Combat nerf done on false premise about trading being profitable

Before even starts to brag about mega profitable routes and rares - don't, it's not true for some time now. However that's not even matter - far away from al good routes, in regular system you will do trade route for maybe 6k with Cobra - but you will net 10x/20x in RES or nav beacon. Not really something I would call a balance.

Bounties must be cut down, pronto.
:)
Don't trade, run bulletin board missions.
That way you can see the galaxy as you Tramp trade.
That Is what the Cobra is for
Don't list to the Bulk Transport tycoons & their "The only trade is Refinery High Tech Refinery" Rhetoric
:)

I wonder if this is one of those to prove a point state the opposite things so the thread becomes full of posts supporting the premise you want to show as true
 
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Before even starts to brag about mega profitable routes and rares - don't, it's not true for some time now. However that's not even matter - far away from al good routes, in regular system you will do trade route for maybe 6k with Cobra - but you will net 10x/20x in RES or nav beacon. Not really something I would call a balance.

Bounties must be cut down, pronto.

Oh lord, here come the elite spend-days-finding-leet-rout-slopey-thrudd-don't-trash-my-space-trucking fanboys.

(btw RES is waaaay better).
 
Sorry, mate. I checked my old run the other day and it's fallen. From 7.1m/hour to 6.8m/hour.

Even the silk road trade route is over 4m/hour and that's a public trade route anyone can do. I can't make near that at res. Maybe 2m/hour Max.

Trading does need an investment of time to become high profit but combat has a hard cap. It's much, much better than it used to be and I'm quite happy with combat rewards now. But it does not need to be reduced.

How do you guys get 2 mill per hour in a res? is that i solo or...? I simply do not get enough spawns to make that much per hour.
 
Bounty hunting can be more profitable in the small ships now, but once you get into the medium ships it evens out. It swings in favour of trading in the large ships.

Seems fine to me. You can now progress well in either path so people should just do what they enjoy. It's a game, not a competition to earn the most credits/hour.

I clearly heard different argument when it was vice versa :) And no, I just point out that argument thrown around was false and basically just indicated that there are mobs of PvPers wanting to get best gear without doing any of trading carebears do. Nothing to do with trading being *universally* better in profit, anything with people abusing trade info tools and not caring about trade locally.

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Oh lord, here come the elite spend-days-finding-leet-rout-slopey-thrudd-don't-trash-my-space-trucking fanboys.

(btw RES is waaaay better).

And here comes maximizers...impatient by nature :)
 
In my experience Trading makes the real bucks, just gets tedious as all hell.
Bounty Hunting RES makes less Creds, but it's a bit more fun shooting up all creation.
 
Oh lord, here come the elite spend-days-finding-leet-rout-slopey-thrudd-don't-trash-my-space-trucking fanboys.

(btw RES is waaaay better).

By all means, trash trading. I've always been for higher combat rewards. I campaigned relentlessly for the combat rewards buff despite repeated posts similar to yours telling me I was wrong, trading should be the best, combat rewards of less than 1m/hour were fine, I should trade if I want to make money, not all professions need to be equal, why do I need to rush to buy an anaconda etc, etc, etc.

Thankfully, FD ignored all of them and listened to people like me and changed the game so that combat is better for progression. And it's a lot better. Without "gaming" the system, I can easily rack up about 2m/hour bounties on a good session, excluding the need to hand them in of course. And, I need luck to get the right spawns. It's better than trading, for newer pilots and lower end ships. It matches and can be better than rares trading, but you need to game the system for this, or be lucky with the spawns. A small percentage of players claim to game the Res system so hard, with endless reloads, to make as much as 4m/hour.

But these claims always ignore the hard, cold facts. In order to make 4m/hour, they have to launch from their station, fly to the Res, do their game thing, which is random, until they get that perfect scenario. They "make 4m per hour". But what do they have in their bank account?

Nothing more than when they started. They must then fly to the relevant systems to hand those bounties in.

Now, let's compare the "elite" bounty hunter's work day to the equivalent "elite" trader.

I can log in and within 10 minutes I have over 1.3m in my bank. Actual profit. No need to go hand it in. That's it. Done. One hour later, I've topped 6.5m. I can log off. In the same time, the "elite, best of the best" bounty hunter has maybe just about started to get the right random spawn to happen and had made about 1-2m in bounties. But let's assume they got lucky and the right spawns started immediately and they logged in to the Res, having logged out at the RES previously... They've got 2.5m less than me.

And they still have to fly to a minimum of two stations just to hand that in. In the time it takes them to just hand in, I'll have made another 2.6m.

You might want to rethink your position that "RES is waaaaay better"
 
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Shortly after 1.2 dropped I made one third of my entire trade profits since November in just over two hours of trading with a 232T capacity Clipper and a good route with a wing...nearly 5 million credits an hour. That's at least double what I can manage in an ideal RES.
 
I clearly heard different argument when it was vice versa :) And no, I just point out that argument thrown around was false and basically just indicated that there are mobs of PvPers wanting to get best gear without doing any of trading carebears do. Nothing to do with trading being *universally* better in profit, anything with people abusing trade info tools and not caring about trade locally.

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And here comes maximizers...impatient by nature :)

The players who claim to make up to 4m/hour are no different to the traders who use thrudd's trading tools to make the most money trading. Learning how to game the spawn system then constantly abusing it to get the right spawns is the only way to make more than 1-2m an hour. And even then, as I said above, that isn't actually cashed in yet.

A normal player, who opts against min-max bounty hunting, isn't likely to make more than 1m/hour. Particularly given the time taken to hand in the bounties and repairs etc.

The only difference between this and min-max trading is the latter has a much, much higher profit cap and the rewards are instant.
 
The players who claim to make up to 4m/hour are no different to the traders who use thrudd's trading tools to make the most money trading. Learning how to game the spawn system then constantly abusing it to get the right spawns is the only way to make more than 1-2m an hour. And even then, as I said above, that isn't actually cashed in yet.

A normal player, who opts against min-max bounty hunting, isn't likely to make more than 1m/hour. Particularly given the time taken to hand in the bounties and repairs etc.

The only difference between this and min-max trading is the latter has a much, much higher profit cap and the rewards are instant.

Good arguments here. But that's all the crux - if there's no clear competition here, then why do balancing against maximizer's gameplay?

Anyway, more I think about it, more I want to say that there should be variety in bounties depending on how secure/poor system is too. I think I care less who earns more than in regular system difference in profits from trading and combat is a bit jarring.
 
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Good arguments here. But that's all the crux - if there's no clear competition here, then why do balancing against maximizer's gameplay?

Anyway, more I think about it, more I want to say that there should be variety in bounties depending on how secure/poor system is too. I think I care less who earns more than in regular system difference in profits from trading and combat is a bit jarring.

I definitely agree with you here.

Now you say this, I do better understand what you mean. You're right, the vast majority of people appear to define combat and trading by these maximum scenarios and, in a way, they're a huge misrepresentation of what should be fun.

What I'm hoping for is 1.3 will change this significantly. The fact is, currently, the only thing "worth doing" as a fighter is RES.

I hope that changes. And I hope they give us lots more to do to progressively build up our income. Stuff that is fun and challenging.

And then they can fix the reload exploit.

It might help you to look at the current state of the game as a single step, a work in progress. They needed to increase bounties and combat bonds because they were too low before. This is a "quick fix" to make combat more bearable until they properly redesign the roles. They have said that is what they intend to do. So let's see what 1.3 and 1.30x bring us.
 
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Before even starts to brag about mega profitable routes and rares - don't, it's not true for some time now. However that's not even matter - far away from al good routes, in regular system you will do trade route for maybe 6k with Cobra - but you will net 10x/20x in RES or nav beacon. Not really something I would call a balance.

Bounties must be cut down, pronto.
So, let's see. I can make just under 1.8 million per hour trading with a Clipper.
The highest bounty I have ever seen on an NPC is around 100K, (usually a Conda) so, you're telling us you can guarantee to find 18 of those bounties per hour and kill them all within the hour? That's one every 3 minutes.

Give me the name of your supplier because that seems like good stuff you're smoking.
 
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I find dropping into random strong signal sources to be pretty profitable, especially if I'm doing them between USSes for assassination missions.

You're a better player than I then :)

I've got a top line vulture, python and fdl and I'm never going to pretend I can take on 8 vulture npcs at once ;)

I know some random SSS events are fine for a solo player. But if making fast money is your thing, that isn't faster than a primed Res.

I'm also surprised people do assassination missions currently. Aren't they still bugged? I used to enjoy chaining assassin missions until they bugged out.

Not that this matters much. 1.3 should make these obsolete.
 
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The highest bounty I have ever seen on an NPC is around 100K, (usually a Conda) so, you're telling us you can guarantee to find 18 of those bounties per hour

Eilte Anacondas can have bounties in the 200k-300k range. Sometimes less, sometimes more. And if you keep re-rolling res sites until you get one that spawns nothing but the big ships, you can make a pretty penny.

Just sayin'.
 
Before even starts to brag about mega profitable routes and rares - don't, it's not true for some time now. However that's not even matter - far away from al good routes, in regular system you will do trade route for maybe 6k with Cobra - but you will net 10x/20x in RES or nav beacon. Not really something I would call a balance.

Bounties must be cut down, pronto.

Troll detected... I hope. I know for certain that for a beginning player with a few credits for capital trading is the most profitable by far. I was trading rares in a Cobra Mk III for an hourly average of 1.2 mil / hr. Before that I was trading in a hauler for about 500k - 750k / hr in rares, and built up to that just using my free sidewinder in RES where I learned as much as I could about combat.

Trading is fine. Bounties are fine. Don't change anything please.
 
Troll detected... I hope. I know for certain that for a beginning player with a few credits for capital trading is the most profitable by far. I was trading rares in a Cobra Mk III for an hourly average of 1.2 mil / hr. Before that I was trading in a hauler for about 500k - 750k / hr in rares, and built up to that just using my free sidewinder in RES where I learned as much as I could about combat.

Trading is fine. Bounties are fine. Don't change anything please.

Trading is definitely fine (has been since they adjusted background trading simulation last, a couple months ago). But the combat career isn't fine. It's better than it's ever been. But we need 1.3 improve it. It still has a long way to go.
 
The highest bounty I have ever seen on an NPC is around 100K

I've seen over 400k+ on a KWS scanned Elite Anaconda, and 200-300k is not rare.

you can guarantee to find 18 of those bounties per hour and kill them all within the hour? That's one every 3 minutes.

A competent pilot in a Vulture, FDL, Python, or Anaconda can kill an typical AI Anaconda in about one minute. If you have a wing in formation in SC, all dropping into their own SSSes, then locking to whoever finds wanted Anaconda instances as they drop a beacon, you can reliably down 20-30 Anaconda an hour.

I've got a top line vulture, python and fdl and I'm never going to pretend I can take on 8 vulture npcs at once ;)

I know some random SSS events are fine for a solo player. But if making fast money is your thing, that isn't faster than a primed Res.

Only time I've taken out eight Vultures in a SSS alone was by flying backwards for thirty minutes. Not really fun or profitable.

It's those triple Anaconda SSS I look for. I didn't have an ideal PvE setup or a KWS scanner here, but when I do, it's very profitable:

[video=youtube;KaRY_d3f6QM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KaRY_d3f6QM[/video]
(video may still be processing)

I'm also surprised people do assassination missions currently. Aren't they still bugged? I used to enjoy chaining assassin missions until they bugged out.

They are still bugged, but there is a viable workaround if you don't mind having a small bounty on your head.
 
I've seen over 400k+ on a KWS scanned Elite Anaconda, and 200-300k is not rare.



A competent pilot in a Vulture, FDL, Python, or Anaconda can kill an typical AI Anaconda in about one minute. If you have a wing in formation in SC, all dropping into their own SSSes, then locking to whoever finds wanted Anaconda instances as they drop a beacon, you can reliably down 20-30 Anaconda an hour.



Only time I've taken out eight Vultures in a SSS alone was by flying backwards for thirty minutes. Not really fun or profitable.

It's those triple Anaconda SSS I look for. I didn't have an ideal PvE setup or a KWS scanner here, but when I do, it's very profitable:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KaRY_d3f6QM
(video may still be processing)



They are still bugged, but there is a viable workaround if you don't mind having a small bounty on your head.

Ah yes. I remember reading that work around. I just dismissed it as "not worth doing" in favour of waiting for the mission overhaul :)

Don't get me wrong, though. I'm not saying the only way to do combat is res. I actually got a bit tired of it after a while because the volume of security could get too much often. I've spent more time in conflict zones recently.

But the shell of explorative/Misson combat is too flaky to be truly fun, right now. Even if it were more profitable, which I don't feel it is.

I'm patient, though. I've had a lot of fun in the two Lugh combat goals, I've done some exploring and I raised my imperial rank from none to viscount.

I'm just going to explore exclusively, unless some combat goals crop up, between now and 1.3.
 
IMHO the bounty's do need to be brought down a bit, BUT... Only after Powerplay delivers us more high risk and reword missions.

I mean realy... A assasination mission goos to max, what... little over 200K?
Why take the time looking for 1 guy for 200K(+50k bounty scan) when you can find dozens of high paying bounty's at a RES.

Well just for rep i gues.
 
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