Elite Dangerous now on Steam

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James Harper

James Harper
FuzzySpider said:
Ok. I am going to explain this to you one more time before you end up joining the ranks of the ignore list (a few others have ended up there due to this thread). Not because you're offensive, but because if you do not take this on board I'm clearly on your self-imposed ignore list and it's impossible to get through to you.

I am not saying that you're wrong, I am not saying that FD haven't reached a deal with Steam where they can issue keys to existing customers somehow, I am not saying that people shouldn't get Steam access for Elite. I am saying that you're completely failing to address the actual point being made about the cost to FD when you talk about "giving free keys".

Steam does not sell keys! Steam sells licenses to use the software they support.

When you go to buy a new car, you pay for a car. You do not pay for a key. A key is issued to you on sale of the car so that you can access your purchase.

Software keys are the exact same thing.

You buy a license to use a piece of software, and a key is given to you so that you can access that software.

Following me so far....?

What happens if my cars ignition switch fails? Or I need a new immobilizer? Or I simply lose the key?

I am issued with a new key, whether one is cut from the old key or whether a new ignition is fitted.

It works the same for software. Someone could lose their key, their account could be compromised, whatever, so any developer is given as many keys as they need. This is because keys are a functional part of the platform.

Keys are not the issue. To own a key is not to own a game.

Let me prove it to you. Go and buy a retail copy of UT2004 in a store or on Amazon. Note that the game is supported on Steam. Try to use your CD key on steam.

Are you still following?

Now. Let's discuss business.

Steam ask for (I think) 34% commission on games retailed on their platform. For that they host the game, put it on their hard drives, supply bandwidth, give tech support, support patches, advertise etc. That's how Valve make their return on Steam.

Now what they are doing with FD (you'd have us believe) is to allow FD to sell the product not on Steam but on their own retail site, take absolutely nothing from the sales there, and then support those customers on their platform for free. If Valve allowed every developer to do this, to basically sell the product on their own websites but give them Steam access to support it, it'd be economic madness.



What you've linked is a marketing blurb, not the contract said entities have to agree to for that service.
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I'm not sure how being in your ignore list would make the world worse for me. You are welcome to put me on your ignore list.

That stuff about FD being charged a 34% commission on games retailed on Steam's storefront doesn't have anything to do with issuing Steam keys (and it's 30% anyway)
That's separate, always has been and will continue to be. About that "discuss business" stuff, a lot of third party retailers sell games with Steam keys... Why do you think they do that? Because the devs send them Steam keys (they know that most people prefer having their games on Steam)
Do you think that Valve charges them extra for that? That devs pay a fee to whatever third party store we are talking about and THEN pay a 30% fee to Valve?
If that was how it worked, no one would sell their games on alternate stores like Gamersgate, GMG, Getgamesgo, Humble Store, etc. Why do you think that indies sell their games through Humble Store widgets? Because they don't have to pay anything to Valve when they do so, even if they provide Steam keys.
There's a lot of information about how Steam keys are handled if you cared to search for it. I've already linked some, which you readily dismissed as "marketing blurb"

Do not spread misinformation if you can't back that with real sources. It doesn't make any sense and doesn't help anyone.
 

Sanderson

Sanderson
AlexRyder said:
You always continue to attend the concerts...
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.......and continue to feel disappointment the child is half assing it when you know they have so much more talent and potential. Then you watch them grow up to live in a trailer sitting around waiting for their monthly food stamps to renew.....oh wait, that's my life LOL.

Unfortunately I think FD has bigger aspirations (publisher) and ED was just a necessary evil David needed to endure along the road to EAdom.
 
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FuzzySpider

FuzzySpider
James Harper said:
Do not spread misinformation if you can't back that with real sources. It doesn't make any sense and doesn't help anyone.
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Don't make posts demanding for "real sources" if you don't supply any of your own.

James Harper said:
That stuff about FD being charged a 34% commission on games retailed on Steam's storefront doesn't have anything to do with issuing Steam keys (and it's 30% anyway)
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Precisely. However it was you who was going on about keys.

James Harper said:
That's separate, always has been and will continue to be. About that "discuss business" stuff, a lot of third party retailers sell games with Steam keys... Why do you think they do that? Because the devs send them Steam keys (they know that most people prefer having their games on Steam)
Do you think that Valve charges them extra for that? That devs pay a fee to whatever third party store we are talking about and THEN pay a 30% fee to Valve?
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No. I think Valve charges them something for that though. They certainly don't do this for free; they are a business not a charity.

James Harper said:
If that was how it worked, no one would sell their games on alternate stores like Gamersgate, GMG, Getgamesgo, Humble Store, etc. Why do you think that indies sell their games through Humble Store widgets? Because they don't have to pay anything to Valve when they do so, even if they provide Steam keys.
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This is naive. They are doing business with Valve for something other than fairy dust and kind words.

James Harper said:
There's a lot of information about how Steam keys are handled if you cared to search for it. I've already linked some, which you readily dismissed as "marketing blurb"
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You linked a single marketing page tailored to get peoples interest in signing on to Steam. What you didn't provide was any of the legal contractual information someone would have to sign up to in order to get their product on to Steam. You can't get the information I am requesting though, because Steam don't publish it publically.
 

Fisker

F
FuzzySpider said:
You linked a single marketing page tailored to get peoples interest in signing on to Steam. What you didn't provide was any of the legal contractual information someone would have to sign up to in order to get their product on to Steam. You can't get the information I am requesting though, because Steam don't publish it publically.
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The service is not mentioned is the Distribution Agreement, which you can probably find if you look around, but since the contracts are confidential it would probably be against rules to link said ones.

Either way they're still facts, I'm sorry they got in your way.
 
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the_glizer

T
Elite:Dangerous on steam Elite:Dangerous on steam

So i just noticed that frontier just released elite dangerous to steam, and i believe they've said that they wont give out keys to activate the copy on steam since it's the same launcher anyway. And since i am a butt hurt steam fan boy i want to brag to my friends that i own elite dangerous, have recorded play hours, and seeing when other people are playing e.t.c. so plz Frontier allow us to integrate it into steam better.

thanks for reading my pathetic rant about how i hate everything in the world. <3
 

Mystified

M
FuzzySpider said:
This is naive. They are doing business with Valve for something other than fairy dust and kind words.
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Yes. Frontier to sell their game to a bigger audience, and Steam to get the profit from selling their game on their platform (30% of Steam sales, the numbers of which have clearly proven significant) and possible future patronage from anyone activating their Non-steam sold copies on Steam. There's clear, obvious quid pro quo in what they are doing. The only reason it wouldn't be the case is if every sale happened outside of Steam, which is why F2P games aren't allowed to just use Steam for hosting and get all their sales elsewhere.
 

gulasch

G
Devineus said:
I bought this game last month... had i known it was to be released on steam this month i would have waited..... steam keys should be made available to purchasing clients... if you are worried about giving out two copies of the game then link they steam key to the players LOG-IN so they can only use their existing login on the steam key. Simple.... So pls gimme my steam key
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+1 Like this idea!

I already added Elite as non-steam game to my library some weeks ago, hoping that some of my friends watch me playing and the buy the game ;)
 

CptPaul

C
Where is the update on our steam keys. Where is the update on our steam keys.

Where are they? You should have given them out already. We supported you.
 

FuzzySpider

FuzzySpider
Mystified said:
Yes. Frontier to sell their game to a bigger audience, and Steam to get the profit from selling their game on their platform (30% of Steam sales, the numbers of which have clearly proven significant) and possible future patronage from anyone activating their Non-steam sold copies on Steam. There's clear, obvious quid pro quo in what they are doing. The only reason it wouldn't be the case is if every sale happened outside of Steam, which is why F2P games aren't allowed to just use Steam for hosting and get all their sales elsewhere.
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That might well be the case. I am skeptical though as the game has been out for months now and the reason FD went to them was that sales were starting to slow (or maybe sales had hit a brick wall). IF that was the case then why would Valve agree to take on Elite - a product with declining sales - if they could not have a small slice of the pie of those sales already made? If sales were not in decline then why would FD go to them?

My big concern (not involving keys) is the future of the game more than what has gone before. Although the paintjobs haven't yet appeared on Steam I'm starting to wonder when that'll happen, and whether the people yelling about Steam not taking money from FD in this thread will use FDs own online store or use Steams store to make such purchases. This will be even more prevalent when future expansions appear with a huge chunk of the royalties going towards Valve.

Steam has its fans, and I can see why - Valve single handedly dragged PC gaming out of a rut with Steam. But their market dominance is starting to create problems. When a game like Elite can't even get out there without let The Man(TM) wet his beak then something is wrong in the marketplace.
 
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