Console fixed weapons needs to be fixed.

[CMDR Slee Piboi]

I've been on a bit of an unfortunately typical post-FDev-announcement-disappointment-break from ED but all the better for the sake of the exercise. I just hopped in my metaboi ferdie, went to the nearest Haz RES and picked one from the first wave of spawned NPC drones.

Now this video is demonstrating a lot of typical failings in ED combat: Poor positioning, questionable timing, chasing the reticle with 4-2-0 when I should've already been at 2-4-0 by then, taking fire with 2-4-0 when I should've been at 4-2-0 even though it's just an NPC (that's no reason not to stick to best practices). Yes, also just barely sufficient aim, but I still think aiming on a gamepad is not the decisive factor here. By far the greatest improvements to DPS come from better positioning when the time comes to actually take aim and fire. I still suck but I think I'm at least focusing on improving the right aspects.

I just think it's not a very important goal to be able to make those difficult shots. A better goal is to be able to consistently put yourself in a position where it's simply hard to miss. That makes the input device much less of a concern.

 

[Deleted member 182079]

limits they put on themselves with their choice of platform. every platform has its pros and cons and you simply can't have it all. anyone half serious about flight sim that chose a console then complains about controls is just making a clown out of himself.

could frontier be more professional with analog input (aka sensitivity curves, which are standard in the genre) and with control configuration in general? for sure. every analog controller device could benefit from that.

but instead of being grateful that the game runs on consoles at all (which comes at a significant cost for the quality of the game), it seems frontier should now tweak the input method (see title) so couch junkies can feel like rambo for a few hours? "get off my lawn" i think is the apt and polite response to that

and nb: (you didn't clarify the paradox issue): yes i had choice, and i deliberately chose a method that is less efficient, harder to learn for me, but far more rewarding immersion wise. i'm sorry that such a choice isn't avaliable to players who thought pret-a-porter gaming boxes would give them superior flying sim experiences but i don't see how whining about not hitting stuff with fixed weapons and a controller is going to improve their aim or their overall peace of mind. i simply suggest more practice

You can have it all... on PC

(I've been a consoliero for most of my teenage/adult gaming life but have given up on them since the introduction of last gen as they're simply just glorified and closed ecosystem PC boxes now)

 

[Northpin]

Yea deadzones do to some degree. but with deadzone its like "nothing.. nothing.. skip to linear progession" . It just shortens the way the sticks can move.
Sry i have trouble wording this better, my english is failing me

Nope... weird enough it's really smooth...
Let me check the deazone on my ED setup in XB, here below. That setting does not mean nothing... nothing... boom - it really offers finesse for small inputs.
In the beginning i had the wrong impression that it will ignore small inputs, but really no.

I do wonder if this is working with normal controller (*) - although it should do, because i picked this hint from someone that used a normal controller iirc.


(*)I use an elite controller with this curve settings below, but the thing that really matter was to increase the DeadZone settings for Analogue sticks to the values that can be seen above (think that from the default values i increased them by 20 notches - that is 20 short pressed on right d-pad)

Spoiler: Elite Controller Analog Stick Curves

 

[CMDR Big Mike]

Everything else has a fire rate restriction which allows for aim adjustment between shots. Just refuse to use gimbals instead of ping ponging between the two, and you will get better.

To this point, I think the shock cannons are great for learning to use fixed weapons. They are semi-automatic, so they can shoot as fast as you can pull the trigger.

I threw them on my phantom that I use for getting around/ small missions, and have never taken them off

 

[[Cancelled Consoleer] boppa_]

limits they put on themselves with their choice of platform. every platform has its pros and cons and you simply can't have it all. anyone half serious about flight sim that chose a console then complains about controls is just making a clown out of himself.

could frontier be more professional with analog input (aka sensitivity curves, which are standard in the genre) and with control configuration in general? for sure. every analog controller device could benefit from that.

but instead of being grateful that the game runs on consoles at all (which comes at a significant cost for the quality of the game), it seems frontier should now tweak the input method (see title) so couch junkies can feel like rambo for a few hours? "get off my lawn" i think is the apt and polite response to that

and nb: (you didn't clarify the paradox issue): yes i had choice, and i deliberately chose a method that is less efficient, harder to learn for me, but far more rewarding immersion wise. i'm sorry that such a choice isn't avaliable to players who thought pret-a-porter gaming boxes would give them superior flying sim experiences but i don't see how whining about not hitting stuff with fixed weapons and a controller is going to improve their aim or their overall peace of mind. i simply suggest more practice

Sounds like I triggered your bias. Apologies.

 

[znôrt]

Sounds like I triggered your bias. Apologies.

yeah, and sounds that like with "my paradox", you won't elaborate on "my bias" either. why would you need to justify blanket accusations, right? godspeed.

 

[znôrt]

they can shoot as fast as you can pull the trigger.

 

[CMDR Slee Piboi]

That setting does not mean nothing... nothing... boom

Well that's the behavior typically associated with the term and having just checked it on my PS4 Pro + DS4, I find no evidence to the contrary: The analog axis deadzone slider appears to clearly set the threshold below which inputs on that particular axis are ignored.

 

[Northpin]

To this point, I think the shock cannons are great for learning to use fixed weapons. They are semi-automatic, so they can shoot as fast as you can pull the trigger.

I threw them on my phantom that I use for getting around/ small missions, and have never taken them off

I'd say, Burst lasers or Pulse lasers are best. Being hitscans really helps and even more useful, one can pair on the same trigger a burst laser and a rail
single clicks fires the burst, long click fires the rail too.... nice way to train for trigger control and aim at the same time

 

[Old Duck]

Console fixed weapons needs to be fixed.

Fixed weapons need to be fixed... Are they currently gimbaled?

 

[Northpin]

Well that's the behavior typically associated with the term and having just checked it on my PS4 Pro + DS4, I find no evidence to the contrary: The analog axis deadzone slider appears to clearly set the threshold below which inputs on that particular axis are ignored.

Based on the description i was dead sure it means exactly that nothing > boom... Hence me avoiding to touch that setting for almost 2 years (the controller has no drift whatsoever)
IT definitely not ignores the small stick moves and that means that it allows me some rather fine inputs compared with the previous really small deadzone.

No idea if it's different between PS and XB

 

[Northpin]

Fixed weapons need to be fixed... Are they currently gimbaled?

yea, they're micro-gimbaled. Which makes them hilariously easy to snipe a pixel sized PP from 5.5km and not so much from 500m

 

[znôrt]

Fixed weapons need to be fixed... Are they currently gimbaled?

in fact they are

 

[here_it_comes]

I'm an Xbox player. For the most part I have avoided fixed weapons because of the terrible time on target especially smaller, faster targets. I had attributed this to a very minor issue with my hands which sometimes make them slightly less steady and/or as responsive as normal. After reading through this thread I'm a bit happy and relieved to see PC players confirm the OPs claim that the Xbox controller doesn't offer the same repsonsiveness as either Hotas or KBM.

A clear demonstration of how drastic the difference between sticks and controllers is; I always have a Railgun in my builds just for dealing with smaller, faster targets.

Not much in combat irritates me more than trying to kill a Viper that keeps chaffing with gimbals and not having a Railgun to end it. God just kill me and end it.

 

[Commander Biscuit]

To this point, I think the shock cannons are great for learning to use fixed weapons. They are semi-automatic, so they can shoot as fast as you can pull the trigger.

I threw them on my phantom that I use for getting around/ small missions, and have never taken them off

Have to give those a try. I assumed they were just for anti xeno stuff.

 

[znôrt]

the Xbox controller doesn't offer the same repsonsiveness as either Hotas or KBM.

no, that's not what they said. or if they said that, it's nonsense.

the controller lacks resolution for small adjustments which is what you need for precise aim. that has nothing to do with responsiveness, in which controllers are probably king of the bunch, simply because the axis is much smaller than that of joysticks. if anything, the problem is too much responsiveness, which is why people are asking for profile curves to dampen the input.

so no excuses, old chap. get back to practice!

 

[here_it_comes]

Have to give those a try. I assumed they were just for anti xeno stuff.

They are made specifically for running out of ammo during your second fight.

 

[znôrt]

A clear demonstration of how drastic the difference between sticks and controllers is; I always have a Railgun in my builds just for dealing with smaller, faster targets.

Not much in combat irritates me more than trying to kill a Viper that keeps chaffing with gimbals and not having a Railgun to end it. God just kill me and end it.

why specifically railguns?

 

[here_it_comes]

why specifically railguns?

Literally can't miss if you can aim them. Pretty simple. The only other weapons that offer hit-scan don't have the instantaneous punch. Lining up the reticle for a single shot on a small fast ship isn't bad at all. Holding your reticle on them while you wait for lasers to do their work, however, is another story. Combined with micro-gimbal effect, hitting a Viper from 2km with a Railgun is pretty easy and they aren't durable enough to endure many hits.

 

[CMDR D Noize]

I was under the impression that "sensitivity" was determined by your ships Pitch/Roll/Yaw rates + Speed + Thrusters/Engineering.

As an example I've got 3 Mambas all with different modifications and they all handle slightly differently.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong..