Autocannons as a replacement for Class 3-4 multicannons

[Soda Popinski]

It actually struck me immediately that there is neither recoil nor impulse from kinetic weapons. Firing a cannon should give a pretty substantial push, as should getting struck by a cannon slug.

If I'm in a Derpwinder and I get broadsided by a Class 3 cannon, I should spin like Darth Vader off in some random direction. =P

We can calculate the recoil. Lets use the 40mm Bofors as an example. The L/70 variant fires an 870g projectile at 1030 m/s. That's 4.6e5 J of kinetic energy. So the maximum recoil would be the same, though in real life you would expect part of the recoil energy to be used in reloading the gun or expended in some other fashion. A Vulture is about 350 tons (1/40,000 the mass of the projectile). So the delta-V imparted on the Vulture by firing 1 round on the Bofors would be about 1.6 m/s.

Not really substantial, but could be noticeable. Imagine firing 2 of these for 3.2 m/s per shot at 2 rounds per second per gun. Fire for a 5 second "burst" for 20 rounds or a delta-V of -32 m/s. Would be noticeable with Flight Assist Off. Imagine shooting from only one side, that could throw off your aim substantially using Fixed Bofors.

Do note, while we call these things kinetic weapons, I'd assume most of the damage is done by the explosive charge. So the damage isn't necessarily purely kinetic.

 

[Star-Hunter]

We can calculate the recoil. Lets use the 40mm Bofors as an example. The L/70 variant fires an 870g projectile at 1030 m/s. That's 4.6e5 J of kinetic energy. So the maximum recoil would be the same, though in real life you would expect part of the recoil energy to be used in reloading the gun or expended in some other fashion. A Vulture is about 350 tons (1/40,000 the mass of the projectile). So the delta-V imparted on the Vulture by firing 1 round on the Bofors would be about 1.6 m/s.

Not really substantial, but could be noticeable. Imagine firing 2 of these for 3.2 m/s per shot at 2 rounds per second per gun. Fire for a 5 second "burst" for 20 rounds or a delta-V of -32 m/s. Would be noticeable with Flight Assist Off. Imagine shooting from only one side, that could throw off your aim substantially using Fixed Bofors.

Do note, while we call these things kinetic weapons, I'd assume most of the damage is done by the explosive charge. So the damage isn't necessarily purely kinetic.

Imagine what kinda havoc would tree turreted multicannons wreak on an Eagle

also

In space, where is no atmosphere, even explosive projectiles do damage only via ballistic fragment impacts (there is no shock wave).
however, in the case of delayed explosion (projectile penetrates then explodes inside ship/armour where atmosphere could be present) explosive projectiles are expected to do signifficantly more damage

 

[Heater]

Hello Commander Kaeldian!

The only issue with a multiple barrel/weapon setup up is that I suspect the idea behind it would be to effectively increase the fire rate of the platform, which would possibly make the weapon more comparable to a very large multi-cannon.

What I find attractive about these weapons is that they potentially fit a role between cannons and multi-cannons and could feel reasonable different to both.

Of course, I've no problem with a weapon that happens to feature multiple barrels, as long as the overall fire rate could retain a paced, signature "boom, boom, boom, boom" feel.

Can we at least get the C3/G Cannon ? I understand this was a oversight? Is this correct?

 

[Soda Popinski]

Imagine what kinda havoc would tree turreted multicannons wreak on an Eagle

also

In space, where is no atmosphere, even explosive projectiles do damage only via ballistic fragment impacts (there is no shock wave).
however, in the case of delayed explosion (projectile penetrates then explodes inside ship/armour where atmosphere could be present) explosive projectiles are expected to do signifficantly more damage

The reason I mention damage from explosive is not the shockwave, but the fact that potential energy / damage from the explosive isn't calculated as part of the muzzle velocity, and hence recoil of the cannon firing. I'd imagine any kind of cannon in space with an explosive shell would use fragments, or possibly HEAT rounds to damage internals / hull structural integrity. I don't see why anything in the ship besides the cockpit and possibly cargo hold would be pressurized, at least in combat ships.

Edit: Out of curiosity, I was trying to find out what type of round was loaded on the only space cannon we know of. The Salyut 3 space station had a 23mm or possibly 30mm "Vulkan" cannon aboard. It was never fired with any cosmonauts on board, but was test fired remotely. I had no luck figuring out what type of round they used in space, but the 30mm aircraft variant could fire 410g armor piercing and high explosive incendiary.

 

[Star-Hunter]

That is true, although atmosphere could be present for
heat management

 

[Kaeldian]

How about a burst fire cannon, something like the 40mm cannon in Titanfall could do.

(Thud thud thud *pause* thud thud thud *pause*)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y08GxB6Mh5s (fast foward to the 2:08 in the vid and you'll see the fire rate I'm referring to)

 

[Star-Hunter]

How about a burst fire cannon, something like the 40mm cannon in Titanfall could do.

(Thud thud thud *pause* thud thud thud *pause*)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y08GxB6Mh5s (fast foward to the 2:08 in the vid and you'll see the fire rate I'm referring to)

i suppose you havent read the beginning of the thread and my first post

 

[insanephoton]

How about a quad auto cannon turret?

 

[PrometheusDarko]

Hello Commander Kaeldian!

The only issue with a multiple barrel/weapon setup up is that I suspect the idea behind it would be to effectively increase the fire rate of the platform, which would possibly make the weapon more comparable to a very large multi-cannon.

What I find attractive about these weapons is that they potentially fit a role between cannons and multi-cannons and could feel reasonable different to both.

Of course, I've no problem with a weapon that happens to feature multiple barrels, as long as the overall fire rate could retain a paced, signature "boom, boom, boom, boom" feel.

How opposed would you be to the possible miniaturization of the Federal Capital ships dual cannons for private pilot use by say, Core Dynamics? Slightly faster and smaller projectile than the cannon, but much slower rate of fire than the multicannon? Seems to fit that perfect middle-ground.

 

[Huros]

Great idea. Say 5 round burst for the C4 and three rounds for the C3 sort of like each round does the same damage but the bigger one could just have a larger mechanism to stuff more rounds into the chamber. Gimballed, fixed and turreted- oh yes please. Would make for more diversity in the upper weapons and could balance well.

I totally endorse this idea.

 

[Lavo]

I'd love to see some variety besides the cannon and PA for C4 mounts.

 

[Huros]

Hello Commander Star-Hunter!

I agree, the Bofor appears to look/sound like a larger version of the Flak 38 and seems to retain a similar fire rate. Possibly we'd want to go for something with a slightly slower fire rate, but increased/variable burst length.

For me I think there's something fundamentally frightening about a steady, drum-beat fire rate, especially if the burst is long enough to make it sound like doom is inevitable.

Make the sound of it AWESOME. It must be Aural Pornography. Every time i squeeze the trigger it must be a deeply pleasurable experience. the Sound of the cannon should linger after you stop firing too.

 

[Kaeldian]

i suppose you havent read the beginning of the thread and my first post

I did and promptly got the stupids and forgot about it. The risks of doing posts between support calls.

 

[Shyeer Alvarin]

If we want multi-barrel, why not have a firing rate on each barrel of one second, equaling out to four rounds per second, per hardpoint this would give a realistic rechamber timing for each cannon.

 

[[VR]tailgunner30uk]

57mm Autocannon, fitted to the DH98 Mosquito in the second World War.

The effect I think you are looking for.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M00f5RxhxLY

 

[Huros]

Maybe something similar to the 40mm Cannon on the C130s in MW3? that sort of rate of fire but needs a bassy thud to it and more of a longer die down after firing. Needs more low freq noise. -At least for the Class3 cannon and maybe sound similar to the 105mm from same game for the Class 4. At least that sort of sound difference. (forgive me not had inexperience withstand engineering but i know what i like and BIG DAKKA DAKKA SHOOTAS is what i like.

 

[aRtFuL]

Hello Commander Star-Hunter!

Just wanted to say I like this concept.

A light cannon, something between normal cannons and multi-cannons. Perhaps a kinetic gun that feels a little like the Flak 38 (I think), that I remember having such an impact in Saving Private Ryan (as in sounds and fire rate, rather than the horrific results).

No promises or ETA, but I think there's room for a weapon like this.

7




whatever you say... until this game actually puts up a public access stats site .....to show player account stats .. I'll believe the moon is really Elvis in disguise first



trying to sneak autocannons in by limiting it to burst size... is just trying to sneak the unbalanced weapon back in .... C3 Pulses will be just fine for now or fit C2 autocannons

I still oppose the motion ... by the lack of answers in here... I'd say most others don't really care that much either

Have a wonderful day ..........

So... the lead designer says he likes the concept and yet there andyraptor being a troll.

So sorry who are you again andyraptor and please explain why is your opinion more important? lol

 

[Darth Ender]

considering you can two shot an unshielded anaconda (albeit, npc) with the current weapons. An even more powerful weapon isn't really warranted. Maybe when more scary ships are introduced or perhaps when destroying a cap ship is possible.

Rather than have a weapon's race of moar powah. I'd like to see weapons with more specialized effects that augment different roles in the game specifically. Though I dont think I'd let go of my cannon. Though, the idea of aural pornography should come to big bertha as well. The boom from within my ship of that cannon should be deafening and rock the ship a bit.

 

[Robbeh]

So something that sounds like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Q2K0-7DO3E

And looks like this:



Yes please!

 

[lethal_sting]

I knew I saw a ED vid that had AC type weapons!


Jump to ~55 seconds in.
[video=youtube;VE8B4KptyVI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VE8B4KptyVI?[/video]


And a PG version of the scene Sandro is referring to.

[video=youtube;KGbBQQgEm_E]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGbBQQgEm_E[/video]

+1(thousand ) for an auto-cannon.