External View [A definitive discussion]

[willowfan]

If you can play by using an external view, then ship choice is meaningless except for loadouts. Why should everyone be able to see everywhere equally if the ship cockpits have vastly different window configurations? Flying a Viper compared to an Eagle is (and should be) a totally different experience based on what you can see from the cockpit. Why negate those differences by allowing third-person-view gameplay? By having cockpit-only gameplay, ship choice actually means something.
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Sorry that some folks consider that not being able to play from an external view is a dealbreaker, but then that's the way it is. In the end, it's better to have not spent the money on the game than to spend it, find out you don't like it, and come to the boards and complain and say the game is poo.
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Cheers

Simple. Make it so you can't steer or fire weapons in external view. Make it useful for vanity shot only. And to make sure it can't be used during combat to sneak a look, make the control lock out persist for a few seconds after returning to cockpit view.

 

[Evyl Minkey]

Or make it last for a limited period while you float away from your ship. You then die, it wipes your save and you start again. Everybody's happy.

 

[Genar-Hofoen]

If you can play by using an external view, then ship choice is meaningless except for loadouts. Why should everyone be able to see everywhere equally if the ship cockpits have vastly different window configurations? Flying a Viper compared to an Eagle is (and should be) a totally different experience based on what you can see from the cockpit. Why negate those differences by allowing third-person-view gameplay? By having cockpit-only gameplay, ship choice actually means something.
.
Sorry that some folks consider that not being able to play from an external view is a dealbreaker, but then that's the way it is. In the end, it's better to have not spent the money on the game than to spend it, find out you don't like it, and come to the boards and complain and say the game is poo.
.
Cheers

I can picture in my mind's eye trying to fly a Cobra purely on complete-freedom external view during an intense battle with many other ships present. It would be impractical to do so - you must be in the cockpit to do battle. Even with one ship it'd be impractical to try and win a battle using an external view.

Try it - run that movie in your head - picture a Cobra (or viper or whatever), now picture that free-form external view, now picture trying to use that to fight another ship which can be anywhere around you in a giant spherical radius relative to your ship.

It simply doesn't matter if you have a free-form external view. You'd have to somehow control that view whilst simultaneously control your ship, your power management, weapons control, etc. By default, external views are inherently useless during battles due to how ship flight, control, and power management works .

 

[AH_ImADot]

I can picture in my mind's eye trying to fly a Cobra purely on complete-freedom external view during an intense battle with many other ships present. It would be impractical to do so - you must be in the cockpit to do battle. Even with one ship it'd be impractical to try and win a battle using an external view.

Try it - run that movie in your head - picture a Cobra (or viper or whatever), now picture that free-form external view, now picture trying to use that to fight another ship which can be anywhere around you in a giant spherical radius relative to your ship.

It simply doesn't matter if you have a free-form external view. You'd have to somehow control that view whilst simultaneously control your ship, your power management, weapons control, etc. By default, external views are inherently useless during battles due to how ship flight, control, and power management works .

I understand full well that combat from an external view, unless paired with in-game systems to allow it (avionics hud, reticule, etc.) is difficult for most. People can and will find a way to take advantage of everything. I've heard of people taking a marker and putting a dot in the middle of their monitor (right where every gunsight reticule is always aimed). Then they can go external or move their view to some extreme and un-natural position to gain a view advantage, but still know exactly where their weapons will shoot.
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I would have no issue with external views for general flying around, but once you get into combat or try to dock, it should only be done from inside the cockpit.

 

[Sir.Tj]

So this game seems like an amazing concept, but I have a simple question after watching a few youtube videos.

Is there an external view available while playing E ?

It may sound silly, but this is a bit of a deal-breaker for me, and I'm hopeful someone can let me know what the view/camera options are like before I shell out sixty bucks.

Hi, to keep things tidy I'm going to merge your thread into the main one discussing External views. Feel free to continue discussing it here.

 

[Genar-Hofoen]

I understand full well that combat from an external view, unless paired with in-game systems to allow it (avionics hud, reticule, etc.) is difficult for most. People can and will find a way to take advantage of everything. I've heard of people taking a marker and putting a dot in the middle of their monitor (right where every gunsight reticule is always aimed). Then they can go external or move their view to some extreme and un-natural position to gain a view advantage, but still know exactly where their weapons will shoot.
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I would have no issue with external views for general flying around, but once you get into combat or try to dock, it should only be done from inside the cockpit.

Simply disabling weapons control, power management, HUD, etc. whilst in free-form external view would accomplish this.

 

[Derpster Frey]

I agree, disabling controls when in external view seems like a solution.
Disable external view when in combat as well.

 

[Globusdiablo]

Simply disabling weapons control, power management, HUD, etc. whilst in free-form external view would accomplish this.

I like your thinking.

 

[Raimo]

Could not vote anymore, but I'll say wholeheartedly: YES, we need the external view.

But disable the external view in combat (with hardpoints out) etc if needed.

 

[Genar-Hofoen]

Could not vote anymore, but I'll say wholeheartedly: YES, we need the external view.

But disable the external view in combat (with hardpoints out) etc if needed.

Better idea : disable ship piloting and weapons fire during external view - simples really. I just don't understand why there's even a debate about this when you can disable weapons fire/piloting upon selecting external view. You'd be mad to select external view during combat anyway - unless you're a 'neutral' in a combat zone and wanted footage of the action there I suppose - and even then it'd be risky.

 

[realdragnet]

I miss external view too

Don't care if possible to combat or not while in it

 

[Deyn]

If you can play by using an external view, then ship choice is meaningless except for loadouts. Why should everyone be able to see everywhere equally if the ship cockpits have vastly different window configurations? Flying a Viper compared to an Eagle is (and should be) a totally different experience based on what you can see from the cockpit. Why negate those differences by allowing third-person-view gameplay? By having cockpit-only gameplay, ship choice actually means something.
.
Sorry that some folks consider that not being able to play from an external view is a dealbreaker, but then that's the way it is. In the end, it's better to have not spent the money on the game than to spend it, find out you don't like it, and come to the boards and complain and say the game is poo.
.
Cheers

Actually this thread is as old as Beta the least. People asked for an external view during development, not "after" the game was released.
People don't ask for a COMBAT view, rather the external cam and fly-by shots, Frontier themselves use to advertise and showcase the game.
A lot of practical solutions to the "unfair" or whatever arguments were presented in this thread, you just need to take the time to read it, rather than chiming in on page 200+ and bother us with fanboyish contraproductive repetitions, again.

And yet again (the broken Record):
- simple external rotating camera and fly-by (already in the game engine for the Frontier developers)
- no HUD or flight info
- no fixed alignment to players ship when moving
- limit as option to Solo mode

 

[Globusdiablo]

...- limit as option to Solo mode

NOOooo Deyn... Why?..

 

[Genar-Hofoen]

Actually this thread is as old as Beta the least. People asked for an external view during development, not "after" the game was released.
People don't ask for a COMBAT view, rather the external cam and fly-by shots, Frontier themselves use to advertise and showcase the game.
A lot of practical solutions to the "unfair" or whatever arguments were presented in this thread, you just need to take the time to read it, rather than chiming in on page 200+ and bother us with fanboyish contraproductive repetitions, again.

And yet again (the broken Record):
- simple external rotating camera and fly-by (already in the game engine for the Frontier developers)
- no HUD or flight info
- no fixed alignment to players ship when moving
- limit as option to Solo mode

I was with you - right up till "- limit as option to Solo mode".

As I (keep) saying - just disable all flight/weapon operating when in an external view mode - it really is that simple.

 

[NeilF]

I was with you - right up till "- limit as option to Solo mode".

As I (keep) saying - just disable all flight/weapon operating when in an external view mode - it really is that simple.

Some people might like too see their ship with weapons out, and maybe even firing, so it would be a shame to introduce such a limitation unless really necessary.

Personally I still think, that a simple set of limitation can give an external view that doesn't need to worry where you are or what you do/don't have deployed. Just have limitations (nerfs) that mean that generally it's at best not superior to cockpit, and generally inferior to cockpit.

 

[Vincent Starson]

What are the odds the reason there is no external view is because the only part of your ship being rendered by your game is the front half that you can turn around to see?

This would explain the bug with paintjobs for asp not showing at all, since the full texture wouldn't work on half the ship unless modified.

I've noticed weird rendering glitches when looking 90 degrees to the left in my asp, Planet textures do strange things based on your ship's viewing angle.

 

[NeilF]

What are the odds the reason there is no external view is because the only part of your ship being rendered by your game is the front half that you can turn around to see?

This would explain the bug with paintjobs for asp not showing at all, since the full texture wouldn't work on half the ship unless modified.

I've noticed weird rendering glitches when looking 90 degrees to the left in my asp, Planet textures do strange things based on your ship's viewing angle.

Potentially... But don't forget we have plenty of FD videos that are almost certainly showing some sort of external view feature (or very similar)?

 

[NeoRacer_XOX]

I agree man, who the hell wants shots of their ship with no weapons firing?

Some people might like too see their ship with weapons out, and maybe even firing, so it would be a shame to introduce such a limitation unless really necessary.

Personally I still think, that a simple set of limitation can give an external view that doesn't need to worry where you are or what you do/don't have deployed. Just have limitations (nerfs) that mean that generally it's at best not superior to cockpit, and generally inferior to cockpit.

 

[Olythekid]

Just allow a replay function where you can take screenshot. Problem solved, stay in first person view while in game and fighting, can still take zillions of great looking screenshots.

 

[RickFlist]

Feature Request: External Cameras Accessible From Cockpit

Hello Frontier Developers!


First off, let me thank you for an awesome game. I have been waiting for a game like this since Privateer by Origin Games back before I entered puberty, and it has done nothing but fulfill every hope I've had for a space sim.


I would like to request some form of backup/side camera interface, particularly for larger ships. My argument for this is that my car has this today, which is not hard to park without the camera and yet I have one. This would help getting larger ships through the mail slots as I'd be able to check my clearances. It would also help me keep eyes on someone chasing me while I try to get into warp.

The interface is pretty awesome as it is - i don't have problems docking or evading today. It just seems like this would be an awesome addition to the game that makes sense.

Discuss.