Bounty idea for gankers

[Deleted member 182079]

As a person who has tried piracy before, you'd be surprised at how many people simply log or instead of handing over 50 tonnes of LTD and continuing their journey choose to run and lose their entire hold instead. The amount of actual immersive piracy interactions I had are in the single digits.

50t?

I asked for 8t, while in a Courier, so clearly did it for RP reasons. The Python CMDR who mined in Borann (swimming in hundreds of LTDs no doubt) still refused, and called me names. It did cost him his shields and a gimped ship though as a result so not all for nowt

 

[Just Paul]

I don't. You're missing the motivation. If everybody will know your death is permanent (lost ship) and as option - they can buy your ship for self, you will be surprised how many people will hunt you. All that deciat noobs will be attacking too at once just to get your ship helping G5 hunters. Then rebuy and come back.
Also it wil be much more G5 hunters as well, because well, your ship can be bought for 30kk and sold out for 300kk
And trust me in 3 days they will learn all your tricks.
I saw all that happening in lineage2. Once good-rare geared PK appears.
On long runs (months, couple) you will be ganking in stock ship = giving a chance to beat u by 3-4 noobs = fair pvp in fact.
Next stage will be, I escaped 4 hunters on stock ship and managed to kill 5 noobs kiting em' videos. But rare enough. Like once a month.

That is already happened in another game.

You still missing the point. The skill gap is that big. No amount of revenge filled motivation or people (especially with instancing the way it is) you will be able to bring down the better players if they don't want to. Having an engineered ship is just one side of the equation, the other is 1000s of hours practicing flying and fighting. There is no way past getting gud and having an eye-watering amount of rebuys if you ever want to be able to get one of the better players into your ships cross hairs for just a bit. Generously, in 3 days most will barely be able to point the ship in the direction they are flying FAoff and 90% will have given up to git gud at that point. The only good your proposal will do is that the prey will come to the hunter, it will be like shooting clay pigeons.

As you always bring up rpg's. It's like bringing up to 8 level 5 players to take down a level 99 player. It will be a slaughter and only 1 will exit the ring. A mall cop having a g5 ship is still a mall cop (no offense to actual mall cops). Elite is not bring the best gear and you have an almost guaranteed win, skill is the deciding factor more than anything.

 

[alexzk]

As you always bring up rpg's. It's like bringing up to 8 level 5 players to take down a level 99 player. It will be a slaughter and only 1 will exit the ring. A mall cop having a g5 ship is still a mall cop (no offense to actual mall cops). Elite is not bring the best gear and you have an almost guaranteed win, skill is the deciding factor more than anything.

I never said it will be fast or solved in 1 day. I said it will be proper motivation for zerg rush and to learn as well. Some time later gankers will start to mass die because properly motivated players will train enough to kill 1 guy by 10 men. Now they're motivated to solo and/or be same ganker.
For example, xeno hunters who kill 20 thargoids at once may finally swap from PG to open and show gankers how to fly. Now they don't have reasons to do that.

 

[Just Paul]

I never said it will be fast or solved in 1 day. I said it will be proper motivation for zerg rush and to learn as well. Some time later gankers will start to mass die because properly motivated players will train enough to kill 1 guy by 10 men. Now they're motivated to solo and/or be same ganker.
For example, xeno hunters who kill 20 thargoids at once may finally swap from PG to open and show gankers how to fly. Now they don't have reasons to do that.

Your thargoid hunter example shows that you have no idea about the skill gap and what it takes to be good at PvP. They will get speed run, hunting thargoids and PvP are 2 very different skills. One can adopt to the other rather easily, and it's not the PvE player. You are also not going to learn anything in the 20s from entering the instance to explosion and if somebody really puts the time in to learn they will end up to 95% as a ganker.
Dying is optional in Elite, if you see there are to many players on the opposing side you just jump out. I never died if I didn't wanted too, even having the instance packed by 2 wings from the lawful opposition. And I'm a lower than lowest tier PvPer.

 

[alexzk]

Dying is optional in Elite,

That what I say, that must be changed.
If ganker interdicts expo-conda, it will be exploded prior it can stabilize itself. So no chance for anything except do not play Open. While ganker risks nothing as u said.
So lets assume we play open only, no pg/solo for simplify.
So what we have: explorer is always dead if interdicted + looses data. Ganker can never be killed. So it is "dangerous" for explorer and "safe" for ganker. Not fair. Must be changed.
And enough talks about skills Once I will know I may force you to lose ship I will spend couple months training in pvp. And I play 18 hrs/day usually.
Then I will make sure some gankers lost their ships.

 

[Bigmaec]

That what I say, that must be changed.
If ganker interdicts expo-conda, it will be exploded prior it can stabilize itself. So no chance for anything except do not play Open. While ganker risks nothing as u said.
So lets assume we play open only, no pg/solo for simplify.
So what we have: explorer is always dead if interdicted + looses data. Ganker can never be killed. So it is "dangerous" for explorer and "safe" for ganker. Not fair. Must be changed.
And enough talks about skills Once I will know I may force you to lose ship I will spend couple months training in pvp. And I play 18 hrs/day usually.
Then I will make sure some gankers lost their ships.

Then your explo Conda has crap shields.
Mine has >1000mj and I guarantee you no single ganker will bring that down.
And it costs me perhaps 9LY range, which doesn't matter for exploration, at most it matters for tourism.

And if you spent 18 h PvPing a day you've gotten gud. Congrats.

 

[alexzk]

And if you spwen 18 h PvPing a day you've gotten gud. Congrats.

what that means ? didn't get. some spell to call the devil?

 

[Bigmaec]

what that means ? didn't get. some spell to call the devil?

Spent. Stupid tablet keyboard. Fixed.

 

[alexzk]

Spent. Stupid tablet keyboard. Fixed.

Ok, no. I played pvp 2 hours in 2 years in Elite. I don't see any reason to play pvp now. However, as I said, if it will be proper motivated - i will do that.
I like to have results, at least "virtual pixels" or "virtual credits". Wasting time just to waste time is not for me - that's why I don't watch utube's cats etc.

I tried 'capture flag" cqc - but it never popped. That what I call "reasons" in pvp.

 

[Deleted member 182079]

I mean, the optimism in people's evaluation of their own skill is admirable, but I can totally see why the rage threads keep coming in when they're brought down a peg or two when they hit the concrete wall of reality.

Paul & co are not joking when they say the skill gap is big - it was a proper shock to the system when I switched from Solo to Open for the first time and got ganked in my Corvette (which is safe mode against NPCs), and I'm still mightily impressed by how difficult some players make it to even take aim at them. Skill is absolutely a factor here, you can't just dismiss it.

 

[alexzk]

I mean, the optimism in people's evaluation of their own skill is admirable, but I can totally see why the rage threads keep coming in when they're brought down a peg or two when they hit the concrete wall of reality.

Paul & co are not joking when they say the skill gap is big - it was a proper shock to the system when I switched from Solo to Open for the first time and got ganked in my Corvette (which is safe mode against NPCs), and I'm still mightily impressed by how difficult some players make it to even take aim at them. Skill is absolutely a factor here, you can't just dismiss it.

You can't know until u tried. 2000 times tried
No matter, I can afford 2000 rebuys, because it will be enough 1 death to ganker. That's the point.
...I play computer games for about 25 years already. I heard about "skill" so many times so I don't care any more. What is needed - fair rules, possibility to ultimate win. After such win should not be possible to continue. Like lost ship. Otherwise it is better to avoid fight at all like blocks.

 

[Deleted member 182079]

You can't know until u tried. 2000 times tried
No matter, I can afford 2000 rebuys, because it will be enough 1 death to ganker. That's the point.

Well I'm speaking from experience of fighting some of these gankers - and I'm telling you they'll have you for breakfast if you don't have any experience in this.

I myself for example can easily get away from a fight 9.5/10 times (after losing many ships - my rebuy total is in the 9 digits) - the 0.5 times is for when I fly something silly like a shieldless T6 perhaps, because sometimes I feel like flying silly ships

But combat wise? I don't really know, maybe a 3/10? Because I did engage people a number of times and didn't immediately pop, but only a couple of times managed to actually get ahead in terms of damage dealing, and the other side still managed to wake out at 14% hull. Normally the fight starts ok, but then after a while things turn against me. I basically need more practice and I'm not a very good marksman when it comes to fixed weaponry. I don't have a problem admitting that.

 

[alexzk]

Well I'm speaking from experience of fighting some of these gankers - and I'm telling you they'll have you for breakfast if you don't have any experience in this.

With current rules ANY experience with gankers is your automatic lose. Maybe not ship, but time to jump out/escape/mood. Time to "train pvp" where you cannot win.
So best solution is block now or combat relog to make em angry.
If rules will be changed to have ultimate win, then we can speak about rising own skills to make that ultimate win happened.

 

[Deleted member 182079]

With current rules ANY experience with gankers is your automatic lose. Maybe not ship, but time to jump out/escape/mood. Time to "train pvp" where you cannot win.
So best solution is block now or combat relog to make em angry.
If rules will be changed to have ultimate win, then we can speak about rising own skills to make that ultimate win happened.

Time that I enjoy playing a game is not lost time for me. But also I don't play for an explosion of the other ship; managed expectations are key for continued satisfaction with the current game.

Once at Deciat I was chasing a ganker around the block within the ravines around Farseer in my Courier - I misjudged a boost while turning and added another crater to the environment. We laughed about it, I respawned a few seconds later, fun was had on both sides. Once you stop taking everything so seriously and personal these things become a lot more entertaining and fun.

 

[alexzk]

Once you stop taking everything so seriously and personal these things become a lot more entertaining and fun.

Well, I do take. And I would like to have some pew-pew, for example I would love be interdicted by pirate who wants my cargo and fight with him, because he wants my cargo so he must attack with care, while I shouldn't.
That is spicy and hard to do. But mindless blowing of people - that's behind me. So until they change the rules will have to keep blocking.

I think I said all ideas I had.

 

[Sucette]

Ok, no. I played pvp 2 hours in 2 years in Elite. I don't see any reason to play pvp now. However, as I said, if it will be proper motivated - i will do that.

That's the main difference between you and them. They don't need a motivation to git gud. Git guding is the motivation.

With current rules ANY experience with gankers is your automatic lose

No it's not.

 

[Mozmaniac]

Good grief, Id hate to see what you would count as an overreaction I liked a lot of it as an idea though.

Thank you, but I was intending the last recourse as the extreme end development of a progression of infringements; as in the thread were comments of insanely high bounties held by individuals. My reasonings were that if you want to have this playstyle, then response is very low key in the beginning and as the notoriety increases, the response increases. It would keep a fair balance for both parties (gankers & victms). Alot of comments refer to ED as "dangerous", but I have seen and found out that it currently stands unbalanced in favour of the individual ganking and as not equal for the one being ganked. It also rests fairly in with in-game C&P expectations from both sides. I wouldn't expect to be troubled in a high security system, but if I was to travel in a no- security/anarchic part of the galaxy then fair game, you'd take your chances and take it on the chin and all... Presently, I just don't see it in the current game mechanics.

Low notoriety would lead to low response, a higher response would appear to attempt to "curb" ( and I use the word loosely as I don't know what else would fit) by the system Law Enforcement. The higher the notoriety, the more troublesome the "law" should become to the criminal ( ie: akin to FBI Most Wanted List, et al.). Operations specifically targeting the Notorious criminal as they are a danger to the Galaxy (Think Noreiga and the US operation to remove him). It would rise above bounty hunters' level to a Enforcement type response. (Sure the A.I would need improving, or use or repetitive strength in numbers to whittle down resistance). I assume the ganker likes shooting down ships and the ultimate ship combat is the one which looks unbeatable (Butch & Sundance comes to mind!). It gives them the pleasure of multiple combats and a sense of their "play-style" repercussions in game. It gives low level ganking room to play, but not an option as career ganking as the apparent "danger" becomes ultimately impossible to overcome.

Otherwise, it's simply that they like to vent their pique in the game to ruin others gaming experience.

 

[alexzk]

Git guding is the motivation

Google gives me that: https://guides.github.com/
so...hard to understand all that your spells actually

 

[Sucette]

Google gives me that: https://guides.github.com/
so...hard to understand all that your spells actually

I have no doubt that you don't understand what it mean.

 

[Just Paul]

Once I will know I may force you to lose ship I will spend couple months training in pvp. And I play 18 hrs/day usually.

Awesome, see you in San Tu. But once you spent a few month, 18h/day and you git gud you probably start ganking.

What is needed - fair rules, possibility to ultimate win. After such win should not be possible to continue

The rules are fair and with engineering tilted towards the interdictee. Everybody can build excactly the same ship and have a go, no pay to play or unobtainable modules out there. Most PvP builds are shared all over and you can just copy them. You can even ask them and they tell you what is wrong in your build. Build your ship right and you can escape 95% of the time. If you have to escape an interdiction you did already lots of things wrong in the lead up.

With current rules ANY experience with gankers is your automatic lose. Maybe not ship, but time to jump out/escape/mood. Time to "train pvp" where you cannot win.

If it's like this every time an npc interdicts me I lose too. We should remove npcs from the game. We also should remove bgs and PP interactions, I by myself can't win against big groups so I lose all the time too.