't consider mobile games or free2play games a threat cause they are mostly garbage. Anyone who is really into gaming and wants a quality experience should know where to go and how to get it and the phone isn't one of them.
    I expected a reply such as this with your name lol. I think it is important to point out that what you are saying is quite subjective. I get it though. In your opinion a keyboard and mouse are better controls. In my opinion opinion, a Xbox controller is better than trying to remember and hunt for keys on a keyboard and feels more intuitive. In the end its opinion. I used to get upset about mods on computer games but even those are starting to come to console IE Fallout 4 and Cities Skylines.

    I personally think that having multiple consoles doing well and competing with each other and PC only helps grow the industry. But that is my opinion and I am quite sure yours is different. I like to be sure to state that its opinion only and not hard fact. I love playing JWE on my console and in my opinion the controller isn't a hindrance at all.

  11. #41

    Thanks

    Originally Posted by JohnMiller1132 View Post (Source)
    Welcome to the JWE Forum, Agron! It’s nice to hear your voice! Please… don’t be lazy, now that you got your account, you should keep writing whenever you feel like it.
    Thanks! I think I will for a while. I own several frontier games and am liking JWE as well as hopeful for what it may become.

  12. #42
    Originally Posted by Agron View Post (Source)
    I expected a reply such as this with your name lol. I think it is important to point out that what you are saying is quite subjective. I get it though. In your opinion a keyboard and mouse are better controls. In my opinion opinion, a Xbox controller is better than trying to remember and hunt for keys on a keyboard and feels more intuitive. In the end its opinion. I used to get upset about mods on computer games but even those are starting to come to console IE Fallout 4 and Cities Skylines.

    I personally think that having multiple consoles doing well and competing with each other and PC only helps grow the industry. But that is my opinion and I am quite sure yours is different. I like to be sure to state that its opinion only and not hard fact. I love playing JWE on my console and in my opinion the controller isn't a hindrance at all.
    If you ever played a game with a keyboard and mouse and then had to play on a console you would understand. There is a reason why games that involve shooting often have auto-aim on consoles. Controllers just don't provide the level of accuracy a keyboard and mouse would.

    Also why would you need to hunt for keys on a keyboard? Most games these days display the keys and even buttons for a controller. It also not opinion. Keyboard and mouse being superior for games that require shooting and precision is a well known fact. Controllers might work for games that don't involve shooting or accuracy but when it comes to shooters the keyboard and mouse are king. Especially the mouse.

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