[ALLIANCE] Elite Diplomatic Corps - Open for business

[Dharrch Streynjer]

This is wierd:
The AEDC isn't even a Faction, iether in game or out. It's just a bunch of players that have decided to run the game from inside and watch out if you get in the way.
So far all I've heard is how much fun you're all having and if we don't like it we can always go do something else. Isn't that what Harry Potter says too?
Like it or not your actions impact on our game. Sometimes in ways that are detrimental. It isn't fun to correct your actions. But it is neccessary if we wish to continue to play the game. So if you aren't actually Harry Potter clones and are in fact real people who care as much about the game as having fun maybe you'll start consenting to being reasonable.

*yawn*

Carry on yawning because while you're sleeping the numbers are growing...

 

[_Flin_]

So, without a comprehensive and public list, your stance is untenable.

If your friends want to talk with us, we will gladly talk with them.
We have loads of friends, allies and partners that we get along well with. We even share a system of our main faction with one of the biggest PMFs in the galaxy.
We can get along well.

 

[Mangal Oemie]

They don't want "help to expand" they want to play the game themselves.
So they need to know which systems are "yours" so they can choose one away from interference, which is what I've advised.
You can't say:
because:

1. Player factions have no way of choosing to avoid systems that AEDC claim to be theirs.
2. You can't expand from a system without taking the system away from AEDC first.
3. There is no way to be sure that any AEDC claim of a faction being supported is truthful.

So, without a comprehensive and public list, your stance is untenable.

Hi DeadMeatGF,

I was actually going to let this go, as one of AEDC's factions has been neighbors with Hutton Orbital Truckers for years, and we have never run into each other, and avoided expansions into each other's systems. We got close with Luhman 16, but it ultimately went elsewhere. To our understanding, we have a good relationship with the Truckers, and of course understand that through your existing relations are helping LRN.

We are of course not going to publish a list during the current circumstances and provide our opponents with a target list. But if anyone would like to check with us whether a particular system for a new PMF would cause problems, you're always more than welcome to come by in our Discord and ask. We're about promoting BGS play, not limiting people from doing so.

 

[Elmasri]

If your friends want to talk with us, we will gladly talk with them.
We have loads of friends, allies and partners that we get along well with. We even share a system of our main faction with one of the biggest PMFs in the galaxy.
We can get along well.

So, what you are saying is that there is no clear list, or you are not going to share it? It does seem that what others have said above has some basis then. That you could just claim that you were always supporting some random minor faction so that you can say "We were here first" in response to any player managed faction.

 

[_Flin_]

This is wierd:
The AEDC isn't even a Faction, iether in game or out.

We were playing with our faction way before there was the luxury to insert a PMF.
And we thought it to be not really fair to insert yet another AEDC faction into the game.

 

[_Flin_]

So, what you are saying is that there is no clear list, or you are not going to share it? It does seem that what others have said above has some basis then. That you could just claim that you were always supporting some random minor faction so that you can say "We were here first" in response to any player managed faction.

We defend the Alliance. Why are you so keen on attacking Alliance systems?

 

[Elmasri]

We defend the Alliance. Why are you so keen on attacking Alliance systems?

Who? Me? I have nothing against the Alliance. My alt commander is an Alliance aligned commander. I was just agreeing with a comment made that there is a lack of transparency here.

 

[_Flin_]

Who? Me? I have nothing against the Alliance. My alt commander is an Alliance aligned commander. I was just agreeing with a comment made that there is a lack of transparency here.

Well, then there is no issue with us then. But asking for a list of factions we support at times when all of our systems are under attack... I mean... really?

As long as noone goes on a conquering rampage through Alliance space, there will probably not be any issue with the AEDC. We try to find solutions with all PMFs we come across. As we did with LRN. If someone is stubborn, unwilling to compromise, and is even breaking the agreements we had... well... everyone chooses his opponents and his friends. We like our friends. We like our opponents. They give us something to do.

 

[Dharrch Streynjer]

We were playing with our faction way before there was the luxury to insert a PMF.
And we thought it to be not really fair to insert yet another AEDC faction into the game.

I can understand your thinking here but in fact your stance, admirable as it is (and I do mean that), actually serves the opposite purpose.
Having a player group that organises other factions in the background is tantamount to acting like an Elite Dangerous version of the "Masons".

Wow! Have I just called the AEDC a manipulative secret society that purports to act in the interests of the weak and disadvantaged whilst secretly (or inadvertantly) fulfilling it's own unpublished agenda?

In other words I'm saying that if you actually had an in game PMF then we'd all know where we and you stand in relation to each other's boundaries. Now that would be fair.

o7

 

[Elmasri]

Well, then there is no issue with us then. But asking for a list of factions we support at times when all of our systems are under attack... I mean... really?

As long as noone goes on a conquering rampage through Alliance space, there will probably not be any issue with the AEDC. We try to find solutions with all PMFs we come across. As we did with LRN. If someone is stubborn, unwilling to compromise, and is even breaking the agreements we had... well... everyone chooses his opponents and his friends. We like our friends. We like our opponents. They give us something to do.

As I said, I have nothing against the Alliance. But saying that, I am a supporter of LRN. I have listened to Lave Radio since before the game was released, so naturally was happy to support them recently.

As a player of the original Elite on the BBC Micro, Lave has always had a special place in my heart. But Lave as I knew it was independent.

 

[Dharrch Streynjer]

Well, then there is no issue with us then. But asking for a list of factions we support at times when all of our systems are under attack... I mean... really?

As long as noone goes on a conquering rampage through Alliance space, there will probably not be any issue with the AEDC. We try to find solutions with all PMFs we come across. As we did with LRN. If someone is stubborn, unwilling to compromise, and is even breaking the agreements we had... well... everyone chooses his opponents and his friends. We like our friends. We like our opponents. They give us something to do.

I would also like to clarify another point here.

The AEDC have no systems. Zero, zilch. Jumping in to support PMFs that have requested it, or else at least have declared affilliations with the AEDC (as indeed we at the ARC have) is a legitimate excuse to get involved. But there is no Alliance PMF in Lave and the LFO cannot request assistance from the AEDC. This in my mind (and I speak only for myself here) makes the AEDCs actions in lave inexcusable and without foundation.

As for compromise and agreements. It has been proven time and again that there was no agreement.
I myself have petitioned on behalf of LRN for a compromise and was told that there would be none.

The AEDC do not stand by thier principles and have proven themselves to be untrusworthy and unreliable.
The ARC are not the only Alliance PMF that believes this to be so

o7

 

[Dharrch Streynjer]

I was wondering, having just re-read the main forum rules.
Is this ok for us to have this debate here or will we get into trouble?

o7

 

[_Flin_]

I was wondering, having just re-read the main forum rules.
Is this ok for us to have this debate here or will we get into trouble?

o7

As members of the Alliance we believe in free speech for everyone, regardless of wealth or aristocratic rank. So unless anyone starts harassing or insulting us, we usually do not report anyone.

 

[_Flin_]

The AEDC have no systems. Zero, zilch.

This is an interesting interpretation. We do have a faction registered as "ours" with Frontier. And it rules systems, controls assets and is well known.

 

[Dharrch Streynjer]

As members of the Alliance we believe in free speech for everyone, regardless of wealth or aristocratic rank. So unless anyone starts harassing or insulting us, we usually do not report anyone.

LoL Thanks for that I appreciate it. However the rule I was referring to was:

Posts in threads should relate to the group only. Posts attacking the group concept generally or trying to bash the efforts of another group will be moderated.

o7

 

[_Flin_]

LoL Thanks for that I appreciate it. However the rule I was referring to was:

Posts in threads should relate to the group only. Posts attacking the group concept generally or trying to bash the efforts of another group will be moderated.

o7

Yeah, but we are basically discussing why people should play the BGS and why the AEDC is a good place to do so. So all is well. ;-)

 

[Dharrch Streynjer]

This is an interesting interpretation. We do have a faction registered as "ours" with Frontier. And it rules systems, controls assets and is well known.

Ah if that's so then I apologise. What is this faction and where can I attack it (only kidding :¬))
Seriously though I would like to know it's name and how you claim it rather then just support it as a PSF.

Regardless the rest of my statement still applies.

o7

 

[pjlillington]

I would also like to clarify another point here.

The AEDC have no systems. Zero, zilch. Jumping in to support PMFs that have requested it, or else at least have declared affilliations with the AEDC (as indeed we at the ARC have) is a legitimate excuse to get involved. But there is no Alliance PMF in Lave and the LFO cannot request assistance from the AEDC. This in my mind (and I speak only for myself here) makes the AEDCs actions in lave inexcusable and without foundation.

As for compromise and agreements. It has been proven time and again that there was no agreement.
I myself have petitioned on behalf of LRN for a compromise and was told that there would be none.

The AEDC do not stand by thier principles and have proven themselves to be untrusworthy and unreliable.
The ARC are not the only Alliance PMF that believes this to be so

o7

Elite Dangerous is a sandbox game. There is no one right way to play Elite, and neither is there one right way to play the BGS, we all have different goals. AEDC take on the BGS is here: https://aedcnews.wordpress.com/2018/07/21/official-statement/. If you read that, you'll find our principles, and that we abide by them.

 

[_Flin_]

Elite Dangerous is a sandbox game. There is no one right way to play Elite, and neither is there one right way to play the BGS, we all have different goals. AEDC take on the BGS is here: https://aedcnews.wordpress.com/2018/07/21/official-statement/. If you read that, you'll find our principles, and that we abide by them.

The good thing about it is that we always offer talks. We are Diplomats, after all. Talking is fun. And carrying a big stick - to hit rude and unreliable people with - is fun, too.

 

[DeadMeatGF]

...I was actually going to let this go...

Let this go?
As if some misdemeanor has been committed? This is exactly the arrogant attitude that makes you unapproachable.

...we have a good relationship with the Truckers, and of course understand that through your existing relations are helping LRN...

That doesn't even make sense, but if you're implying that I am fighting the AEDC on LRN's behalf you're very much mistaken - I basically fly around Hutton space or head into the black.

...But if anyone would like to check with us whether a particular system for a new PMF would cause problems, you're always more than welcome to come by in our Discord and ask...

That is basically you telling them they need to ask permission from AEDC? No. Absolutely unacceptable. Nor is it acceptable to expect a new group to have their application ready to go, then come and ask if any of their 3 potential systems conflict with any of yours, then go back and adjust, then come back to you, then ... This is not your game to police.

...We're about promoting BGS play, not limiting people from doing so

You're not acting like it.