Are you feeling ok mate? I have one forum account. You can calm down.
A Simple Solution to Combat Logging
- Thread starter Mimix
- Start date
Are you feeling ok mate? I have one forum account. You can calm down.
Wrong again. Section 4 is acceptable use. The language does not explicitly restrict the application of these statements to a specific context.
Just because you think something should only refer to a limited application means nothing.
I’m not arguing with you any more. I have given you the information. If you disagree, take it up with Frontier Developments. Combat Logging is not in the EULA and no company can legally force you to continue to play their game against your will - that’s tantamount to slavery. This really should not be a controversial concept. If you decide to shut down the game at any time and for any reason, no-one can stop you. Any attempt to do so would very quickly result in the development company being heavily fined. Continued efforts to do so would probably end with them being closed down. It’s illegal. Simple. End of conversation.
IMO there's two distinct situations that can happen:
1. A battle between 2 players where they are willingly fighting each other. One player starts to lose and they rage quit. This should have a real penalty.
2. A ship is in space and gets attacked unwillingly by you have to admit, 90% of the time a way better player with a much bigger, better, and engineered ship who just gets off on wiping other ships. In this case, the attacked player should be able to log out.
The only real solution is have a combat invite where you challenge someone to duel it out, either alone or in a wing.
-k
1. A battle between 2 players where they are willingly fighting each other. One player starts to lose and they rage quit. This should have a real penalty.
2. A ship is in space and gets attacked unwillingly by you have to admit, 90% of the time a way better player with a much bigger, better, and engineered ship who just gets off on wiping other ships. In this case, the attacked player should be able to log out.
The only real solution is have a combat invite where you challenge someone to duel it out, either alone or in a wing.
-k
You're arguing with a "Forum Lawyer" - I have happy memories of exchanging the views with another, now departed, forumite who considered himself well-versed in UK Consumer Law
I would just like to point out that Ganker's, Griefer's and PvPer's are all in their own separate categories (and are just part of multiplayer games) ....
Cheating / Combat Logging / Hacking / EULA violating - all belong in the same category (And should be bannable)....
....apart from that....I'm not touching this thread with a ten foot pole!
Cheating / Combat Logging / Hacking / EULA violating - all belong in the same category (And should be bannable)....
....apart from that....I'm not touching this thread with a ten foot pole!
You're arguing with a "Forum Lawyer" - I have happy memories of exchanging the views with another, now departed, forumite who considered himself well-versed in UK Consumer Law
I am no lawyer. But there are 3 things I would like to point out:
1) I discussed this a few years ago with a friend who literally is a contract lawyer, so I did seek expertise.
2) I discussed this a few years ago with Frontier. They were incapable of advising which section, if any, in the EULA prohibits that method of exiting the game.
3) It should be intuitively obvious to everyone that forcing people to play a game against there will is not something any game or company can legally do.
This is just wow...how about to calm down a bit. Nobody is forcing anybody to play the game or not. This whole thing here is about HOW you quit the game. Leaving the game via the main-menu is legit. Quitting the game by pulling the plug or Alt-f4 is NOT legit. FDev clearly stated THAT as an exploit. Plain and simple. No more EULA-nitpicking necessary.
Bottom Line.
I would just like to point out that Ganker's, Griefer's and PvPer's are all in their own separate categories (and are just part of multiplayer games) ....
Cheating / Combat Logging / Hacking / EULA violating - all belong in the same category (And should be bannable)....
....apart from that....I'm not touching this thread with a ten foot pole!
I'd seriously like to know what the discernable difference is between a PvPer and a Ganker, at this point. I'll leave "griefer" to the side for the moment, considering it's a hotly debatable (and arguable derogatory, akin to "carebear") term.
PvPer's seek out challenging combat (usually consensual)
Gankers GANG up to secure as many kills as possible (usually non-consensual)
(of course theres a mid ground between the two, and cmdr's sometimes switch from one to the other, but my point is, there is a difference)
it is indeed an exploit. It is indeed undesired. It is indeed not in contravention with the EULA, which is the only basis on which FD can reprimand anyone.
As discussed, you have been given the information. It’s entirely up to you if you choose to ignore it. It is of no consequence to me. You are welcome to keep complaining over people not playing with you if you wish. Or you can get over it and move on. The choice is yours.
Is this a consensual term used by the entire playerbase, or just your personal opinion?
More references to things that totally happened and prove you right. Many people say you're right, according to you.
The EULA disagrees, of course.
Ah, you brought your very own strawman. Swell.
Just my opinion, but based on alot of experience.
Gankers just want the kill - a PvPer will agree to rules before hand, send a friend request, discuss builds and tactics, meet up for further duels....maybe even join a squad together? That kind of thing y'know?
Again - just my experience. No Salt from me either way - its all fun
What we all now know as well is that you do not know what a strawman is. As amusing as it is, people are still combat logging. Why don’t you contact Frontier and ask them yourself where in the EULA stipulates clogging as being in contravention of terms and conditions? Once you have that information, PM me?
Alright, let's try to break this down in a way you cannot possibly fail to comprehend.
The EULA said:
The EULA explicitly states that, among the Codes of Conduct that all players agreeing to it around bound, exploits are not permitted.Code of Conduct said:
This is objective information, referenced and sourced.
As I have said, no-one can legally force you to stay logged into a game against your will. Nor can they punish you for logging out when you choose. That’s the bottom line. Move on. This is boring.
Pretending that the discussion has anything to do with "forcing" players to play the game is very much a strawman argument. Nobody made that claim.
I don't need to contact Frontier, since I've pointed out where it is in the EULA several times now.The definition of strawman said:
I will take a stab at this one (dons asbestos underwear and Kevlar coat)
PVPer comes in all shapes and sizes while a Ganker (i think the term has ties to the ancient GangKill) will choose opponents they can quickly kill with the least amount of fuss.
I dont think the Ganker (alone or in a group) is necessarily of malicious intent although possible not a qualifier.
I could be wrong these things seem to change with the seasons.
As far as a way to determine a legitimate disconnect from an actual combat log (not including a menu log because that is always legit per FDEV) under the current set of code etc
is really not something I have the expertise to figure out.
Is it even possible? And if it is possible (perhaps although i doubt simple enters into the solution) is it a problem worth the time/effort/cost to fix.
To top it all off you have to consider false positives and other shenanigans the more nefariously minded people might employ to mess with someones day.
Getting someone to log off/ low wake/ highwake/ blowing them up results in pretty much the same thing. A delay in the other person being able to complete a task. Other than causing them to not have fun I dont see how any of the options is less of a win.
Of course I could be wrong, i have seen myself be wrong before.