Combat logging is out of hand, and I'm about to quit because of it

[Distance]

As has been said many times before - you can't make Open give any benefit over Solo or Group - as then you'd simply end up with people playing in Open in completely closed instances for whatever benefits.

There are no modes. There is one game with two options to opt out of seeing players.

The way it's currently standing, players will be able to enter and leave private groups of some sort reasonably easily, so they will be able to control the level of perceived griefing they want to suffer.

I know this is a very contentious issue, which I have been wrestling with since I first came on to the project. The way I see it at the moment is pretty straightforward:

• We have players that want a range of different experiences
• All of those experiences are valid
• Some of those experiences are mutually exclusive

So my answer is to say that we will support all of them but not to the point where one player is happy at the expense of another. And a clean way to do this is by using a grouping system.

The worst case scenario here is that a player who wants to avoid an encounter will vanish into a private group. In this case, the player will be forced to escape conventionally first (via hyperspace, docking or something similar).

In this instance, the aggressor still gets some benefit - they "defeated" their prey, and we can hopefully build on this in terms of rewarding them in various ways: via reputation, which can lead to missions and events, via player bragging rights (perhaps only players that remain in the "all group" can feature in various global news feed articles) and potentially via limited physical rewards.

If players are going to live in private groups, well, that suggests that if we had a single environment they would be playing offline or not at all, so they aren't part of the equation.

If players are going to live in private groups, well, that suggests that if we had a single environment they would be playing offline or not at all, so they aren't part of the equation.

If you choose to opt out of open that's your choice noone elses. There's more on this on the last page of the solo vs open thread.

Now back to combat logging before it gets merged

 

[Asp Explorer]

There are no modes. There is one game with two options to opt out of seeing players.

Indeed - I'm fully aware of that. I use "mode" to simply describe the in-built settings wether you just play on your own, with select friends, or everyone. I'm a little unsure as to where you get this whole "opt out of open" idea. The default selection when starting the game is Training. It takes a click on Start and then another click to verify Open Play, or freely select another option.

Back to Combat Logging Not that I personally do it - but I've seen it done. A solution to keep everyone happy though, unfortunately seems to not exist.

 

[Distance]

Indeed - I'm fully aware of that. I use "mode" to simply describe the in-built settings wether you just play on your own, with select friends, or everyone. I'm a little unsure as to where you get this whole "opt out of open" idea. The default selection when starting the game is Training. It takes a click on Start and then another click to verify Open Play, or freely select another option.

Back to Combat Logging Not that I personally do it - but I've seen it done. A solution to keep everyone happy though, unfortunately seems to not exist.

I knew you like to twist words but I didn't realize you were so pedantic as to insinuate that because "Training" is the first box on the menu that that is the default mode

You know full well what I meant and even if you didn't if you took the time to check out the other links it would have been confirmed by the devs

Combat logging though is all down to FD. Hopefully they'll put in telemetry to detect it and start moving players out of open play but there's nothing more we can really discuss on the matter after the monster thread.

I will probably stab my own eyes out if I see another "Hey I know! Make the ship stay in space after log off" suggestion

 

[DJ Interstellar]

If FD is not fixing combat logging asap, there is really no point in piracy in this game anymore. It's so easy to change also. Just disable logoff functionality during fights. EZPZ.

 

[Wonton Freak]

Go kill some NPCs, they look exactly the same. Or stop crying like a little kid, if people want to interact without PvP, it's their choice. Play something else if you can't handle it.
Plugging the cable will always work, because punishing people with a bad connection by leaving their ship for several seconds if they happen to disconnect by a legit reason is worse than having the "exploiters"

¨~ Chris

 

[Distance]

If FD is not fixing combat logging asap, there is really no point in piracy in this game anymore. It's so easy to change also. Just disable logoff functionality during fights. EZPZ.

There go my eyes

 

[DJ Interstellar]

Go kill some NPCs, they look exactly the same. Or stop crying like a little kid, if people want to interact without PvP, it's their choice. Play something else if you can't handle it.
Plugging the cable will always work, because punishing people with a bad connection by leaving their ship for several seconds if they happen to disconnect by a legit reason is worse than having the "exploiters"

¨~ Chris

ROFL! No one forces you to play open kid

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There go my eyes

What does this mean?

 

[Asp Explorer]

I knew you like to twist words but I didn't realize you were so pedantic as to insinuate that because "Training" is the first box on the menu that that is the default mode

You know full well what I meant and even if you didn't if you took the time to check out the other links it would have been confirmed by the devs

Combat logging though is all down to FD. Hopefully they'll put in telemetry to detect it and start moving players out of open play but there's nothing more we can really discuss on the matter after the monster thread.

I will probably stab my own eyes out if I see another "Hey I know! Make the ship stay in space after log off" suggestion

You are completely correct - pedantism is one of my favourite hobbies. Plus I'm a grumpy old git Combat logging has no true solution given the P2P model and the way that unsecured networks like the internet, unacknowledged protocols like UDP, all those tiny little problems - mean that players can do as they please.

FD can certainly log combat logging. They can do absolutely nothing about it though apart from making certain accounts play in Solo at their whim, and even that has repercussions as absolutely nobody can prove that someone else shot their PSU out intentionally to avoid laser beam pixels. It's far more likely that one or more ISP's detected P2P traffic and blocked it to keep the BPI/MAFIAA happy.

I'm completely with you on stabbing my eyes out on another "Hey I know! Make the ship stay in space after log off" suggestion

 

[Distance]

You are completely correct - pedantism is one of my favourite hobbies. Plus I'm a grumpy old git Combat logging has no true solution given the P2P model and the way that unsecured networks like the internet, unacknowledged protocols like UDP, all those tiny little problems - mean that players can do as they please.

FD can certainly log combat logging. They can do absolutely nothing about it though apart from making certain accounts play in Solo at their whim, and even that has repercussions as absolutely nobody can prove that someone else shot their PSU out intentionally to avoid laser beam pixels. It's far more likely that one or more ISP's detected P2P traffic and blocked it to keep the BPI/MAFIAA happy.

I'm completely with you on stabbing my eyes out on another "Hey I know! Make the ship stay in space after log off" suggestion

We agree on something! Christmas miracles do happen

 

[kurush]

I'm completely with you on stabbing my eyes out on another "Hey I know! Make the ship stay in space after log off" suggestion

You can actually make it work and also make all the combat logging whining go away. Just convert that player ship into NPC once the DC is confirmed (i.e. the game instance totally falls apart and is split into two). Keep it an open box so that nobody notice, make it drop no cargo and just leave it there fighting. Here, the solution for the whining issue. I bet 99% of the people suggesting leaving the ship in space this won't notice the difference You can even increase the number of player kills in stats after doing that.

 

[Asp Explorer]

You can actually make it work and also make all the combat logging whining go away. Just convert that player ship into NPC once the DC is confirmed (i.e. the game instance totally falls apart and is split into two). Keep it an open box so that nobody notice, make it drop no cargo and just leave it there fighting. Here, the solution for the whining issue. I bet 99% of the people suggesting leaving the ship in space this won't notice the difference

Oh the fun I could have shooting 31 copies of myself. If I had say, a million credit bounty on me - that's 31 million credits right there for zero effort And I could repeat that every five minutes and actually increase the income every iteration of the instance

 

[kurush]

Oh the fun I could have shooting 31 copies of myself. If I had say, a million credit bounty on me - that's 31 million credits right there for zero effort And I could repeat that every five minutes and actually increase the income every iteration of the instance

Yeah, the bounty farming through this would be epic. Not that there are no billion sized bounties right now in the game, so I don't see it as an issue. You can't farm yourself and you would be limited to just one copy even with two accounts.

 

[Distance]

You can actually make it work and also make all the combat logging whining go away. Just convert that player ship into NPC once the DC is confirmed (i.e. the game instance totally falls apart and is split into two). Keep it an open box so that nobody notice, make it drop no cargo and just leave it there fighting. Here, the solution for the whining issue. I bet 99% of the people suggesting leaving the ship in space this won't notice the difference You can even increase the number of player kills in stats after doing that.

As stated to death many many times in the mega combat logging thread "the clients only upload to the server when you enter a system, enter supercruise or when you're docked at a station".

The majority of the game is calculated client side. If you kill a ship, npc or player, it's not sent to the server until one of those instances. The only way to deal with it is by recording telemetry and punishing after the fact.

*Stabs eyes*

 

[DJ Interstellar]

Combat logging needs to be addressed asap!

 

[kurush]

As stated to death many many times in the mega combat logging thread "the clients only upload to the server when you enter a system, enter supercruise or when you're docked at a station".
*Stabs eyes*

I think you stabbed them before reading what I typed I do understand the game networking architecture here better than many.

 

[Valethar]

but we're getting dangerously offtopic now...

But.. Isn't that why this is the 'Dangerous Discussion' forum? :S


/hides

 

[Asp Explorer]

Yeah, the bounty farming through this would be epic. Not that there are no billion sized bounties right now in the game, so I don't see it as an issue. You can't farm yourself and you would be limited to just one copy even with two accounts.

Not if the combat loggers had their way. You'd end up with one NPC clone of a Commander for every combat log. Simply combat log every time your NPC clone retaliates after you shoot it, so an additional new clone is forced to spawn into that instance. Farming yourself would very quickly become the best credit generator in the game lol

 

[Distance]

Yeah, the bounty farming through this would be epic. Not that there are no billion sized bounties right now in the game, so I don't see it as an issue. You can't farm yourself and you would be limited to just one copy even with two accounts.

You don't know how wrong you are. The hackers have been using the same client in multiple locations since launch.

 

[kurush]

Not if the combat loggers had their way. You'd end up with one NPC clone of a Commander for every combat log. Simply combat log every time your NPC clone retaliates after you shoot it, so a new is forced to spawn. Farming yourself would very quickly become the best credit generator in the game lol

Farily easy to prevent you from joining an instance that you just dropped. I actually think the game is already doing this - I had some major trobles seing friends after dropping from the game after another cat incident

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You don't know how wrong you are. The hackers have been using the same client in multiple locations since launch.

And I am pretty sure you can't see yourself with these multiple clients

 

[Distance]

Farily easy to prevent you from joining an instance that you just dropped. I actually think the game is already doing this - I had some major trobles seing friends after dropping from the game after another cat incident

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And I am pretty sure you can't see yourself with these multiple clients

There's a 119 page hacker thread on a forum if you know how to google. FD are aware of it and it's pretty much common knowledge at this point.

My point being : it's pointless trying to bounty farm yourself when it's a lot easier to put yourself in to 2 stations on a trade route and trade without moving to make money.