News ANNOUNCING ELITE DANGEROUS: HORIZONS

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I literally was 1 min away from buying ED, just by accident I saw the announcement of the DLC.
Guess I'm not buying this game for a while.
No need to reason, the pricing is offsetting for a (to be) new player.

Buy lifetime expansion pass ;)

https://www.frontierstore.net/games/elite-dangerous-cat.html
2015's Autumn prices are
Horizons (pre-order) £39.99
Horizons beta £49.99
LifeTime Expansion £130.00 (gone up £30)
Elite Dangerous: £29.99 (gone down £10)

Must you own Elite Dangerous 1 when you buy Horizons ?

Or when you buy Horizons, you will find yourself planet bound and must buy the season 1 box.

just to compare.

2014 autumn prices are
£200 alpha,
£100 premium beta
£50 beta
Gamma access mercenary edition Elite: Dangerous: £35.

The standard edition costs £39.99 at launch in 2014

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So to recap -

So far if you bought the standard edition at launch AND the horizons.
You will have paid £80 - which is still less than a premium Beta or Alpha backer subscriber.

if you buy ED now & horizons, you pay £70

But it's optional, you don't HAVE to buy Horizons.
In fact you can still operate your wing from orbit if members are planet bound.

And I guess walking around will be the same.
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If we extrapolate, Assuming there are 3 seasons ED:Dangerous, Horizons, Walkies.
Maybe ED:standard goes down another £10 in year 3 making just £20 to buy, but the expansion stay at £40 each.

Which means that a late adopter buying into the main game and 2 expansions will have paid exactly as much as the premium beta backer, which seams fair.


The only people who loose out, are the people who buy in the windows directly after launch, 40+40+40 = £120
and the current lifetime expansion pass, is at £130, (does that include the main game?)
and the impatient get into beta people who didn't got the whole way.
so ED:beta £50 + Horizons beta £50 + £50 walkies beta

The current lifeTime expansion is a little curious, because that sticks out. Unless they have more than just Planets & walking planned expansions now and have a fourth season tucked away which would make the experience cheaper.
 
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Thanks to all at Frontier for keeping their promises. I paid £200 a year and a half ago and it has been worth every penny. After all the new DLCs have been implemented I feel that I have ripped YOU off !!!
Thanks again. (I am ecstatic about the new season of updates, I just can't wait).
 
...Which means that a late adopter buying into the main game and 2 expansions will have paid exactly as much as the premium beta backer, which seams fair.
...

You're missing the point. If I (as a standard beta backer) don't pay out again for Horizons, december comes around and here is the situation...

I paid £50 for my game, and I can't land on planets.

Meanwhile a new player paid just £40 for their game, and they can land on planets.

No way you can argue with the maths there, it's just cheaper to be a new player when Horizon launches.
 
What i find annoying about Horizons, is not the price, but the fact that i can't find enough information about exact features that are supposed to be part of it.
Only then, after i know what it catually IS, i can consider if whatever price is fair, or feels too much, or whatever.

I mean... what do we actually know?
Or should i say "what do I actually know?" (maybe the info is somewhere out there, and i just failed to find it).
From what i gathered, this is what will be in Horizons:

1.) Basic implementation of "Planetary landings"
Landing only on planets/moons without atmosphere, ie. only baren land, scattered with rocks, crevices, and mountains at best.
So, from how i understand things, this alone is rather basic and easy (judging from my own programming experience of simple GIS terrain visualizations in the past, and from working on a certain large-terrain game i wont name).
But of course this is not all there is to it, and there should be much more, right? (i hope so).

2.) Driving the SRV vehicle on planet/moon surface
This is a bit more difficult, as it requires to add something realy new to the game (the handling and physics model of that vehicle and what not).
From what i heard about this topic (and i hope i am wrong), it reminds me of much more dull and boring experience of that in Mass Effect when you're driving around in Mako (and that one wasn't very exciting, it was ok for few times, but after a while it got old and rather annoying).
So, not only the technical implementation must be really good, but it has to be fun (and not only for the sake of driving around aimlessly), to make it enjoyable repeatedly - and here i am sceptical.
Of course, at least the first time i get the chance to do it, i will probably enjoy it, i just worry that it might also be the last time after finding out that ...there is just no real point to it and nothing much to do other than... well, driving around.
So, on its own, this feature is not really that interesting - unless there will be a reason to drive that vehicle, and that takes us to point #3.


3.) Finding "things" on the surface
So... what kind of "things"??? Bases? What does it mean? will it be a place with few generic structures (looking the same on each planet) with some turrets shooting at me until i destroy them? (again, Mass Effect and Mako)
Probably yes, because without being able to actually walk around, i dont see much else you can do with a vehicle.
So, bases not really interesting either - at least judging by the very limited information i was able to find.

4.) Loot
What does that mean? There is already "loot" in the game - when you go to certain USS, or you destroy a ship, it spills out some cargo => loot.
So what is this new "loot"? No idea.

5.) Crafting
Again. A total mystery.

Did i forget something?
Over all, judging by the information above, i DO NOT want this expansion no matter its price, because it doesnt bring me anything enjoyable or interesting - but maybe it IS interesting and enjoyable, but we just dont know because nobody wants to tell us.
Shouldn't we be told in more detail?
...i mean they want us to buy this expansion, right? So, the usual and expected practice would be, that you actually DESCRIBE the product you are trying to sell, but all we were told could be hardly more vague.
I understand the needs for basic or total secrecy while the game/expansion is still in development AND not yet available in stores.
But they are already selling it! So for the sake of my sanity, tell me what am i actually buying!

Or is there no actual plan of what will, or will not be part of it?
I dont believe that - before you announce something, you know your budget and you make a plan.
The things may (and usually NEVER go exactly as planned), but you do have a plan and if some feature doesnt make it in the end, then the only excuse is "a very good reason", and believe it or not, ppl understand those and usually wont make a fuss about it if they are given a reasonable explanation.
Until now, i never experienced anything like this, not as a customer, not as a developer.

So, i am just saying, no point talking price, if you have no clue what you're buying :)
 
I'm just going to put this here...

Rome 2: Total War (bought in sale, one year after release): £30
3 Campaign Packs @ £10 each: £30
4 Faction Packs @ £6 each: £24
2 Unit Packs @ £2 each: £4

Total cost = £88, for a product that is now two years old, still contains a fair number of bugs, is no longer getting a fraction of the development it used to get (because of the new game, Attila), produced by a company with fifteen years of continued experience in their chosen field.

I bought it, I loved it (as I did with all of the previous TW games), and yet I still only racked up 64 hours of game time before I got distracted by something else. For the record, my highest game time in any of the TW titles is 113 hours in Empire: Total War, over the six years I've owned it, and for all five of the TW titles I have on Steam my combined game time is just 250-ish hours, for an estimated cost of roughly £200.


Elite: Dangerous, on the other hand? I've racked up 130 hours in the less than four weeks I've owned it (which, coincidently, is the highest individual game time I have recorded for *all* the games I've bought through Steam since signing up with HL2 way back in 2008), have truly enjoyed every moment so far, and as it stands I fully expect to still be playing it for a long time yet. As a result, I really have no problem paying £120 (incl. discount) for the Lifetime Pass, as I'm reasonably confident that I will get more than my money's worth out of this game in the years to come.

I may be wrong, but only time will tell.

Just saying.

Just because you payed £88 for an old and broken game, it doesn't justify anything about ED.

In my view, the first season left us with an unfinished game which is clearly overpriced for 49euros.
There is simply not enough content, not enough variation (only a few docking station...), overly simple load-out system, no character development, no raids, no true multiplayer experience, only repeating the same missions all over again.
 
Buy lifetime expansion pass ;)

https://www.frontierstore.net/games/elite-dangerous-cat.html
2015's Autumn prices are
Horizons (pre-order) £39.99
Horizons beta £49.99
LifeTime Expansion £130.00 (gone up £30)
Elite Dangerous: £29.99 (gone down £10)

Must you own Elite Dangerous 1 when you buy Horizons ?

Or when you buy Horizons, you will find yourself planet bound and must buy the season 1 box.

just to compare.

2014 autumn prices are
£200 alpha,
£100 premium beta
£50 beta
Gamma access mercenary edition Elite: Dangerous: £35.

The standard edition costs £39.99 at launch in 2014

-----------------------------------------------

So to recap -

So far if you bought the standard edition at launch AND the horizons.
You will have paid £80 - which is still less than a premium Beta or Alpha backer subscriber.

if you buy ED now & horizons, you pay £70

But it's optional, you don't HAVE to buy Horizons.
In fact you can still operate your wing from orbit if members are planet bound.

And I guess walking around will be the same.
---------------------------------------------------
If we extrapolate, Assuming there are 3 seasons ED:Dangerous, Horizons, Walkies.
Maybe ED:standard goes down another £10 in year 3 making just £20 to buy, but the expansion stay at £40 each.

Which means that a late adopter buying into the main game and 2 expansions will have paid exactly as much as the premium beta backer, which seams fair.


The only people who loose out, are the people who buy in the windows directly after launch, 40+40+40 = £120
and the current lifetime expansion pass, is at £130, (does that include the main game?)
and the impatient get into beta people who didn't got the whole way.
so ED:beta £50 + Horizons beta £50 + £50 walkies beta

The current lifeTime expansion is a little curious, because that sticks out. Unless they have more than just Planets & walking planned expansions now and have a fourth season tucked away which would make the experience cheaper.

Walking on planets , stations and spaceships is just part of the plan and I guess it's somehow included in New Horizons (as soon as it's completely released), the rest are probably more features like "crafting and building on planets/moon, mining, harvesting gas giants and maybe sun energy", it's just a guess but there are so many thing one could do in this type of game you could literally turn it into a highly detailed scientifically accurate experience
 
I disagree with your approach. I am a beta supporter too (sorry, no game in alpha is worth the price asked for alpha), I have the expansion pack too, so I am covered, but this is not a good reason to say "hey guys, tough luck....I have my cool stuff while you pay".
What worries me is the precedent that you create, when such model start to be used more and more often. MMO goes from sub to F2P; and here we go the other way around; which is bad.

I don't really care where Frontier takes money from....I do not support the game development at this point; because I paid for the game development when I pledged in Beta....can't really use the Star Citizen model, where instead of digital ship sold for the cost of a gaming console, you sell expansions. If you look at the old system; a game would be made, sold and if the sale was good, an expansion would come out; if people buy it, a new expansion is done, and so on.
Here you have a game that was paid in advance, released unfinished, and then on top of that, you ask for money for something that was basically part of the deal....did people bought ED because of ED or because they heard "first person" and "planetary landing" ?
Not only got plenty of money from KSers, alpha and beta pledgers, but now you want to milk out also the regular consumers that gave you 60 damn bucks for a game that is at most worth 20? (not because people didn't put efforts in it; let's be clear...I RESPECT the work done by the programmers and artist; but I don't respect the mess that the management is doing with this game); ask 10-15 and it is fair, but 30?

And next expansion with first person will be another 30....which takes us to 120?
While the main game is still flat as the brain waves of a dead person? For which we already paid quite a lot to hop in early and help to shape the revolution in the space sim genre?

Are you sure that ED is worth 120 bucks? And I am not talking about your nostalgia and the good memories spent with the original, I am talking of what is offered now, compared to what you get in any other game (don't limit to just space sims); because games like No man's sky and witcher then, should cost 200 dollars at this point.

All true concerns mate! I have empathy for the gents and gals coming later to the party (as i wrote, maybe not good enough, im Swedish :) ). I just wish FD would put one little graphic artist and one programmer in a corner and put in some more and quicker money streams in the game (bobbleheads - we had them before, ship skins etc).
 
Try thinking along these options :-

It's an annual subscription if you want the latest themed updates. If you to keep up to date, just consider that you are paying £3 a month. Or you could buy the lifetime pass if you think you'll be playing for more than say 4 years.

Or you can stick with just space combat and you'll still get flight updates, new ships and general universe updates at no extra cost ever.

Or if you don't want to experience them as they get released, then you could wait a year and buy next year's update and get a more complete Planetary Landings. If you adopt this approach (buying expansions every other year), then your ongoing costs are halved.

Essentially, you have various payment models you can go for.
 
You only perceive to miss out, in reality you have missed nothing merely postponed the years of gameplay.
If ED was a fully fledged MMO with raids and masses of group content then yes you would be at a disadvantage but, as ED is primarily, a single player experience with a chance of meeting someone then it is not an issue as the game can be enjoyed at any chosen point in the future.
I have only seen Game of Thrones season 1&2 and have now decided I will wait for the complete seasons box set, I am sure I will still enjoy it none the less.

Hey if you want to wait 5 years knock yourself out! Me; as an old git I am not taking that risk ;)

- - - Updated - - -

A bit like a new car costing £10,000... or just a replacement wheel for your existing car (same model) also costing £10,000.

Congratulations...that is the most ridiculous analogy I have ever heard ;)
 
If we extrapolate, Assuming there are 3 seasons ED:Dangerous, Horizons, Walkies.

The current lifeTime expansion is a little curious, because that sticks out. Unless they have more than just Planets & walking planned expansions now and have a fourth season tucked away which would make the experience cheaper.

I think there will almost certainly be a minimum of 4 seasons and possibly more. Given that the lifetime pass is £130. 4 x £40=£160 (they will have priced the pass to give a discount over buying the seasons separately). Don't forget that landings on worlds with atmospheres will be a separate season (season 3?) and we don't know if there will be other planetary landing seasons. Also I suspect that FPS features will be a separate season and not included with the "walking around" season (assuming that will be just one season).

Walking on planets , stations and spaceships is just part of the plan and I guess it's somehow included in New Horizons (as soon as it's completely released)

No walking around will be a separate season - at least season 4 or 5 I would guess, assuming season 3 is landing on worlds with atmosphere etc.

p.s. do I get a prize for post with the highest count of the word season? LOL
 
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You're missing the point. If I (as a standard beta backer) don't pay out again for Horizons, december comes around and here is the situation...

I paid £50 for my game, and I can't land on planets.

Meanwhile a new player paid just £40 for their game, and they can land on planets.

No way you can argue with the maths there, it's just cheaper to be a new player when Horizon launches.

But you'd have missed out on a year's gameplay. Effectively you're complaining that a game is going to be cheaper a year after release. Even if it comes with an expansion pack, the fact is products depreciate over time. By adding an expansion to E: D, Frontier are trying to shore up the value of their product and keep it at full retail price. Of course, you can wait 5 years if you want and get everything dirt cheap - but then you'll be spending money on other things to keep you entertained in the meantime...

Those changes in WoW are core changes. Content update would be a new alien race, special regions of the locked galaxy. Landing on a planet is core feature.

How is Landing on a planet a core feature? It was never advertised as being available in the main game, and was always - ALWAYS - implied as an expansion to come after the main game had been released. Please point us to some literature stating otherwise.

I've always assumed the Thargoids would be added in the "core game" but it's now looking likely that they'll be part of a future expansion, sorry, season.

Again, where has that assumption come from? The fact that Frontier have mentioned nothing about Thargoids at all since the start of Elite: Dangerous kickstarter days, kind of suggests that Thargoids have never been a feature of the "core game".

I think the above two assumptions have come from familiarity with previous games (Frontier and FFE) which had planetary landings and Thargoids, but that's a pretty weak excuse to start demanding this content in Elite: Dangerous. For free.

Just because you payed £88 for an old and broken game, it doesn't justify anything about ED.

In my view, the first season left us with an unfinished game which is clearly overpriced for 49euros.
There is simply not enough content, not enough variation (only a few docking station...), overly simple load-out system, no character development, no raids, no true multiplayer experience, only repeating the same missions all over again.

The first season hasn't finished yet. The 1.4 CQC update will bring in a long list of changes (as per usual with a main point release), and there is also a 1.5 update planned which no-one knows yet what will be included. So it's a little early to conclude what the first season has left us with...
 
I think there will almost certainly be a minimum of 4 seasons and possibly more. Given that the lifetime pass is £130. 4 x £40=£160 (they will have priced the pass to give a discount over buying the seasons separately). Don't forget that landings on worlds with atmospheres will be a separate season (season 3?) and we don't know if there will be other planetary landing seasons. Also I suspect that FPS features will be a separate season and not included with the "walking around" season (assuming that will be just one season).



No walking around will be a separate season - at least season 4 or 5 I would guess, assuming season 3 is landing on worlds with atmosphere etc.

I get confused really , so New Horizons (complete version) is not "landing on planets"? just "landing on moons"?
 
I think there will almost certainly be a minimum of 4 seasons and possibly more. Given that the lifetime pass is £130. 4 x £40=£160 (they will have priced the pass to give a discount over buying the seasons separately). Don't forget that landings on worlds with atmospheres will be a separate season (season 3?) and we don't know if there will be other planetary landing seasons. Also I suspect that FPS features will be a separate season and not included with the "walking around" season (assuming that will be just one season).



No walking around will be a separate season - at least season 4 or 5 I would guess, assuming season 3 is landing on worlds with atmosphere etc.

p.s. do I get a prize for post with the highest count of the word season? LOL

Well, they have a ten years development plan, don't they?
So, something more like:

2) Horizons: airless rockey
3) airless other
4) lifeless atmospheric
5) inhabited atmospheric
6) walking around ships
7) walking around stations/ground stations
8) walking around planets
9) Thargoids
10) FPS/boarding

with things like passengers and other main season content improvement as "expansions" (formely known as content patches) in between major seasons.
 
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Congratulations...that is the most ridiculous analogy I have ever heard ;)

Thanks for your grown up and constructive input.


But you'd have missed out on a year's gameplay. Effectively you're complaining that a game is going to be cheaper a year after release.

No.. we get horizons AT THE SAME TIME, not a year earlier... free for some, paid for others. We're not talking about having early access, we're talking about getting it at exactly the same time as people who don't have to pay a penny for it as it ships with their base game.

Why do people not get this?

I repeat, if you don't mind starting out (and E D is most fun at the start anyway) just start a new account and actually get all the software you have paid for. Give your old, un-upgraded account to a friend, or save it for lan parties. Play your new FREE copy of the base came that is bundled with horizons for new players only.

FULL GAME PLUS ADDON SAME PRICE AS JUST ADDON - BOTH AVAILABLE AT THE SAME DATE - surely a no brainer?
 
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The first season hasn't finished yet. The 1.4 CQC update will bring in a long list of changes (as per usual with a main point release), and there is also a 1.5 update planned which no-one knows yet what will be included. So it's a little early to conclude what the first season has left us with...

It's pretty much finished, they have clearly shifted focus to Horizons in order to be able to justify it's ridiculous price.
Most of the planned 1.x will be moved to the new Horizons release, and probably we get an apology at that point.

(Frontier and FFE) suggests what the base game is supposed to be feature wise. Of course, now I know it will cost extra...
 
Hey if you want to wait 5 years knock yourself out! Me; as an old git I am not taking that risk ;)

Clocking in over 52 years and in that time I have learned that, if it is truly good, it is worth the wait unless it is a one time only event then you takes ya chances
ED so far has underwhelmed me so I am a little jaded and I take what FD perceive as an exciting future with a pinch of salt, each to his own
 
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No.. we get horizons AT THE SAME TIME, not a year earlier... free for some, paid for others. We're not talking about having early access, we're talking about getting it at exactly the same time as people who don't have to pay a penny for it as it ships with their base game.

Why do people not get this?

I repeat, if you don't mind starting out (and E D is most fun at the start anyway) just start a new account and actually get all the software you have paid for. Give your old, un-upgraded account to a friend, or save it for lan parties. Play your new FREE copy of the base came that is bundled with horizons for new players only.

FULL GAME PLUS ADDON SAME PRICE AS JUST ADDON - BOTH AVAILABLE AT THE SAME DATE - surely a no brainer?

So you'd have what? ED always ships at the same price, and EDH ships at an additional price? So that if you've never played it and now you want to get into the game that's 1 year old because the new content excited you you have to fork out full price for a one year old game AND full price for the expansion? Prices change. The value of things changes. I paid UKP100 for the game which was the price AT THE TIME THAT I BOUGHT IT. I didn't whine and demand a refund when it went down for standard beta, then again for release, then again on special on steam. That's life - if you want to be an early adopter you pay more than if you get in when it's old. For the higher price I paid I've had nearly two years of play, and early access to all the betas. You can't just conveniently forget that when it comes to working out a value.
 
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