Ships Are the NPC ship setups known?

I've searched around a bit but couldn't find anything, prolly the keywords are too unspecific. So I've been wondering -- do we know how particularly the stronger NPCs are set up, like Pirate Elite Anacondas and the like? I think I read some tidbits here and there, like "Spec Ops have XY" or so. I'm particularly interested in defensive values, i.e. shield strength, resistances etc.

Point of the exercise being I want to recreate them in Coriolis for Offence/Defence comparisons.
 
There's no way to know the exact values. You can see most of the loadout by looking at the subtargets but that tells you nothing about the potential engineering some of the Dangerous+, CZ, assassination target and spec ops have.
 
When it comes to ships present in combat zones in my opinion their hull and shield values or resiatances are highly exaggerated. No way an Eagle be that resistant to damage and no to mention that weird shield piercing beams lasers some spec op ship have.
 
They are full of a lot of "magic stuff" ;)

“Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.” Arthur C. Clarke


In other words, they cheat. :(
That's a pity, I prefer games with PC/NPC transparency

They dont.
This was been beaten really hard around here

But they are really fast and really good at adjusting power priorities or to switch weapon banks and they are also very skilled in engaging the SuperCruise DropOff so they might effectively drop off right in front of you 3 km from the station.

The only things that get closer to "cheats" are our own SLF equipped with multicannons since they have unlimited ammo (and also their generally high weapon damage and piercing from such tiny pp and pd combo)
 
they are also very skilled in engaging the SuperCruise DropOff so they might effectively drop off right in front of you 3 km from the station.
I'm confident this is more an example of an impersistence workaround, where instead of having an instance hosted by no one held so an NPC can simulate entering a low-wake, they just have a timer and spawn one next to you to simulate this.

Yeah keep believing that ;)

When it comes to NPC loadouts and the rules they play by when no instance transitions are involved, this is easy to do, as there is much, and easily demonstrable, evidence for my position, but not a shred of evidence to the contrary...excepting a tiny handful of well documented and ultimately trivial concessions.

Find any example that isn't an obvious bug, where you think an NPC is 'cheating' in terms of loadout, configuration, or piloting, and I'll show you how they aren't.
 
When it comes to NPC loadouts and the rules they play by when no instance transitions are involved, this is easy to do, as there is much, and easily demonstrable, evidence for my position, but not a shred of evidence to the contrary...excepting a tiny handful of well documented and ultimately trivial concessions.

Find any example that isn't an obvious bug, where you think an NPC is 'cheating' in terms of loadout, configuration, or piloting, and I'll show you how they aren't.
It's absolutely useless since I'm pretty convinced you'll negate everything, there's a lot of people in this Forum who has all the "knowledge" and will never accept any different outcome other than their beliefs, it's really not important, you keep your convinctions and I'll keep mine ;) It's not a race there are no winners or losers, no prizes too, have a nice evening.
 
It's absolutely useless since I'm pretty convinced you'll negate everything, there's a lot of people in this Forum who has all the "knowledge" and will never accept any different outcome other than their beliefs, it's really not important, you keep your convinctions and I'll keep mine ;) It's not a race there are no winners or losers, no prizes too, have a nice evening.

This isn't a matter of opinion, but of fact. If you believe that NPCs have access to equipment or behaviors that CMDRs do not (again, barring the clearly documented examples), the burden of proof is on you. And I am confident I can debunk any such assertions, through demonstration, because the knowledge I've garnered--from experience, investigation, and developer commentary--reveals that such assertions are nonsense.

I'd also disagree that there are no winners or losers. Those who believe your misinformation lose. Rather than seeking to understand how an outcome occurred and the mechanisms that enabled it, they dismiss them as 'cheats' they cannot duplicate or fairly counter. Such assumptions do not benefit anyone, they only obfuscate the workings of the game, which in turn causes problems with difficulty and the identification of actual bugs or cheats.
 
No way an Eagle be that resistant to damage

However resistant to damage you think an NPC Eagle can be, CMDRs can do just as well, or better.

This is my CMDR's iEagle, which has exactly the same defensive options as the vanilla Eagle:
xBlvsdo.jpg
The Super Turbo Turkey Puncher can take quite a beating with it's 1.3k hull and 50% resists, but even NPCs too low of a rank to be flying Engineered vessels can still have 1k hull HRP bricks with reactive armor.

and no to mention that weird shield piercing beams lasers some spec op ship have.

Phasing beam lasers are one of the few documented exceptions. I reported them as a bug at least twice, but I later got confirmation they were intentional.
Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbE75zXIVjY


 
Phasing beam lasers are one of the few documented exceptions. I reported them as a bug at least twice, but I later got confirmation they were intentional.
ATR are another example I think? They get reverb cascade lasers of some kind, which I believe has also been confirmed as intentional.

But to OP's question -

So I've been wondering -- do we know how particularly the stronger NPCs are set up, like Pirate Elite Anacondas and the like? I think I read some tidbits here and there, like "Spec Ops have XY" or so. I'm particularly interested in defensive values, i.e. shield strength, resistances etc.
Considering that we only know our own values for some of these stats from careful experiments where players shoot each other in controlled settings, I'm not surprised that we don't know much about NPC stats. They're not inclined to sit still or follow experimental protocol if you shoot them. Plus they use randomized outfitting, so experiment repeatability is an issue.

Standard NPCs are incredibly weak compared to players, since they don't even come in A-rated ships until the middle ranks. And I believe FDev have said that only very high level NPCs - spec ops, pirate lords, etc - have access to engineering. But beyond those broad bands, we really just have guesswork and visible effects to go by.
 
ATR are another example I think? They get reverb cascade lasers of some kind, which I believe has also been confirmed as intentional.

ATR are fully Engineered and have unique reverberating cascade burst lasers, yes.

Considering that we only know our own values for some of these stats from careful experiments where players shoot each other in controlled settings, I'm not surprised that we don't know much about NPC stats. They're not inclined to sit still or follow experimental protocol if you shoot them. Plus they use randomized outfitting, so experiment repeatability is an issue.

NPCs are pretty easy to corner and experiment on...

Standard NPCs are incredibly weak compared to players, since they don't even come in A-rated ships until the middle ranks. And I believe FDev have said that only very high level NPCs - spec ops, pirate lords, etc - have access to engineering. But beyond those broad bands, we really just have guesswork and visible effects to go by.

NPCs of Master rank or below aren't Engineered, but the higher rank random ones generally are, though they only have experimental effects if they are 'special'/high threat encounters (spec ops, assassination targets, certain signal sources, etc).

Standard NPCs in some settings, especially CZs have had combat focused loadouts for a while, and are often quite durable, presumably from bulkheads improving resistances and their internals being dominated by HRPs.

Don't NPCs also like, totally ignore heat build up as well? So yeah, they kinda cheat, if not in better equipment then in ignoring entire mechanics.

Heat affects NPCs the same way as CMDRs. This has been repeatedly confirmed, both by developer statements, and in-game experimentation.

Not that this means much in the current state of the game. Thermal shock and thermal cascade have been nerfed so many times the only thing they do now is make it easier for opponents to charge their thermal cascade. On top of that, a bad fix for multiplicative heat damage in densely packed (with CMDRs) instances has resulted in the rate of that damage being reduced to trivial levels in most scenarios. Not long ago I was (in an empty instance) able to get my CMDR's standard FDL loadout up to ~6000% heat by constantly firing weapons and boosting for seven minutes straight, with silent running engaged, and still be able to dock the ship before it was rendered uncontrollable.
 
Well just today (and many times before) I fought a random hazres-pirate that peppered me with all kinds of experimental effects: trajectory disruption, shield bypass, thermal something... I'm used to NPCs having one of these effects, but this one had a lot of them all in one. :p And iirc it wasn't even an Elite but "just" Deadly. (Might be mistaken though)

And on the other hand, I have seen a few yt videos about engineering where it was explicitly stated for some experimentals that they don't work on NPCs. Most of them were things like TLB (because AI just immediately reacquires you) but it also concerned a few other effects, I think.
 
This isn't a matter of opinion, but of fact. If you believe that NPCs have access to equipment or behaviors that CMDRs do not
You don't get it...don't you? ;) It's not about equipments that differs from the player ones, it's about how they are coded but from your bible I understand one simple thing, you overstimate yourself..it's typical in this forum you are not alone, you think you are part of some unknown elite :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO: egomania can have these effects, enjoy your wisdom! :love:
 
Well just today (and many times before) I fought a random hazres-pirate that peppered me with all kinds of experimental effects: trajectory disruption, shield bypass, thermal something... I'm used to NPCs having one of these effects, but this one had a lot of them all in one. :p And iirc it wasn't even an Elite but "just" Deadly. (Might be mistaken though)

And on the other hand, I have seen a few yt videos about engineering where it was explicitly stated for some experimentals that they don't work on NPCs. Most of them were things like TLB (because AI just immediately reacquires you) but it also concerned a few other effects, I think.
Trajectory disruption is the weapon moved your ship off-course, effect of standard railguns. Thermal attack is heating, effect of standard PAs. Shield bypass is the only one that stands out there, could be phasing. Anyone can retarget, from TLB, even players.

There is a kneejerk reaction from the player base to blame NPC magic whenever they see something they don't understand. And there is a lot of misunderstanding out there.

I understand if you plot a months long campaign claiming the NPCs cheat before you even fight one you can take it to the Supreme Court. ;)
 
NPC do follow the rules, mostly. They do sometimes seem to be equipped with station like reverb lasers. But it's not something I am prepared to spend time trying to prove. The obvious one where they jump away with sub 10% hull, and interdict you 30 seconds later with full ammo, shields, and hull, and often enough a different load out, is because it's actually a different NPC with the same name generated by whatever mission you are doing. That is annoying and should maybe be looked at. If you send them packing they should just stay gone, or come back still messed up but maybe simulate a reboot so they can be at 50% shields.

NPC do ignore heat for the most part, not because it does no damage, though it is fairly trivial, or because they are operating on differing rules, but because they just don't seem to care. They pop heatsinks almost at random if they are equipped with them.

My favorite NPC cheat that was certainly a bug was the one where their PA had a fire rate on par with a MC. It mattered not how good your shields were or how skilled you were. If they pulled the trigger, you died. I am sure you could find video of that if you look around.
 
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