2 Questions for Combat Vets

[Amanojaku]

1) Is Chaff worth it on Large ships, or should I just add another Booster?

I usually run 6 Boosters (5 Hvy Duty and 1 Thermal, due to Reinforced shields), with 1 HSL (increased cap) and 1 Chaff (increased cap). I figure I can get more overall protection popping chaff vs gimballed ships, than I would get form another Booster. However, I wonder if chaff on large ships makes much of a difference, as even with chaff it seems many of the shots land, especially on the ship's broadsides.

2) Are the hurtboxes bigger for active shields than they are for the hull (for any size ship, not just large)?

I was just wondering about this, as when I was thinking about the first question it made me think about hurtboxes on ships in general.

 

[Quantis Trap]

I think chaff is worth it especially if you get in a situation where you've ed off everyone and need to leave fast! In that case one more booster is of less value.

I think big ships with their 8 util slots shouldn't rely one more than four or so boosters. Shield tanking on a big ship makes for lazy combat. If that's what you want once in a why that's good, but it gets boring.

 

[Iron Golem]

I found chaff useful in large ships. Especially with the assassination missions where the pirate lord has his cohort of cronies. It can also come in useful for cz (When you are engaged with multiples and also get jumped by the entire spec ops wing!) And in haz rez when you battle wings.

PvP less useful against meta builds running fixed (Who tend to be damn accurate with em) but helpful in organic pvp ex: cg against impromptu fights with other pve equipped players.

I found chaff more useful in the large ships when I started running FA off and felt less like a sitting duck giving constant movement and awkward angles.

I don't run it on ships I plan to pvp in but usually make room on my pve ships.

Shields will increase the hitbox. Things that may miss hull will connect with a shield in my experience. Could be a misconception on my behalf but I'm pretty sure...

 

[Vedmo]

1: I don’t run chaff on large ships, but I have been annoyed by chaff on large ships I’ve been shooting at. Range is an important factor. Whether or not chaff will reduce more damage than a booster would add to shield value depends on so many factors I don’t really see how one could compute it.

2: Yes, shields give any ship a larger hit box.

edit: I shouldn’t factually state shields have larger hit box than hull. I might be wrong on that, just going off of observation. I have definitely been shooting fixed weapons that were showing the visual effect of hitting shields past the edge of the hull, then when the shields dropped I was not hitting the hull, so it appears that way to me.

 

[stereoBear]

1) Is Chaff worth it on Large ships, or should I just add another Booster?

Between you being a giant target and NPCs having a mix of gimballed and fixed equipped anyway, chaff is just not worth it. Especially once you did some engineering and it doesn't matter if you get hit or not anymore.

 

[Trollymctrollerson]

I would say it depends on the ship. Cutter is fast enough that a chaff will make a difference at a distance. A T10 on the other hand is going to have NPCs right on top of it because its slow. If you are talking about pvp than in my experience the players who pose a legitimate threat are just going to laugh at your chaff. Also, if you are flying a T10 or anything that you also haul cargo in, consider a point defense turret on the belly of the ship to defend against hatch breakers. Your loadout of all HD boosters could be optimized a little bit if you replaced one with a resistance augmented. You should see a modest increase in effect strength against all attacks except absolute but it will also increase the efficiency of each SCB you fire off. And yes, shields up have bigger hitbox.

 

[Vahnkiljoy]

I don't see why not, it cuts down on getting hit so, really, I don't see any reason NOT to take chaff, I just wish the dedicated button for chaff didn't fire ALL chaff on your ship.

 

[CMDR DragonHorn]

If you have an access to engineering, Chaff is useless on anything bigger than Asp. Even on non-combat ships it's waste of slot IMO. I used to have one on my T9 miner/trader, but eventually swapped out for PDT, less weight - more potential protection against some pesky missiles and especially limpets.

Chaff works only against Gimballs, turrets and fixed completely ignore it.

 

[Vedmo]

I just wish the dedicated button for chaff didn't fire ALL chaff on your ship.

It doesn’t for me. I have several ships running double chaff, none of them are in fire groups, and when I use the key bind for chaff it only pops one per press (PC).
Same for heat sinks.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

I stopped using Chaff a long time ago. PDTs are now my primary utility slot.

On big ships i don't find chaff that useful. On small ships i should be avoiding getting hit. Its also not like the general lasers and stuff that cause real damage most of the time. Its those with PAs and rails that are nasty, and those are fixed, so chaff is useless.

PTDs on the other hand are useful for when your shields drop because it seems like every NPC and their mother carries at least one missile launcher. In a CZ this means the moment your shields drop you get lots of missiles coming at you.

Shield Boosters i add sometimes, mainly for resistance. If i'm wanting raw shield power rather than resistance though, i'll add Guardian shield boosters.

 

[Amanojaku]

If you have an access to engineering, Chaff is useless on anything bigger than Asp. Even on non-combat ships it's waste of slot IMO. I used to have one on my T9 miner/trader, but eventually swapped out for PDT, less weight - more potential protection against some pesky missiles and especially limpets.

Chaff works only against Gimballs, turrets and fixed completely ignore it.

Do turrets ignore chaff? I thought any automated or assisted fire was affected.

 

[Quantis Trap]

There's no one answer to this question. Chaff, PDTs, ECMs, Boosters, etc all have there place depending on play style, ship and scenario.

Do turrets ignore chaff? I thought any automated or assisted fire was affected.

Turrets are definitely affected by chaff. I believe, only fixed weapons and locked seeker missiles are not.

 

[Iron Golem]

Chaff will pay bigger dividends in pve as you are fighting more and more simultaneous opponents. It may not do much to circumvent a single ship, none if that ship has fixed weapons, but the amount of damage it will prevent you from taking even in a large ship in say, a high rez where you just tagged system security and now you have ten ships focusing you, it may mean the difference between life and death. Keeping you alive long enough to wake out.

The more experience you have the less neccessary it maybe but I still find it very useful in large fights where you are outnumbered. Small ships will also spew chaff for longer than big ships (If I remember correctly) so will have diminishing returns there.

You may hear people reference double chaff which just means you have two chaff modules so as you use one it has a cooldown period, you can use the other to keep it going non stop (Again can be very useful in fights with multiple opponents).

 

[Bantha]

I’ll answer your questions in reverse..,

Shields - bigger hitbox? Yes

Chaff - useful? Well... that very much depends (and that’s a good thing right?)

Chaff is good here:-

• Running away. If you have an armoured trader for example, or any ship where you might want to boost away, chaff is useful, even on a large ship
• Multiple enemies. E.g. when you take out that pirate anaconda, then 5 of his cronies pop up out of nowhere. You know the one. Hitting chaff when they turn up is a good idea
• Range. Attacking your enemy with long range weapons means you’re a small target, and so chaff does work well here, even on a large ship

Chaff is less effective here:-

• 1v1. In a large ship it’s not gonna help you too much
• Close range. If bounty hunting in a Haz Res you can usually get close up to the target before opening fire. Close range chaff on a large ship? Nah...
• PvP. Now this one is contentious, and I could be swayed either way. But for me, if my enemy is relying on gimbals or turrets for PvP, I’m confident I can take them anyway. If they’re on rails, PAs and the like, chaff is useless and I’ll need that extra shield boost.

I always know what I’m going to be doing when I leave the station, and I equip / don’t equip chaff before I leave, depending on the scenario I’m heading in to...

Hope that helps.
Happy to debate with others who may disagree...

 

[Morbad]

1) Is Chaff worth it on Large ships, or should I just add another Booster?

NPCs frequently use gimbaled weapons and at medium to long range chaff will reduce incoming damage by a fair bit as long as it holds out.

After shields fail it can protect subsystems from gimbaled kinetics, which are still fairly common, in organic PvP encounters.

However, on the balance, another booster, or PDT, heatsink launcher, or even ECM is usually better. Chaff is extremely situational against other CMDRs especially while in a large vessel, and not necessary against NPCs.

2) Are the hurtboxes bigger for active shields than they are for the hull (for any size ship, not just large)?

Yes.

 

[CMDR DragonHorn]

Do turrets ignore chaff? I thought any automated or assisted fire was affected.

I tested it myself quite recently, and it fully confirms what's been said in this thread:

Turrets not affected by chaff?

Just a quick thing, I thought chaff affected turrets? I just just came up against someone and chaff had no effect at all yet the wiki says It affects turrets

forums.frontier.co.uk

I don't believe anything in that regard changed from like a week ago, or since 2015, for that matter...

And to add to my post above, player can also simply un-target Gimballs, and completely ignore Chaff as well. NPC's are unaware though. Don't tell them, ok?

 

[here_it_comes]

1) The only large ship I fly is the T10, and only here and there for the dakka giggles. I never bother with chaff on it, you have to be flying pretty incompetently in a large ship to be worried about NPCs killing you. Large ships are a big easy button for PVE.

2) Good Q, don't know.