2.3 dev update feedback mega thread

[Kastor]

Remember: The biggest unit of power in any multiplayer game is the amount of people, not the amount of money. This is a pretty core part of multiplayer systems... to give you a reason to make some friends.

Asking to be able to emulate the power multi-crew will give with NPCs is asking to undermine this. If the truly solo version of the game was available as originally intended then YES, go ahead in that. But sadly for the solo players we all live in the same in game universe effecting the same goals, so if you can achieve by yourself with NPCs what takes me and two friends to achieve working together.... then why have friends at all.


NPCs can't replace players. Accept that two people will always be stronger than one, because if that wasn't the case many more of us would be alone.

 

[Von Elsner]

And this is my issue as well. The continued inconsistencies. Why can't I telepresence to any of my parked ships and fly them, why can't I dismiss the mothership while in a SLF if telepresence doesn't have a range limit. And that is just the beginning. Things like instant rebirth, cargo, restock etc and the rest is a convenience fo gameplay reasons.

So if winging up for Multicrew you have telepresence for convenience, when I wing up a ship with another ship, why can't I have my ship teleported over their for convenience. Otherwise I am just wasting my time flying the ship their myself.

When does it end. Why cant I transport from station to station, because its more convenient and it slows down my credit making if I have to fly.

I know, that those examples are not going to happen, but for me, they are just as valid.

This. I also wonder if telepresence , as it is so convenient, will dilute spacelegs when it turns up, why bother docking and walking through a station to someones ship. Is every station going to be that exciting that we are going to want to do it? I mean actually having to find someone to talk to to get a mission isn't very convenient and only adds a timesink.
Fdev are just creating a precedent where convenience always wins, once you give it to players they will always expect it.

 

[sgurr]

Man, what happened Sandro. You went from this:

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...-with-me-”-Ship-Management-in-Elite-Dangerous

To a remote turret mode?

I gave you rep but having read the link properly I'd like to take it back.

Most of that is in the game for the ship cmdr, the fact multicrew doesn't have the options is a different thing.

I'd like to see crew having more roles, for example, relevant to exploration and srv driving.

 

[Robert Maynard]

ED is no longer a priority product for FDev and hasn't been for a long time. Ongoing development is being handled by a minimal amount of people right now and it won't be long before most of them are moved to new projects.

Citation, please.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

This. I also wonder if telepresence , as it is so convenient, will dilute spacelegs when it turns up, why bother docking and walking through a station to someones ship. Is every station going to be that exciting that we are going to want to do it?

Yep, why walk anywhere when you can telepresence straight into the Faction office from you commanders chair. None of it makes any sense within the existing game lore.

 

[Windscreen Smudge]

I gave you rep but having read the link properly I'd like to take it back.

Most of that is in the game for the ship cmdr, the fact multicrew doesn't have the options is a different thing.

I'd like to see crew having more roles, for example, relevant to exploration and srv driving.

That wasn't his point.

What he linked was a well described and thorough list of fun and useful features.

Compare that kind of depth in game design to what we're getting with Multicrew. The huge gap in design quality is what he's highlighting.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

ED is no longer a priority product for FDev and hasn't been for a long time. Ongoing development is being handled by a minimal amount of people right now and it won't be long before most of them are moved to new projects.

Zero proof of this and is pure speculation.

 

[Robert Maynard]

No.

2 Multicrew controlling 2 SLF's is 3 players controlling 3 ships. 3 players in separate ships with 2 SLF's is 6 SLF's and 3 players in ships.

Kind of a big difference. A ridiculously OP difference.

Not so very different from the 3 players in 3 ships with one SLF each - they still have an advantage over a single ship with 3 players in it.

What two NPC SLF per player would do is give players who do not Wing up (and I expect that Frontier know what proportion of the player-base does not) a similar capability to a Multi-Crewed ship with three players on board.

 

[soma]

The PS4 port is possibly taking a lot of resources. But the good news is: after the PS4 they should finally be done with porting to different platforms and will hopefully have more resources to focus on game features again...

.. unless they would like to consider ports for Linux and the Nintendo Switch *ducks&runs*

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

The PS4 port is possibly taking a lot of resources. But the good news is: after the PS4 they should finally be done with porting to different platforms and will hopefully have more resources to focus on game features again...

.. unless they would like to consider ports for Linux and the Nintendo Switch *ducks&runs*

The group that are looking after the Xbone port are the same team that are looking after PS4 port. The Teams working on the content development of the game will be different.

 

[Windscreen Smudge]

Citation, please.

We are pleased with the strong financial
position of the business, having invested
£8.9 million in our two major self-published
franchises during the financial year (2015:
£4.3 million), with an increased proportion
of development relating to titles yet to be

released to 51% (2015: 30%).

51% in unreleased titles, not including Planet Coaster, which you can rest assured has the Lion's share of devs on it right now given that it's a new product that's still getting the kinks ironed out. If there's any doubt about that look at Planet Coaster's pace of development and compare that to ED.


http://ar2016.frontier.co.uk/assets/pdf/frontier-developments-2016-annual-report-and-accounts.pdf

Why are you so surprised? I told all of you this was going to happen because Horizons sales were garbage and it turns out the long tail wasn't enough to justify the continued pace of development.

Time and time again, I pointed out that FDev's business model wouldn't support the game, and you all poo-poo'd it and said that dreams can happen. Meanwhile, FDev is moving away from the seasons model because they are unwilling to keep up even the turtle's pace of development we're getting from Horizons.

Enjoy your dreams and rainbows. This is what you wanted.

 

[Oguska]

The PS4 port is possibly taking a lot of resources. But the good news is: after the PS4 they should finally be done with porting to different platforms and will hopefully have more resources to focus on game features again...

.. unless they would like to consider ports for Linux and the Nintendo Switch *ducks&runs*

Why hop in the consoles band wagon anyway for a sim based game, started with pc and sales is high enough already.Porting a game like this, must be pain in the nuts.Greed

 

[raymondo the great]

This. I also wonder if telepresence , as it is so convenient, will dilute spacelegs when it turns up, why bother docking and walking through a station to someones ship. Is every station going to be that exciting that we are going to want to do it? I mean actually having to find someone to talk to to get a mission isn't very convenient and only adds a timesink.
Fdev are just creating a precedent where convenience always wins, once you give it to players they will always expect it.

TBF I've never really got why people are so excited for walking around a station/ship

For me after doing it once I'll likely never want to do it again!

I bought elite to fly spaceships, not hang out in spacebars!

 

[Red Anders]

I do not personally agree with a lot of what gou say (personally i like ship transfers as they are, they offer a service, its still more efficient to do if yourself if you want as imo its vital its always more profitsble to do it yourself rather than have the game do it fir you, the game is still 100,% playable whilst using transfer, it offers potential future extra gameplay being timed that is simpky not possible if instant AND for the players who care about immersion of which i am one it IS more immersive not having magic ship transfer.

Multicrew is a bit diferent. The backbone around it is so poorly fleshed out that imo instant is the only way, at least for now. Sadly tho like exploratiion once instant is in i doubt it will ever change and it is imo a valid worry that it will affect future direction of the game (why walk around a station to go to get in a ship when i can fast travek there.

God i have digressed i doubt you will get to my point now....

But i totally agree with you that the 3x payout for 3 in a ship is complely lame, it has no logical sense at all. I can sort of get behind the slight trade dividend of trading in a group (encouraging safety in numbers coukd be seen as cost effective by an industry as it reduces the chances of lost cargo) and i coukd acceot a similar logic for multicrew but ultimately the suggestion of triple payouts is daft. The game is heading down a dark path imo.

I keep bleating oncabout it but FD not giving a toss about npcs is killing the game for me. I cant think of a space game which does not offer npc wing men andmukticrew shoukd be the cherry on top of the cake of npc crew not the cake itself (how have fd in good consience gone so far from ddf?)

Mukticrew shoukd be fun and this should be reason enough for it in and of itself where as FD seem to be going the route of encouraging use simpky by throwing in game money at it.

And as for the walking away without a criminal record? In what universe is this not going to create 3 player griefer boats?. SDC et al will be rubbing their hands with glee. Even if not as effective as 3 shios in a wing it does not matter, it will be a stealth ship un!ike a wing of 4 which stands out a mile and will instantly get akarm bells ringing from a lone wolf (unkess we get magic scanners which know how many are in a ship)

I have gotten my monies worth out of the game already, but that said the more ED goes on the further away it gets from the game i backed

Just so we're clear I'm fine with ship transfers as they are now too. I didn't really have strong feelings either way about delays on the basis that I'd played the game to that point with no ship transfers at all and I didn't vote in the official poll about transfers for exactly that reason - some people obviously did feel strongly about the two options and I didn't think it ws fair of me to basically make an arbitrary choice just for the sake of voting when I just wasn't that bothered. I was just saying that there was definitely a decent chunk of people arguing against instant transfer because of immersion reasons because I'm tired of people presenting it as if nobody was saying that and everybody was instead making nuanced points about gameplay.

 

[Windscreen Smudge]

Not so very different from the 3 players in 3 ships with one SLF each - they still have an advantage over a single ship with 3 players in it.

What two NPC SLF per player would do is give players who do not Wing up (and I expect that Frontier know what proportion of the player-base does not) a similar capability to a Multi-Crewed ship with three players on board.

Do you even combat?

I'm training up a pilot right now and one thing is dead obvious about SLF's. You've got to babysit them, because if you don't the NPC's will just park and rotate to line up on them and nuke them.

Put two SLF's on one target and that can't happen. Now those two SLF's are completely independent, doing silly amounts of damage, and I'm left to do combat on my own with another target after tagging their victim to make sure I get the bounties.

The difference between 1 SLF and 2 SLF's is huge. You go from being able to do a little extra damage to having the force projection of 2 players.

 

[soma]

The group that are looking after the Xbone port are the same team that are looking after PS4 port. The Teams working on the content development of the game will be different.

I wasn't entirely serious

But even though the teams may be different, show me one software project where developing parallel versions does not slow down progress (unless you just branch and plan to never merge again. But usually you will need to coordinate your architecture and efforts, thus overhead).

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

51% in unreleased titles, not including Planet Coaster, which you can rest assured has the Lion's share of devs on it right now given that it's a new product that's still getting the kinks ironed out. If there's any doubt about that look at Planet Coaster's pace of development and compare that to ED.


http://ar2016.frontier.co.uk/assets/pdf/frontier-developments-2016-annual-report-and-accounts.pdf

Why are you so surprised? I told all of you this was going to happen because Horizons sales were garbage and it turns out the long tail wasn't enough to justify the continued pace of development.

Time and time again, I pointed out that FDev's business model wouldn't support the game, and you all poo-poo'd it and said that dreams can happen. Meanwhile, FDev is moving away from the seasons model because they are unwilling to keep up even the turtle's pace of development we're getting from Horizons.

Enjoy your dreams and rainbows. This is what you wanted.

Sorry but that doesn't say anything about who is working on what project. Planet Coaster has their own team, and ED has theirs with maybe a few that cross over.

ED is a far more complex beast then Planet Coaster, so comparing them and the development pace is pointless.

We also have no idea what the Horizons sales are as there is no information about that. Again zero evidence and pure spectulation on your part.

I also suspect we are moving away from the seasons of upgrades, not because of development time, but because it isn't cost effective. But again that is an opinion of mine nad not a fact until FDev actually come out and say something concrete.

 

[raymondo the great]

51% in unreleased titles, not including Planet Coaster, which you can rest assured has the Lion's share of devs on it right now given that it's a new product that's still getting the kinks ironed out. If there's any doubt about that look at Planet Coaster's pace of development and compare that to ED.


http://ar2016.frontier.co.uk/assets/pdf/frontier-developments-2016-annual-report-and-accounts.pdf

Why are you so surprised? I told all of you this was going to happen because Horizons sales were garbage and it turns out the long tail wasn't enough to justify the continued pace of development.

Time and time again, I pointed out that FDev's business model wouldn't support the game, and you all poo-poo'd it and said that dreams can happen. Meanwhile, FDev is moving away from the seasons model because they are unwilling to keep up even the turtle's pace of development we're getting from Horizons.

Enjoy your dreams and rainbows. This is what you wanted.

You have proof that horizons sales are garbage? Because that's not what their investor report said...unless you think they are lying to investors and the stock market? In which case prison most surely awaits! And as an obviously honourable citizen it's your civic duty to take any evidence you have to the police....

As for planet coasters pace of development? I have it, bought it on release, it took several months to fix a bug where nobody bought stuff from souvineer shops after the first month. Personally I don't see it being developed any faster!

Your link is to a document that talks about xbox one release! This was as we all know in 2015! Did you realise it was till end of financial year that ended over 6 months ago? Because it predates Planet coaster release and appears to have no information relevant to either your sales assentation's or any of your other points...which of course have nothing to do with 2.3 anyway.....

 

[Windscreen Smudge]

You have proof that horizons sales are garbage? Because that's not what their investor report said...unless you think they are lying to investors and the stock market? In which case prison most surely awaits! And as an obviously honourable citizen it's your civic duty to take any evidence you have to the police....

As for planet coasters pace of development? I have it, bought it on release, it took several months to fix a bug where nobody bought stuff from souvineer shops after the first month. Personally I don't see it being developed any faster!

Your link is to a document that talks about xbox one release! This was as we all know in 2015! Did you realise it was till end of financial year that ended over 6 months ago? Because it predates Planet coaster release and appears to have no information relevant to either your sales assentation's or any of your other points...which of course have nothing to do with 2.3 anyway.....

Wanna try that again? I just linked the financial report.

Elite Dangerous
is now in its second
year of release. The attach rate of
Elite Dangerous: Horizons
to the base
game was initially lower than expected,
but unit sales of the base game were
higher at the same time.

Nice bit of doublespeak for "Our Expansion flopped but it's okay because we made up for it by selling other things."

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Do you even combat?

I'm training up a pilot right now and one thing is dead obvious about SLF's. You've got to babysit them, because if you don't the NPC's will just park and rotate to line up on them and nuke them.

Put two SLF's on one target and that can't happen. Now those two SLF's are completely independent, doing silly amounts of damage, and I'm left to do combat on my own with another target after tagging their victim to make sure I get the bounties.

The difference between 1 SLF and 2 SLF's is huge. You go from being able to do a little extra damage to having the force projection of 2 players.

Also why would they stop development of it when it is about to be released on PS4. Doesn't make any sense, sorry.

- - - Updated - - -

Wanna try that again? I just linked the financial report.



Nice bit of doublespeak for "Our Expansion flopped but it's okay because we made up for it by selling other things."

It says lower then expected initially, so that was at first, not now. I would say that most people that buy the game now get the deluxe edition that has horizons with it, which will constitute a sale in Horizons.