And I am pretty sure you can't see yourself with these multiple clients
now I just have to fire up the multiboxes It was certainly possible back in testing.
Combat logging is out of hand, and I'm about to quit because of it
- Thread starter Hagglefoot
- Start date
now I just have to fire up the multiboxes It was certainly possible back in testing.
I have no argument here. And I am also fairly sure they will block it eventually and take the unfair profits from the offenders as they did with the founders world exploit (or not, but I don't care). Bounty farming would not be an issue everybody is whining about, so my fix to the whining issue should work
And it is also dirt cheap to implement and wont' take any additional server resources. Basically, just make it so that ganker won't notice his victim left the game
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I have no argument here. And I am also fairly sure they will block it eventually and take the unfair profits from the offenders as they did with the founders world exploit (or not, but I don't care). Bounty farming would not be an issue everybody is whining about, so my fix to the whining issue should work
AFAIK they don't bother taking the credits they just ban people to solo and leave them to it.
Bounty farming isn't the issue it's when you've chased a player through 5 star systems for a 50 mil bounty and when their shields go down they pull the plug lol
CRUCIAL Design flaw at its finest.
Well, as an experiment I tried to log in on my Macbook while the PC was still logged in. It kicked both out so I assume they have changed things since Alpha
The combat logging is only relevant when you are in the same instance (as in you just interdicted somebody or got interdicted). If you managed to jump away, I think you can just drop from SC and immediately switch to Solo, all within the game mechanics. You won't be in danger right after SC exit and should be able to log out without the 15 sec timer.
Yeah but most don't, they'd rather bail at the last minute when things go wrong. Logging out with the timer is fine even if it is a bit short.
You probably see the pattern here: game is designed so that you can hide away from an attacker if you choose so. That means we don't have combat logging issue, but rather a whining issue. And my fix for the whining issue will fix it easily
Make it impossible to claim the same bounty twice for the same commander and it will prevent the most direct abuse for the situation when the logoffski person has a bounty. It might ruin the cash market for bounties by dropping the prices even further, but I am not sure whether it is a good thing or a bad thing
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I think FD knows about it. I would believe they are trying to find a workaround. There will be a lot of complications.
How about trying your own workaround - create a pvp group. Invite all your trusted non combat logging friends.
-invite other players who like pvp.
-boot anyone that repeatedly combat logs. Have a 3 strike rule.
Bobs your uncle.
Will keep you occupied untill FD finds a solution.
How about trying your own workaround - create a pvp group. Invite all your trusted non combat logging friends.
-invite other players who like pvp.
-boot anyone that repeatedly combat logs. Have a 3 strike rule.
Bobs your uncle.
Will keep you occupied untill FD finds a solution.
That has already been tried - unfortunately the PvP Pro Bro's don't seem to like living in private groups, they much prefer roaming in Open in full wings of Vultures seal-clubbing Sidewinders, and then moaning about combat loggers
Mind you - a newbie pilot in a free Sidewinder making a full wing of combat-focused Vultures cry and RAEG is a thing of beauty.
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How are you going to do that? It's a P2P game, there's only one server and it just adjudicates. If I disconnect my game by whatever means, there's no way you can keep my ship in the game for any length of time, because it only exists on my computer NOT the central server.
That's the reason it's NOT easy, and why they haven't fix it yet.
No, it's entirely possible to do. All it takes is, spawning an enemy ship with the exact loadout and specs, into that instance. It probably wouldn't be completely instantaneous, since you would need to verify that it's a lost connection rather than a hiccup. Game saves aren't 100% client side, so it's likely the servers do actually store ship information. If it doesn't, well it possible to see someones loadout, so your game knows other players loadouts. why can't it just save the loadout of every ship in your instance? Once it has been determined that someone has lost connection, an npc avatar could immediately spawn to replace him. Npcs are already shared across multiple clients, so it should work for wings as well. So yes, it's possible in theory.
I don't 100% support the idea, i think there are a few other, better ideas. It's not a bad way to go, provided that it only applies to lost server connections, not lost p2p connections. We wouldn't want players ip blocking others in order to get easy kills.
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Spawning an NPC will certainly work here and your client already knows the loadout and everything just because you are connected. So, basically, if your instance is split because of a network issue, both parties will get an NPC to fight with. The only thing you need to do is to keep it displayed as an empty box so that the people asking to "leave your ship for 60 seconds" won't notice the difference
There is a tricky topic of your bounty though, because this will make it possible to sell the same bounty again and again without even spending time on farming a new one.
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OK a couple of issues.
First up, how do you determine that it was intentional and not a flaky internet connection?
Secondly, ok suppose you've got some way to do that and you've actually spawned an identical NPC... then what? You're giving them a free target to take the last few pot shots at? Or is it gonna fight back? If it's going to fight back, at what skill level do you set it? From the other pilot's point of view, he's gotten his enemy down say 15% hull and suddenly he disappears. Oh, poop! Then he reappears, hah what!? Then he either sits still and appears to give up so he can be shot, or he spins on his tail and starts fighting like a demon (both would be comparisons to the real pilot's flying skills if they're not matched).
Third, OK so suppose you can find out for sure that the pilot intended to disconnect, AND you can roughly match his piloting skills, what then? Apply a fine or bounty for logging out? Ban him from open (because there's not enough people leaving open already)? What happens if he argues and says his cat pulled the power plug, or there was a storm and the power went out? Are FD going to have the cat put to sleep, or research weather patterns & lightning at the time in the pilot's location? Or just give him the benefit of the doubt? What about if there's a pattern of logouts, you ask? What about if I am playing from a place with really dodgy internet connections and power supplies like pretty much anywhere in South East Asia where daily outages in both are a normal thing?
It's not ONLY for technical reasons that it's pretty much impossible - there's plain old human, circumstantial reasons for it too.
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Look. It's very simple. Frontier just need the gonads to do it. No active save during combat. The only way to get out of a fight you're losing is to try to escape. After the end of combat (no targeted hostile ships and no damage from hostile ships for at least 60 seconds) a player can save and exit.
Second, sudden internet connection issues result in your ship staying in space for up to two minutes in whatever state it was in. If you're trapped around a black hole, accelerating into empty space, or in a dog fight, same thing. Two minute timer. Players who suffer unfortunately timed connection hiccups can hope their ship is still in one piece when they log back in. Some people will complain, but I think the biggest complainers will be people who can't yank the chord just before they suffer defeat.
I played EVE for a long time and lost expensive ships due to internet hiccups. It happens once in a while.
Second, sudden internet connection issues result in your ship staying in space for up to two minutes in whatever state it was in. If you're trapped around a black hole, accelerating into empty space, or in a dog fight, same thing. Two minute timer. Players who suffer unfortunately timed connection hiccups can hope their ship is still in one piece when they log back in. Some people will complain, but I think the biggest complainers will be people who can't yank the chord just before they suffer defeat.
I played EVE for a long time and lost expensive ships due to internet hiccups. It happens once in a while.
It's a moot point , the person quit , the ship wouldn't move or attack , it would just sit there...
Combat = any hostile act. Interdiction attempt (Aggressor or recipient), Weapons fire (Aggressor or recipient)
On initiation of combat, a 5 minute timer is triggered. This is refreshed every time there is any combat act. Breaking off from combat will therefore allow the counter to tick down and time out, allowing normal logout.
During this 5 minute window, should connection be lost, said player ship is replaced with an AI pilot with the same ship health conditions, configuration, and bounty value. AI pilot is of the same ranking as their in-game ranking for the human pilot, and has the sole programmed "mission" of breaking off, entering supercruise and moving "up" from the orbital plane of the current solar system at "half in the blue" throttle. They cease to exist at the end of the timer.
An honest individual will be crapping themselves, tethering their cell for cellular internet/getting on neighbor's wifi/kicking the cat for unplugging the cable and replugging it to relogin.
A dishonest individual will be crossing their fingers hoping the AI can do the job better than they can.
Anyone who reconnects while this timer is ongoing will be updated by the server as to the condition of the ship they are entering into, and regain control at the position and situation the AI pilot is in at the time of connection loss.
It's really simple, would not be overly hard to implement (and would not require much in the way of programming AI wise from our AI Overlord) as well as giving an equal chance for a honest pilot to get back in the game and fight, as well as an honest pilot to be able to regain and claim glory over their quarry should they be fighting a combat logger.
Anyone destroyed during that timer would log into a window showing they were destroyed by CMDR **** or NPC name, as normal for combat destruction... or if destroyed due to external conditions (Overheat, sucked into the black hole, petted the neutron star, etc) again, "you got BTFU, choose your insurance or your sidewinder".
I have only lost connection the two times that my cat has chosen that my PC is a comfy warm spot for her to lay and also decided to paw the bright blue round object on the top of the PC which happens to be my power switch. Both times the feline has been cursed/shooed and I thanked my decision of having an XP941 SSD for my primary drive to reboot quickly.... and I now have my old X52 throttle quadrant sitting on top of the PC to prevent it.
Neither was in combat, but given the above being implemented..... I chose to undock, all risk and rewards outside of a station are now my responsibility and I accept and bear the full brunt of said action, should I have lost a ship due to it.
Not only that, but if your internet/wifi/ethernet/power cords on your computer or internet connection is so shoddy that you lose connection/system power on anything resembling a regular basis, then you need to check/reconfigure your hardware or perhaps solely stick to solo because you're not ready/able to play in the sandbox proper.
On initiation of combat, a 5 minute timer is triggered. This is refreshed every time there is any combat act. Breaking off from combat will therefore allow the counter to tick down and time out, allowing normal logout.
During this 5 minute window, should connection be lost, said player ship is replaced with an AI pilot with the same ship health conditions, configuration, and bounty value. AI pilot is of the same ranking as their in-game ranking for the human pilot, and has the sole programmed "mission" of breaking off, entering supercruise and moving "up" from the orbital plane of the current solar system at "half in the blue" throttle. They cease to exist at the end of the timer.
An honest individual will be crapping themselves, tethering their cell for cellular internet/getting on neighbor's wifi/kicking the cat for unplugging the cable and replugging it to relogin.
A dishonest individual will be crossing their fingers hoping the AI can do the job better than they can.
Anyone who reconnects while this timer is ongoing will be updated by the server as to the condition of the ship they are entering into, and regain control at the position and situation the AI pilot is in at the time of connection loss.
It's really simple, would not be overly hard to implement (and would not require much in the way of programming AI wise from our AI Overlord) as well as giving an equal chance for a honest pilot to get back in the game and fight, as well as an honest pilot to be able to regain and claim glory over their quarry should they be fighting a combat logger.
Anyone destroyed during that timer would log into a window showing they were destroyed by CMDR **** or NPC name, as normal for combat destruction... or if destroyed due to external conditions (Overheat, sucked into the black hole, petted the neutron star, etc) again, "you got BTFU, choose your insurance or your sidewinder".
I have only lost connection the two times that my cat has chosen that my PC is a comfy warm spot for her to lay and also decided to paw the bright blue round object on the top of the PC which happens to be my power switch. Both times the feline has been cursed/shooed and I thanked my decision of having an XP941 SSD for my primary drive to reboot quickly.... and I now have my old X52 throttle quadrant sitting on top of the PC to prevent it.
Neither was in combat, but given the above being implemented..... I chose to undock, all risk and rewards outside of a station are now my responsibility and I accept and bear the full brunt of said action, should I have lost a ship due to it.
Not only that, but if your internet/wifi/ethernet/power cords on your computer or internet connection is so shoddy that you lose connection/system power on anything resembling a regular basis, then you need to check/reconfigure your hardware or perhaps solely stick to solo because you're not ready/able to play in the sandbox proper.
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Not hard to solve man. First up, just don't care. Honestly, that works. That's how Eve does it, if you're in combat and the connection goes, you're in space for one minute, uncontrolled. Works fine, people don't complain about it, it's the way it works. Because they worked out through many years that combat logging will happen more often than network problems at the crucial point (ie, when you're about to blow up
)Second, I'd say uncontrolled. Again, Eve does this, it works fine. People put alot of time into getting their ships in that game, they lose them every now and again through this mechanic through no fault of their own. Do they moan and complain about this mechanic? No, they do not.
Third, I'd say do what FD have been doing to the major griefers, put them in solo if they do it too often.
I keep on seeing this argument about legitimate disconnects, and yes they do happen. But really, before coming up with that argument again, ask yourself; how many times have YOU disconnected in combat? Would you rather play in a game where combat logging is rife, or in a game where it's taken care of but at the small risk that you might lose your ship if you disconnect while in combat?
]I think that the truth of this is very few people posting actually know what the technical issues are, if it were a simple matter FD would have done something about it and they haven't, which tells me it isn't so simple. For my part I barely ever use open mode any more, I find solo too 'sterile' so its group mode for me. I rarely engage in PvP and don't initiate it but when I do I enjoy the rush, in the last 2 out of 3 player encounters I had in open it ended up with the other player disappearing, on both occasions they were under 10% hull and although I cannot discount acts of God entirely it seemed 'a bit fishy' if you know what I mean. BTW I am no combat ace, I just fly a fully tooled up ship and pick my battles carefully after about 20 years of flying combat sims.
I think we are on for a long wait so far as a solution is concerned and I also suspect that it will prove to be controversial to many so expect rage threads when it does land.
I think we are on for a long wait so far as a solution is concerned and I also suspect that it will prove to be controversial to many so expect rage threads when it does land.