Newcomer / Intro About to buy an ASP...

[Lhynn]

I'm babysitting 10 millions just because I don't want to get of my Cobra... I know I should buy a T6 to do some "serious" rare trading and get more money, but still, I can't find myself able to get off that beauty. I love that little, FAST ship... actually seeing the docking computer doing 2-3 boosts around the station with the Cobra is something really really funny

Indeed Though the docking computer is a lazy luxury xD I only use it on hard to manoeuvre ships, namely the T6 (which definitely deserves its label of a "space truck", it's enough to see it retroboosting, full engines roaring, while painfully - almost desperately - trying to reduce speed before entering a station to understand why, great moments of panic guaranteed when you understand a bit too late that you might have gone a bit too fast and a bit too much sideways not to ram the station upfront like a fat ox, haha). However, it's not the topic here so I won't comment much but if you want to PM me I'll be glad to explain to you why trading ships, starting from the T6 and on, are not suited for rares trading but for wholesale shippings of general goods and minerals only

 

[Ranualf]

You can also buy a CHEAP ASP from Alioth

Base cost of an ordinary ASP is 6.6 mill CR, or if you buy it from Alioth its 4.8 Mill at the Irkusk station.

You can also buy the Orca for 38 million vs the 48 million base cost also..

Fly safe and buy cheap!

 

[Astarox]

Wow, I did not expect so many replies, thank you everyone.

There is a lot to consider now, so I think I will keep running with the Cobra a while longer.

Question about buying in Alioth...how do you get the permit to go there? I guess it has something to do with Powerplay? I haven't done any of that yet.

 

[newman1702]

...beaten by the Diamondback Explorer, which is also much cheaper.

Beaten only in price, really, and when both are fully kitted the price difference isn't even that big. People go on about thermals but with a properly set up Asp heat is never an issue. The Asp can mount a much larger scoop, which to me is a big deal for an explorer. I dip my nose in a corona and am filled up (after a fast route jump) before the star scan is finished, without ever hearing any heat alarms buzz. Now, I will say that the DBE offers very similar overall performance for exploration for a bit lower price, and looking at just exploring it may be a better "bang for buck" choice, but I'm not that hot and bothered about price differences as I tend to buy ships once, and especially for explorers, rebuy costs shouldn't be an issue, knock on wood

As for other roles, the Asp simply hands down beats the DBE. It may not have the strongest shields out there but they are still more powerful than the DBE. It's also more maneuverable and offers better firepower, excellent hardpoint placement and more options internals wise. Not saying the DBE is bad at all, it does what it says on the tin, and does it well, but there's a reason for it's lower price; while it's definitely comparable to an Asp in exploration, having it's own, inexplicably vocal fan club in that regards, when it comes to setting it up for other roles is where it starts losing to the Asp. Properly set up, the Asp is a decent little gunship with scary amounts of forward firepower, while still being able to haul enough cargo and have enough jump range to be a great rare trader. It's also quite fast on thrusters only. I understand we get emotionally attached to our ships, and want them to be the best, but realistically the DBE isn't as great as a lot of people want to portray it. Heck, I'm totally in love with my Cobra but do have to acknowledge that the Asp beats it in a lot of ways. I still get sentimental about my Cobra while my Asp is more of a tool for the job. For all things bubble, I simply had more fun in the Cobra even if it gets outperformed by the Asp in firepower, shielding and cargo capacity. It's not always about logical reasons, and that's fine

Lastly, I know people hate the Asp's looks, well I don't really care for the DBE's; to me it looks like a bloated BSG raptor with a yellow, non changeable paintjob. Immersion wise it kind of looks cramped, not the sort of ship I'd want to cross the galaxy in. At least the Asp looks like it might have a comfortable cabin in there somewhere

 

[ellay]

I kept my cobra until I could afford the T6 as well.

The T6 is a nice little cargo hauler, and will bump up your profit quicker than the cobra. Plus you can land it on outposts.

But I kept the cobra for combat missions, and retrieval missions where I needed a bit of firepower as backup.

I'd hold off going for the asp If I were you, you'll need a lot more money to kit it out properly. It's great for exploring, but you'll miss the experience of flying the T6

 

[Dommarraa]

Wow, I did not expect so many replies, thank you everyone.

There is a lot to consider now, so I think I will keep running with the Cobra a while longer.

Question about buying in Alioth...how do you get the permit to go there? I guess it has something to do with Powerplay? I haven't done any of that yet.

No, nothing to do with Powerplay <spit>, just get Allied status with the Alioth Independents. 78 Ursae Majoris is the best place.

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=122593


You do get 15% on everything at Diaguandri, so probably not worth all that work for an extra 5%

 

[newman1702]

The way I got the Alioth permit was to go bounty hunting in a system with Alioth Independents. Got my rep up with them while grinding the cash to buy and fit the Asp - two birds with one stone. Plus it's nice to have permits Other than that, yea, 15% and 20% isn't a big difference and if you can't be bothered to get the permit you may as well just go to Diaguandri.

 

[Lhynn]

As for other roles, the Asp simply hands down beats the DBE. It may not have the strongest shields out there but they are still more powerful than the DBE. It's also more maneuverable and offers better firepower, excellent hardpoint placement and more options internals wise. Not saying the DBE is bad at all, it does what it says on the tin, and does it well, but there's a reason for it's lower price; while it's definitely comparable to an Asp in exploration, having it's own, inexplicably vocal fan club in that regards, when it comes to setting it up for other roles is where it starts losing to the Asp. Properly set up, the Asp is a decent little gunship with scary amounts of forward firepower, while still being able to haul enough cargo and have enough jump range to be a great rare trader. It's also quite fast on thrusters only. I understand we get emotionally attached to our ships, and want them to be the best, but realistically the DBE isn't as great as a lot of people want to portray it. Heck, I'm totally in love with my Cobra but do have to acknowledge that the Asp beats it in a lot of ways. I still get sentimental about my Cobra while my Asp is more of a tool for the job. For all things bubble, I simply had more fun in the Cobra even if it gets outperformed by the Asp in firepower, shielding and cargo capacity. It's not always about logical reasons, and that's fine

Lastly, I know people hate the Asp's looks, well I don't really care for the DBE's; to me it looks like a bloated BSG raptor with a yellow, non changeable paintjob. Immersion wise it kind of looks cramped, not the sort of ship I'd want to cross the galaxy in. At least the Asp looks like it might have a comfortable cabin in there somewhere

Well, you don't but I'll say it: you're 100% right, DBE is awful for any other role except exploration, except maybe as a rares-trader. I tested it in combat and it's crap bacause it terribly lacks manoeuvrability and shield resistance. I used it as a small long-range cargo for the last CG in Bast and it did the job, but overall the DBE is and will always remain an exploration-only ship. Those who are fond of exploration should therefore definitely consider buying it, those who don't should pass their way. Exploration-wise, it beats the Asp in range. Refuelling has never been an issue to me and my fuel scoop allows me to fill my tank in a few seconds without stopping longer than 20s around stars for the longest refuels, which suits me fine, I've never been in trouble so far. Obviously, I don't have shields because an explorer doesn't need any, and my DBE is stiripped to the minimum weight obtainable with only class D modules except the FSD, and even (if I recall correctly) a D2 generator and power distributor where I could fit D3 versions, to gain as much weight as possible. The only concession I made to weight is a heat sink launcher in case I get stopped by a White Dwarf star and need to go back to SC without overheating. So, from my POV, the DBE beats Asp in exploration.

As for the rest, you're right, the ASP outperforms the DBE in every aspect. But if you arm it like you do, you'll lose exploration capacity and jump range, and reversely, if you have exploration modules fitted in you'll lose combat or trading capabilities. And let's be honest, if you change your mind and feel like exploring a bit after intense trading sessions (or the other way round), it would quickly end up being boring to uninstall your trading/combat modules and replace them with your exploration setup, or the reverse.
Hence my point that, if you like all of the different aspects of this game - trading, mining, combat and exploration -, you'd want to consider having at least one ship specialized in each of these roles instead of a single jack-of-all-trades ship which actually would prove average at best in all of them without specifically shining in any. In my view, the Python is the only real first JOAT ship available, and even then, I'll definitely keep my DBE after I get to the Python because currently an exploration-fit DBE can only be beaten in jump range by the Anconda - which would be a shame to be used for this role because of its truely impressive trading and combat features that would be "wasted" in exploration...

 

[Terran]

My 2 cents:

11mil is plenty for a stock trading Asp. Around 7 mil for the ship and 120t cargo space. You'll be earning more, but you will lack firepower and shield strength for combat for a while until you've got a bit more money for upgrades. It's a nice ship!

 

[the100thmonkey]

Hence my point that, if you like all of the different aspects of this game - trading, mining, combat and exploration -, you'd want to consider having at least one ship specialized in each of these roles instead of a single jack-of-all-trades ship which actually would prove average at best in all of them without specifically shining in any. In my view, the Python is the only real first JOAT ship available, and even then, I'll definitely keep my DBE after I get to the Python because currently an exploration-fit DBE can only be beaten in jump range by the Anconda - which would be a shame to be used for this role because of its truely impressive trading and combat features that would be "wasted" in exploration...

I wouldn't call the Python a jack of all trades - it's not really good for exploration, and I find I have to refit it for combat from trading. I make my money fighting in conflict zones, not RESes - the reward per ship is lower, but you're guaranteed to see multiple unending streams of Pythons and Anacondas, which pulls up the cr/hr without having to faff around resetting instances.

The Python is a jack of all trades if you're not exploring, but -- like the Asp for exploration -- I would suggest that it needs to be refitted for its two dominant roles: fighting and trading. If FD make a change to the shield cell bank mechanic to limit the number of banks a ship can hold, it will then be a different proposition. Whether or not refitting a ship to suit its current role is boring is irrelevant: you want the right tools for the job. I'm not about to take a Python into a HICZ with 200t of empty cargo racks; I'll fit the best modules for ensuring I can kill other ships without dying myself. By the same token, if I'm trading in the Python, I'm not going to run 2x A5 and 2x A6 shield cell banks.

 

[Lhynn]

I wouldn't call the Python a jack of all trades - it's not really good for exploration, and I find I have to refit it for combat from trading. I make my money fighting in conflict zones, not RESes - the reward per ship is lower, but you're guaranteed to see multiple unending streams of Pythons and Anacondas, which pulls up the cr/hr without having to faff around resetting instances.

The Python is a jack of all trades if you're not exploring, but -- like the Asp for exploration -- I would suggest that it needs to be refitted for its two dominant roles: fighting and trading. If FD make a change to the shield cell bank mechanic to limit the number of banks a ship can hold, it will then be a different proposition. Whether or not refitting a ship to suit its current role is boring is irrelevant: you want the right tools for the job. I'm not about to take a Python into a HICZ with 200t of empty cargo racks; I'll fit the best modules for ensuring I can kill other ships without dying myself. By the same token, if I'm trading in the Python, I'm not going to run 2x A5 and 2x A6 shield cell banks.

As always, everything depends on your conception of roles. I agree with your points; however, what I didn't mention is that the Python corresponds to my definition of "JOAT" (exploration excluded, that's been made clear) because even with a combat setup, it can still have 128t of cargo hold, which is better than a boosted Type 6, and this capacity is enough for me for trading. Obviously, if you outfit it as a pure trader you'll be able to carry much more cargo but indeed lose combat capability; I wasn't refering to this outfitting. To be clear, this is the setup I forecast for my future Python: http://coriolis.io/outfit/python/27...6j6vC5.Iw18eQ==.AwjMIysgWGSA?bn=Pirate python . As you can see, it's been thought as a pirate ship but can also be used to efficiently bounty-hunting and trading. As I'm not a core trader, 128t of cargo is more than enough for me to still be able to make some profit per run, so this is why the Python is a JOAT for me. And I won't have to change setups for the different tasks I'll fancy doing. I'll keep my DBE for exploration, my Type 6 for mining, my Cobra just in case, and I'll be able to do everything, including combat zones and piracy.

And you're not completely right when you say that HDCZ don't make much profit : yesterday I cashed in ~2M for a bit more than an hour spent in a CZ in my Vulture... Given that the Python is less agile but certainly much better armed and resistant, I expect to down ships much faster and thus earn much more in CZs per hour once I lay my hands on this ship...

 

[the100thmonkey]

As always, everything depends on your conception of roles. I agree with your points; however, what I didn't mention is that the Python corresponds to my definition of "JOAT" (exploration excluded, that's been made clear) because even with a combat setup, it can still have 128t of cargo hold, which is better than a boosted Type 6, and this capacity is enough for me for trading. Obviously, if you outfit it as a pure trader you'll be able to carry much more cargo but indeed lose combat capability; I wasn't refering to this outfitting. To be clear, this is the setup I forecast for my future Python: http://coriolis.io/outfit/python/27...6j6vC5.Iw18eQ==.AwjMIysgWGSA?bn=Pirate python . As you can see, it's been thought as a pirate ship but can also be used to efficiently bounty-hunting and trading. As I'm not a core trader, 128t of cargo is more than enough for me to still be able to make some profit per run, so this is why the Python is a JOAT for me. And I won't have to change setups for the different tasks I'll fancy doing. I'll keep my DBE for exploration, my Type 6 for mining, my Cobra just in case, and I'll be able to do everything, including combat zones and piracy.

And you're not completely right when you say that HDCZ don't make much profit : yesterday I cashed in ~2M for a bit more than an hour spent in a CZ in my Vulture... Given that the Python is less agile but certainly much better armed and resistant, I expect to down ships much faster and thus earn much more in CZs per hour once I lay my hands on this ship...

In normal PvE, that's a fine setup. However, my experience with the Python suggests that you don't need that class 6 SCB in day-to-day operations, including RES work; a class 5 will suit just fine, unless you take kill authority missions - those get really hot really quickly.

As for CZs, I thought I'd suggested that they were on a par with RESes without all the faffing around; I wouldn't prefer them otherwise, but perhaps I wasn't clear enough on that. (You might also find that a 6B SCB isn't sufficient in a HICZ, particularly with shield boosters - the NPCs will respond very aggressivley to you creaming their ranks. Watch out for the Asps and Cobras rocking twin railguns )

Anyway, this is a thread about Asps. My apologies for derailing it.

For a broad-spectrum trading/light combat profile, I'd suggest something like this.
If you're confident you're in a relatively safe part of space (i.e. you know your route) and know how to run when interdicted, this might be worthwhile.
If you're going to do mercenary work in conflict zones, this is a relatively safe loadout.

Yes, I like thermic weapons. Change to suit your tastes. Obviously, an explorer setup will be significantly different (and cheaper).

 

[despiser]

...and I'm not sure if I should sell my Cobra. I've grown rather fond of it. And anyway, correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the ASP basically a better version of the Cobra? In other words, a general purpose ship? I mostly general purpose, and I want to take it to the next level. Other than for the sake of collecting shinies, is there any reason for me to keep the Cobra? I only have 11 million to spend, so the extra cash would be appreciated...

Cobra was a great ship and served me well. But the extra utility slots and hardpoints make the Asp so much better. Long fuel and bigger cargo cinches it. Now I snuff out those pesky pirates in no time with 2 C2 lasers, 2 Cannons, and 2 multicannons

 

[dryjoy]

IMO Don't bother with a T6 you will be sorry, I would say get the Asp and trade until you have enough for the Python which is the largest that can still land on outposts.. Then the Anaconda.

I wouldn't be too hasty to rule out the T6. I found the T6 and the Cobra to be a pretty awesome combination for quite a while. I have since experienced with an Asp, and then a Vulture and now a T7. My Cobra has remained with me alongside all these.

 

[Lhynn]

I wouldn't be too hasty to rule out the T6. I found the T6 and the Cobra to be a pretty awesome combination for quite a while. I have since experienced with an Asp, and then a Vulture and now a T7. My Cobra has remained with me alongside all these.

^^ This. ^^ Exactly my point. +1.