Dolphin Imperial Cutter Dolphin busting (need help from someone with a Cutter. And maybe a Conda.)

I wrote together this handy thermals chart not too long ago. It proved among other things that the Dolphin may have the best (max) thermals of any ship. May have, as there is some grey territory here I need help conquering. First and foremost it's the best cooled ship of all the S size ships. Low weight, the best cool rate. Secondly, it blows all M sized ships out of the water too as it comes in at a lighter weight, comparable heat capacity and still superior max cool rate. Which just leaves the L size ships...

The Imperial Cutter has the best max cool rate of any ship, 72.58 BTU's per second. It's also quite heavy meaning it needs big thrusters, a big shield, etc that all draw heavily on the power plant, creating heat that can't be accounted for in my table (at least not without difficulty interpreting reactor draw). The Anaconda and the Type 10 have an 'okay' and identical max cool rate of 67.15, but the Type 10 weighs three times as heavy as the Anaconda, clocking in at about the same mass and reactor draw as the Cutter.

Now comes the interesting part. I took a Dolphin fitted with mostly E rated modules (aside from the power plant) out to Skardee 1 and hovered at 0% thrust, just above the surface on the 'sunny side' of that hell planet. Thermals stabilized at 44% heat capacity:


I did the same with a Type 10. 'Mostly' E rated modules and a short hover above Skardee 1's sunny side. 46% heat capacity:


Now, I really want to know if the Imperial Cutter cools better than Dolphin. Could someone with a Cutter kit it out roughly like this: https://coriolis.io/outfit/imperial_cutter?code=A0pjttFtlydysDf6---------------3m-4j---------.Iw18ZlA=.Aw18ZlA=..EweloBhA2AWEoFMCGBzANokICMF8KERA (don't bother with the fuel scoop if you don't have it) and do the same thing? Hover it without moving just over the surface of Skardee 1, at the daytime side. Post what % the heat capacity levels out.

Lastly, I am capable of running the same test with the Anaconda also. The Anaconda is special due to its weight and somehow still being an L size ship with all the same caveats. At a 3rd of the weight of the Type 10, you can put quite minimal E rated modules in it. It might have the Dolphin and the Imperial Cutter beat, it might not. We really won't know until we test it. https://coriolis.io/outfit/anaconda?code=A0petoFolodDsyf5--------------------------44--.Iw18ZXEA.Aw18ZXEA..EweloBhBmSQUwIYHMA28QgIwVyKBQA==

Oh and no engineering anything or the results won't mean anything. Default E rated modules only. 😋
 
Last edited:
If there turn out to be issues with the Skardee test, we could resort to fuel scooping with E rated modules instead. Should give a similar indication of where the heat capacity levels out.
 
I don't understand. I took out said Anaconda to Skardee 1 and I just can't even reach it without cooking. I can do it in the Dolphin, I can do it in the Type 10. The Type 10 has equal heat capacity, equal max cool rate as the Anaconda. The only difference are the tier of E rated modules, by which the Anaconda should have it beat. The Dolphin only has better max cool rate than the Anaconda, inferior heat capacity. Why can't the Anaconda manage the last tretch when the other two can? There must be a sweet spot between heat capacity and max cool rate that the Anaconda is missing. Or maybe I just haven't understood something about all of this.

I wish I had a better way of testing. It's so interesting. The Imperial Cutter will probably do better. But if it will do better than the Dolphin, I'm still clueless.
 
Last edited:
Have you tried it with a Keelback? That thing never overheats for me regardless of what I do with it.
Also try the diamondbacks and Asps, those also are super cold.

Also cooling rate is not the only factor in actually keeping your ship cold. PP and thruster setup have a huge effect, don't just look at the cooling rate.
 
I wrote together this handy thermals chart not too long ago. It proved among other things that the Dolphin may have the best (max) thermals of any ship. May have, as there is some grey territory here I need help conquering. First and foremost it's the best cooled ship of all the S size ships. Low weight, the best cool rate. Secondly, it blows all M sized ships out of the water too as it comes in at a lighter weight, comparable heat capacity and still superior max cool rate. Which just leaves the L size ships...

The Imperial Cutter has the best max cool rate of any ship, 72.58 BTU's per second. It's also quite heavy meaning it needs big thrusters, a big shield, etc that all draw heavily on the power plant, creating heat that can't be accounted for in my table (at least not without difficulty interpreting reactor draw). The Anaconda and the Type 10 have an 'okay' and identical max cool rate of 67.15, but the Type 10 weighs three times as heavy as the Anaconda, clocking in at about the same mass and reactor draw as the Cutter.

Now comes the interesting part. I took a Dolphin fitted with mostly E rated modules (aside from the power plant) out to Skardee 1 and hovered at 0% thrust, just above the surface on the 'sunny side' of that hell planet. Thermals stabilized at 44% heat capacity:


I did the same with a Type 10. 'Mostly' E rated modules and a short hover above Skardee 1's sunny side. 46% heat capacity:


Now, I really want to know if the Imperial Cutter cools better than Dolphin. Could someone with a Cutter kit it out roughly like this: https://coriolis.io/outfit/imperial_cutter?code=A0pjttFtlydysDf6---------------3m-4j---------.Iw18ZlA=.Aw18ZlA=..EweloBhA2AWEoFMCGBzANokICMF8KERA (don't bother with the fuel scoop if you don't have it) and do the same thing? Hover it without moving just over the surface of Skardee 1, at the daytime side. Post what % the heat capacity levels out.

Lastly, I am capable of running the same test with the Anaconda also. The Anaconda is special due to its weight and somehow still being an L size ship with all the same caveats. At a 3rd of the weight of the Type 10, you can put quite minimal E rated modules in it. It might have the Dolphin and the Imperial Cutter beat, it might not. We really won't know until we test it. https://coriolis.io/outfit/anaconda?code=A0petoFolodDsyf5--------------------------44--.Iw18ZXEA.Aw18ZXEA..EweloBhBmSQUwIYHMA28QgIwVyKBQA==

Oh and no engineering anything or the results won't mean anything. Default E rated modules only. 😋
Couple of points, might want to specify the exact altitude and if you didn't do the Dolphin with the Fuel scoop turned off. I don't know if the fuel scoop effects thermals from power draw when not deployed, but better to be sure.
 
Have you tried it with a Keelback? That thing never overheats for me regardless of what I do with it.
Also try the diamondbacks and Asps, those also are super cold.

Also cooling rate is not the only factor in actually keeping your ship cold. PP and thruster setup have a huge effect, don't just look at the cooling rate.
You missed the point of this massively. The idea is to figure out which can go the absolute coolest. Not which is cooler in a specific config, though ideally ofc you would want to take engineering and fitting for coldness into account. I suspect the Dolphin wins that one hands down though.
 
Took a Cutter there, specs as per your build. The approach was a tad on the toasty side with heat levels reaching ~250% before SC exit. Once in position at 100 m above ground it settled at 56%

cutter heat test skardee.jpg

Hope that helps, i'll keep the ship nearby for now in case you want another test done.
 
Took a Cutter there, specs as per your build. The approach was a tad on the toasty side with heat levels reaching ~250% before SC exit. Once in position at 100 m above ground it settled at 56%

View attachment 182262
Hope that helps, i'll keep the ship nearby for now in case you want another test done.
Thanks so much for testing. Okay, so that means thermals just work differently in supercruise, acting more like a multiplyer than a '+30% heat from the FSD'. Proximity to a star, mass, fuel scooping and perhaps FSD module tier may all enter into it.

This is really exciting. I'll try again with the Anaconda later today.

Also, at 56% heat above the surface, it really does seem like the higher max cool rate didn't make up for the Cutters additional weight/min module tiers. I think we can already say that the Dolphin has the best max cool rate.
 
You missed the point of this massively. The idea is to figure out which can go the absolute coolest. Not which is cooler in a specific config, though ideally ofc you would want to take engineering and fitting for coldness into account. I suspect the Dolphin wins that one hands down though.
Exactly, though there is a notable difference between min and max cool rate. Check the thermals chart in my signature for a detailed explanation. Tldr: cool rate is not a constant. For silent running and some degree stealth running other ships still do better. When it comes to overheating however, the Dolphin does indeed seem to reign supreme (so trick out those space blasters).
 
Couple of points, might want to specify the exact altitude and if you didn't do the Dolphin with the Fuel scoop turned off. I don't know if the fuel scoop effects thermals from power draw when not deployed, but better to be sure.
Yeah. I did say just above the surface. I imagine a couple hundred metres above it isn't going to impact the figures much. I'll try again with fuel scooping turned off. Right now though it seems as though a different thermals calculation entirely is used in supercruise. I can't begin to guess how it works yet, but I imagine it's something we want to get to the bottom of.
 
You missed the point of this massively. The idea is to figure out which can go the absolute coolest. Not which is cooler in a specific config, though ideally ofc you would want to take engineering and fitting for coldness into account. I suspect the Dolphin wins that one hands down though.
To work out the absolute coolest but not in a specific config taking into account engineering etc... hmm ok... o7

If the idea is to work out the absolute coolest then taking a single quoted stat is not the way to do so. And not testing with some of the known coolest ships in game is just a silly idea.. But whatever I really couldn't care less as the dolphin isn't a ship I'll fly again any time soon so vOv
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I managed to get the Anaconda to Skardee 1 with minor thermal damage. Disabling the fuel scoop had no effect by the way. Just above the surface I saw this figure:



For the Anaconda, to run at 51% thermal capacity just above the surface and not running cool enough in supercruise raises a lot of questions. It may seem to suggest that the Edsy data isn't correct, but Treya's result does collaborate the findings so... yeah. o_O

Either way, the tests have been conclusive. It's damn hard to overheat a Dolphin! 🐬

 
Last edited:
Ah minor update, I had the wrong reactor installed on the Dolphin. A 3E powerplant instead of a 2A, I don't know how that slipped my mind. Al that really means is that the heat efficiency would have been even higher and the thermal capacity readings on Skardee 1 would have been even better. I can post another screenshot later, but I think my work here is over.
 
Updated figure for the Dolphin: 37% (Wow!)


Seems like small step to go from 3E to 2A, but I wasn't expecting a 7% drop! The Dolphin truly is unbeatable. Keen to see what engineering will ultimately do to this figure. Also this probably explains the weird differences we see between the capital ships. The individual gains in efficiency and mass reduction may be small, but the differences in terms of thermal output ends up being quite large.

Lastly I was again able to confirm I had trouble raising the temperature in supercruise on the approach to Skardee 1 above 47%. There really is something else at work with the supercruise thermal calculations and the Dolphin is unsurprisingly hitting another home run there.
 
Last edited:
I have a question. Why are the ships thermals in '%' and not degrees?
The degrees would be different for every ship at the same '%' wouldn't they or am I missing something. That could mean a dolphin at 50% might be 20 degrees c and a cutter at 50% might be 2000 degrees c then a 1% rise in both ships could be a difference of 100s of degrees in heat.
 
Thanks for asking, it's a good question. Most of the figures are not in percentages but BTU's (heat units) or BTU's per second (see the original research thread linked in the other at the top of this thread). Heat units unlike percentages are expressed in fixed amounts or rates for all ships, so individual ships can still be compared.

The thing about paying attention to percentages in this thread is that they are still relevant. At 100% heat capacity, no matter how many degrees your ship can take, your ship starts taking damage. So any ship that balances out (innate ability to release heat while also heating up) below that is a ship that does better than others.

Degrees are not a figure we have access to, I have doubts they even enter into the calculations. If they do, I'm not aware of a conversion table at any rate. It would be cool to see those figures, but wouldn't be more practical than the figures we already have.
 
Last edited:
Top Bottom