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Thread: Do you suppose ED will ever have configurable aerodynamics?

  1. #61
    Originally Posted by Winterwalker View Post (Source)
    I think the worry is that a new slowing effect makes 'spaceman speeds' feel (instinctively) that bit out further of reach. A design challenge when introducing a new drag factor because there already is one, with limited max speeds in no atmosphere (non frameshift).

    I agree with the anti-joust game reasons for the existing speed limits but maybe there isn't a huge amount of headroom for futher speed limiting, not impossible to overcome but a fair concern that it should be done without making the game feel like an old lady is doing the driving. Having aerodynamics cleverly brought into play is I think going to be pretty essential in order to (a) make atmospherics different from airless worlds while (b) avoiding slowing spaceships down to a crawl. Some of that may be down to perception (distances in ED may be bigger than they appear) but it's most child's dream to fly supersonic.

    Maybe (new) 'atmosphere-centric' ships worth a consider for (ships in ED are also bigger than they appear) or another approach could be to limit speed when hardpoints deploy (so they don't get blown off, like cargo scoops). With HP's stowed you can run valleys with impunity but in a fight you're brought back into dogfight mode.
    I think the reasons for the speed limits are more technical than gameplay concessions, which would arguably be much improved without them, as much with respect to combat as regular flight. Should fighters be allowed to joust or strafe bombers in a flight sim? Same deal here - you elect to fly a bigger, slower vessel, and so trade agility for capacity, or vice versa, and this aspect of the gameplay and gaming options are denied to the player when all ships are artificially limited to similar speed ranges.

    I'm frankly not bothered about ED - given up on it ever fulfilling its basic premise - i can enjoy seamless atmospheric transitions in FFED3D, from any orbit at any altitude, at any attack angle, any velocity (heat damage notwithstanding) - no canned FX, just the natural emergent interplay of gravity, mass, momentum & KE, and aerodynamic drag / heating effects. ED is intrinsically incapable of ever replicating that experience, i think...

  2. #62
    Many moons ago FD told us that the fed driftship would perform better in atmosphere than other ships.
    So if they stick to their plan, maneuverability will come down to a hidden value somewhere.

  3. #63
    [handwave]
    We already know that the technology exists in the 34th century to project force fields - not only our ships' shields, but also the "airlock" on orbital stations. Given that, I'd suggest that the in-game explanation (should there actually be atmospheric flight, and FD deem it necessary to explain it in the game) will involve the use of shielding/force projection technology to dynamically alter airflow as the ship moves through an appreciable atmosphere.

    [/handwave]

  4. #64
    Spacestations only need a rarified atmosphere in the docking area, and since Earth's air is mostly nitrogen (ie. inert from our point of view), it could be substituted with a much heavier noble gas, such as xenon. So your thin Xe/O2 atmosphere would then be confined to the perimeter of the rotating cylindrical bay area by centrifugal force, and unable to reach the letterbox... no airlock forcefield required.

    I'm not actually a proper HVAC engineer, though.

  5. #65
    Originally Posted by fus roh potato View Post (Source)
    Prove it. Give me a basic rundown of pressure coefficients and oblique shocks for supersonic flow over a simplified FDL profile at 20 degrees alpha and 550 m/s in an atmosphere comparable to earth's sea level. Convert those surface pressure differentials to force and show me how you estimate the max vertical thruster force provided in game. You can use flat plate theory for a rough guess if you want to do it by hand, but an oblique/expansion fan model through solidworks would be more impressive.
    I think he meant that our ships don't need aerodinamics to lift or manuver since that is very possible to do for our ships even in 9.8 G planets without the help of a fluid.

  6. #66
    Originally Posted by Brrokk View Post (Source)
    Knowing a bit about fluid dynamics, I'm pretty sure it would be beyond the capabilities of any of our PCs to do aerodynamic analysis for an irregular shape in anything close to real time.
    Unless you are KSP.

  7. #67
    Originally Posted by kofeyh View Post (Source)
    You can't ignore physics. You cant transition from > orbital speeds to not orbital speeds before you deorbit because that's impossible as you cant be going fast enough to be in orbit (or near it) to begin with. There still needs to be an SOI change.

    You've also just described made up hand waving using frameshift into atmo. Thanks for literally saying what I just said frontier would have to do. Make it up. Because reality isn't going to work.
    Actually it is possible so long as your velocity vector is in the proper place, for example, there's no limit as to how fast you can fall as long as there's no atmosphere.

    Originally Posted by Max Factor View Post (Source)
    Terminal velocity should be the same for everything no matter how big the object is.
    Not true at all.

  8. #68
    Of all the things I'm wishing they'd add to the game, this isn't one of them.

  9. #69
    Originally Posted by kofeyh View Post (Source)
    Better tell the OP, I'm just responding to what they said.

    Also that's the funniest thing I've read all day. You're brave claiming such things on the official forums. *chuckle*
    Don't see why Max would need to be brave. The Elite Universe has Witchspace, something which is completely fictional, that allows for FTL travel. As long as the performance of our FSDs in an atmosphere is consistent with what Frontier Developments has established about the "physics" of Witchspace, which IMO has been surprisingly consistent to date, I'll be happy.

  10. #70
    Originally Posted by Bounder View Post (Source)
    Spacestations only need a rarified atmosphere in the docking area, and since Earth's air is mostly nitrogen (ie. inert from our point of view), it could be substituted with a much heavier noble gas, such as xenon. So your thin Xe/O2 atmosphere would then be confined to the perimeter of the rotating cylindrical bay area by centrifugal force, and unable to reach the letterbox... no airlock forcefield required.

    I'm not actually a proper HVAC engineer, though.
    I imagine the mail slot to be a magnetic bottle where they contain a ionized/dipole vapour as a pressure seal between space and the atmosphere inside. That explains to me the different color, glowing and vapors injected into it.

  11. #71
    Originally Posted by Flowey View Post (Source)
    Not true at all.
    I was talking about the equation which I made clear in a later post. I will edit the original post to avoid any more confusion.

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