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Thread: Lack of Transparency is killing this game

  1. #16
    OP I get that you are disappointed with the update and that is your prerogative and opinion, if you think it is a disappointing update then you are perfectly entitled to that opinion however...

    Your suggestion that transparency is killing the game is way wide of the mark and your suggestion that nobody wanted a challenge mode are well wide of the Mark.
    As has already been pointed out the Devs asked what would folk like to be added to the game on here (Where it matters) and the two biggest requests was Dinosaur Sizes and a Challenge mode.
    Frontier delivered on both fronts with numerous other changes added as well. They are working brilliantly and delivering what fans asked for on their official wish-list thread (not what apparently a few select naysayers want on a small Youtube channels video).

    This is a Park Building game like planet coaster, a game where you may spend plenty of time but just as likely a game where you play for a bit, then put if on the shelf and returning later down the line (Rinse and Repeat), this is not a game designed to be a total time-sink like Elite is.

  2. #17
    Originally Posted by Chris Simon View Post (Source)
    The devs were clear in one thing. JWE was released as a basic game that will see years of both paid and free updates. We've seen this with Elite and Coaster. That's how Frontier operates.
    And the fact that they aren't blindly promising stuff months and years in advance, but rather focus on what they can deliver and then deliver it as it comes, I see as a big plus.

    I can see there you're coming from and I can respect that, although I don't necessarily agree with that. That's how the world works.
    Well, Frontier feels a little bit "oldschool" in the PR department, don't they? I like that we have roadmap in Elite and that's actually all I am asking for in JWE. Something basic like "Okay, 1.4 is out now and we're now evaluating your feedback and fixing some of the new bugs. Additionally, we're taking a look at aspect X of the game and seek ways to improve it. A first paid DLC is currently being planned and we're contemplating if it's about Y or Z." In Elite we know that the Q4 update will be about Exploration and Mining and that Squadron carriers have been delayed. We also know how the coming changes to Exploration look like. In JWE however, we didn't know anything about the contents of 1.4 until late August. Granted, Elite is older by a couple of years and JWE is only three month old. I'm willing to give them some slack here

    Don't get me wrong, I accept that his is just the way Frontier runs the PR for their games. Their company, their games, their calls. I can, however, not help myself and see how other game developers promote their games and continued content updates. An example for "best practice" is probably the development team for Stellaris. There's a new large update in the pipe that will (yet again) bring a major overhaul to the game. There are weekly Dev Diaries that explain the hows and whys and give some insight into the thought processes of the game designers. That's extremely cool and I love to read the diaries in detail (and the subsequent Q&A in the forum thread with the Devs).
    Sometimes I wish Frontier would be a just a little bit more like that.

    Yes, there will always be people that will complain about everything and anything. There will always be people that think a roadmap is set in stone and don't understand that things can (and will!) change during a development process. That's just the way of things and I hope Frontier will eventually ignore those people and give a nice "roadmap" or "vision for the future of JWE" to the rest of us


    Edit: as for the contents of update 1.4: I am more then happy with them and I really appreciate that Frontier listens to our Feedback. I am part of the crowd that asked for a challenge mode and I got my wish fulfilled. I am sure they have a vision for this game and are working hard on it. Contrary to other developers, JWE is not a money grab or "Just another product". You just have to take a look at the beautiful Dinosaurs to see that there's a lot of love and passion in the creation of it all.

  3. #18
    This is a direct quote from CM Paul Crowther on Reddit:-

    “We have an internal roadmap but we're not ready to share it with the community just yet. We want to be flexible right now so we can focus on your feedback and what's best for the game. That means things can shift around a fair bit.”

    Source:- https://www.reddit.com/r/jurassicwor...f3bfa/roadmap/

    Personally, the way I interpret this is – At current state of the game, besides not wanting to promise something they can’t keep, they don’t want to shut people off inevitably by saying no to their faces. They need space and time to maneuver and to shape the future of JWE. I believe even themselves are not certainly sure which direction they should really dive into. They want to cater as diverse the fan base as possible and move forward one step at a time.

    The fan base for this game is really diverse. Right off the head, I can think of 4 clans – Customization, Dino AI and Animation, Management Gameplays (Frontier themselves), and others. I’m from the AI and Animation clan. Even so, I cannot say for sure which direction is best for the game at current state. A flexible road map indeed has its merits here. By first going through basic things – giving some things to every clan, we are one step closer in figuring out the future of JWE. Imagine this – if they say no to one of the clan right at release, I believe the entire clan is gone. But if they only reveal the roadmap after giving something valuable to each and every clan, everyone will be more satisfied with tangible things to grasp and hence has a clearer head to determine the future better than before.

    Think of it this way – everyone is part of the equations now. If you feel strongly about a thing you want, just make it sounds as loud as possible. 1.4 really shows me they are willing to work with us. I hope the same applies to you.

  4. #19
    Originally Posted by MarcWP View Post (Source)
    A "Challenge Mode" was one of the things most people wanted on this forum? So yes they listened to the two topics that were discussed the most. Challenge Mode and the Dinosaur sizes. They delivered on both of them... I agree the game needs way more to keep me interested, but they gave us the two most talked about improvements from the community. You obviously haven't paid any attention since you don't know who asked for Challenge Mode...

    I come from Reddit. Here I am new.

    It is not what I and many people in the comments of the video and Reddit we asked tirelessly. Far from it.

    Incidentally, the Sandbox only work on Isla Nublar is another shame of the patch. And I do not remember seeing people asking so much for a Challenge Mode, in fact I did not even see it.

    It seems to me that just by having done so, now everyone is able to defend the new feature introduced.

    I think it's cool that I have the option of this game mode, but also not what this game needed most at the moment, and again, I'm complaining more the way Frontier reported his disappointing patch. The animation was theirs alone.

    I guarantee that even you expected more.

  5. #20
    Originally Posted by Rob At Work View Post (Source)
    HI OP,

    You're new around these parts aren't you, I can tell.

    Relax a little, get some air, the best things in life come to those who wait...and wait.... and wait......and wait.......and wait............n wait............ un weight............ ..........un........................................u..........
    ahahahahhahahaah

  6. #21
    YouTube comments and reddit posts are not read by the devs...

  7. #22
    Originally Posted by okxt2jzdjsrz View Post (Source)
    YouTube comments and reddit posts are not read by the devs...
    Yeah, but there are a lot more people than here. Many do not post in the Frontier forums, even they do not know.

    That is why I say that what the people asked for is not what arrived at 1.4.

  8. #23
    Originally Posted by Camargo View Post (Source)
    Yeah, but there are a lot more people than here. Many do not post in the Frontier forums, even they do not know.

    That is why I say that what the people asked for is not what arrived at 1.4.
    The problem with Youtube and Reddit is that for every useful comment there are hundreds that are complete trash.

  9. #24
    My post on that video got 52 likes, yall can figure out which one that is. I agree with the OP. I wont say 1.4 is a utter disappointment. It gives us carnivores that will hunt and not kill everything that moves....that's all we were told about other then size changes that i was looking forward to anyway. Im glad we have a real Giga. The new cameras are a great addition but i'd like the cameras to continue to be updated so we can see from inside the glass of the viewing platforms. The challenge mode is nice to give people a new reason to play. But i dont think it was something specifically asked for enmass. Yeah people said they'd like the game to be harder, have a money option on nublar.. But when i posted and read other posts on the wishlish thread most people asked for more content and gameplay changes that had nothing to do with a challenge mode.

    People asked for JP, LW, JW skins for dinos. More skins for jeeps and choppers. More dinosaur animations unique to species. Herding mechanics. Sleeping dinosaurs. Herbivores that played and tusseled with each other when they socialised. PACK HUNTING. Raptors that climbed fences. Struthis and Galis that couldn't head butt their way out of a concrete wall. A JP93 pack with original visitor center, safari truck ride, raptor paddock, org JP electric fences. People want decorations, statues, paddock signs. More terrain tools and options like rocks, different trees and ferns, different water, mud, sand....

    I feel like unveiling a challenge mode as a big surprise wasnt a great surprise. I could care less about it, it doesnt change the basic game. They stopped carnivores from constant killing, resized 4 dinos, added a couple new vocals, and had the dinos square off and then one run off in a panic. And with their territory duels they said the victor would taunt the loser but that doesnt even happen. Then they added some new cameras. It's a good start. But they havent expanded on the main game a whole lot yet. Im happy for the update and like the changes they have made. They have made the game more complete. Its nice to have the sauropods not be so much of a headache. Im thankful for the update. But i hope they dont think that's good enough. In future updates they better not go adding onto the challenge mode instead of expanding on the actual game.

    They need to work on and complete the terriotory duels. Add onto the cameras. An then go all out giving us new dino animations and behavior. I expect sleeping dinos, headbutting pachys, and pack hunting raptors in the next update.

  10. #25
    There's a positive takeaway from the update that's being overlooked simply because it's not "every necessary change made right away":

    There wasn't a single addition in this new update that wasn't asked for. Literally every aspect of this update was requested by the community, and some of it was demanded. OP must be living in a different dimension, because when Frontier first revealed sandbox mode before the game even launched, there was a HUGE outcry for more sandbox options and a challenge mode. To call the update a disappointment, well, that's rather silly, because the community asked for what it offered, and we received.

    That doesn't mean we shouldn't also get what you mentioned the game needs. It certainly does need more terrain tools and further improvement on the AI among everything else you mentioned, but let's take one thing at a time. You're not going to get everything all at once, and in the state the game is in currently, it would likely be more counterproductive than productive. For example, wanting more terrain tools and buildings is fine and all, but what good does it do when you can't place anything because of "terrain constraints" on every plot of land, an issue that terrain tools perpetuate more than fix?

    Point is, while the update wasn't everything the game needed, it's a step in the right direction and it was asked for by the community. To call it a disappointment is ignoring progress.

  11. #26
    Originally Posted by blubbit View Post (Source)
    There's a positive takeaway from the update that's being overlooked simply because it's not "every necessary change made right away":

    There wasn't a single addition in this new update that wasn't asked for. Literally every aspect of this update was requested by the community, and some of it was demanded. OP must be living in a different dimension, because when Frontier first revealed sandbox mode before the game even launched, there was a HUGE outcry for more sandbox options and a challenge mode. To call the update a disappointment, well, that's rather silly, because the community asked for what it offered, and we received.

    That doesn't mean we shouldn't also get what you mentioned the game needs. It certainly does need more terrain tools and further improvement on the AI among everything else you mentioned, but let's take one thing at a time. You're not going to get everything all at once, and in the state the game is in currently, it would likely be more counterproductive than productive. For example, wanting more terrain tools and buildings is fine and all, but what good does it do when you can't place anything because of "terrain constraints" on every plot of land, an issue that terrain tools perpetuate more than fix?

    Point is, while the update wasn't everything the game needed, it's a step in the right direction and it was asked for by the community. To call it a disappointment is ignoring progress.

    You say that my post is silly is an ignorance.

    I have argued with everyone so far, and no one has yet been able to convince me otherwise.

    To say that "ALL" asked for Challenge Mode is the only thing I've seen here. Honestly, that was not the most requested.

    And that's my opinion, and I do not think it's silly.



    And I did not say that it is not progress. But the patch is a disappointment.

    Do not misrepresent my post.

  12. #27
    Originally Posted by Flint2025 View Post (Source)
    My post on that video got 52 likes, yall can figure out which one that is. I agree with the OP. I wont say 1.4 is a utter disappointment. .
    Okay, I respect that. You liked the patch more than I did, but you understood what I meant.

    I think it's just silly to stand up for what Frontier has even done saying that my post is silly. You are one more example that my post has a meaning.

    I am a player, customer, and I have my opinion. I came here, wrote and debated normally with everyone who talked to me.

  13. #28
    Originally Posted by Camargo View Post (Source)
    Okay, I respect that. You liked the patch more than I did, but you understood what I meant.

    I think it's just silly to stand up for what Frontier has even done saying that my post is silly. You are one more example that my post has a meaning.

    I am a player, customer, and I have my opinion. I came here, wrote and debated normally with everyone who talked to me.
    Yes and that's totally fine! We're just saying that the "Challenge Mode" was one of the things most people wanted. So I believe that the majority is very happy with the update.

  14. #29
    First of all mate, just because a few companies have publicly released their roadmaps for projects doesn't mean that everyone should or that you are in any way entitled to see it. There are plenty of reasons why a roadmap may not be made public, and no small amount of that has to do with rabid fanbases misconstruing things. Open development is right for some companies and projects, it's not right for all, and i don't really care that this game is not one of those. Hell's sake, they made a whole specialized sub forum to hear and measure what the community wants most, they're clearly paying attention, wanting more than that just comes off as entitled.

    As for the update, i can tell you as a game dev myself, the time frame in which they released what was in that update, unless you've not read the massive patchnotes, was entirely realistic. I'm not going to go into the details of why, but yes, 3 months after release is a rather good time for a new game mode, big fixes to dino behaviour, resizing dinos which means having to go through animations and edit them, and many many many MANY other fixes and quality of life updates. Again, read the patchnotes.

    And Challange Mode is something noone asked for? Are you kidding me? The majority of the playerbase asked for that, they wouldn't have implemented it if they didnt. I myself was devastated when i found there was no free play mode outside of the campaign, like there was in JPOG. That was literally the meat of JPOG, the main game mode, and it was lacking here, instead being forced to go through the campaign. I wouldn't stick too much around most youtube comment sections if i were you, primarily th e negative youtube videos. It tends to attract the "Confirmation Bias" crowd, which are primarily there to feel superior by tearing something else down. The amount of entitled vitriol is so unpleasant and it breeds such a nasty attitude that it's harmful to anyone who is actually exposed to it for too long, as they often start adopting facets of it. I speak from experiance here.

    In short, what Lora said. You just can't please everyone, but i will add that some people really don't want to be pleased. They want to stroke their egos and think they know better than everyone. And then of course there are the youtubers who scream "this is dead and that is dead and the other thing failed, can it be saved, it died, It didnt die it was MURDERED". These are a particularly heinous bunch that do this not so much because they necessarily think it but because its a very clickbaity topic and again, draws in the confirmation bias crowd, people who -want- to think those things. Youtubers are out for views, dont you for a second think thats anything else but their endgame, and just like the mainstream media learned, when you are as ridiculously provocative as possible, you will gain a massive amount of attention, even if you do not for a second believe what you say.

    I will also say that if as you say, outside of this forum, these were not the most requested features, then you shouldve been more proactive, like the people who are actually -on- this forum to help shape the development. No dev is obligated to go read through the tragedy that is most youtube comments or reddit threads, where people bare some of their worst traits. The original wishlisht thread was linked on reddit, the moment i saw it i came here, made an account and posted a giantass wishlisht post, among which, yes, Challenge Mode was one of the top priorities. I do not think for a second that more dinos and more skins were more imperative. Also those are things that the art department works on. The Artists do not program dino behavior, do not program Challenge mode etc. The only thing the artists, and then only the animators among them, have been kept busy with in this update is the animation reworks for the sizes. So don't worry, they've very likely been busy with other content that is on it's way.

  15. #30
    the problem is they had to get busy working on things the game should've had from the start......it's a combination of poor decisions from the developers and the pressure of releasing the game at a fixed date resulting in a rushed game

    for example all the current changes from the latest update these are all common sense features the game should've had from the early stages of development, these are the type of things that should've been part of the foundation instead of post launch updates requested by the fans

    we as fans shouldn't have to request common sense features...it's your job as developers to figure out these things while the game is in development

    I wouldn't say this whole thing is killing the game but it definitely hindered the potential for the game to be at a better stage content wise since lots of time and resources were spent on smoothing the rough edges... instead of spending time working or resizing current dinosaurs the time could've been spent on making new ones... but having the correct sizes was a must so it had to be done.. oh well, at least now maybe they can focus on cool things like dlc's.

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