Federation SWAT overpowered wing

Ok thats ridiculous! Please someone explain me why there are no such ships/weapons used or seen in any other military conflict in Elite?!

A I: It's a videogame.

A II : It's sort of, kind of, like a watered down version of Eve's CONCORD system. In that videogame, if you anger the CONCORD gods, they will very quickly destroy you - just be glad that Frontier have introduced a very forgiving set of ATR gods - they at least tell you how long they're going to take to arrive, giving you time to scoot away.
 
Now multiply the ATR damage by 3, and it's what it's like for a trader getting seal clubbed by basic engineered PvP ships, but with a 60m credit loss.... still ouch.
 
When ATR show up, you are meant to have a choice of "Leave now, or die". If they were regular G5 equipped ships, they would not fulfil that role against our Combat modded ships, as it could take 20+ minutes to make a kill.

You aren't meant to be able to stand and fight them.

That's a fair point but seriously, achieving that end by just giving them +35 Swords of Smiting is literally the most classically lame way to address the issue in the history of gaming. It's been done since the dawn of gaming and it's been lame since the dawn of gaming.

The second lamest way of doing it is just getting an npc horde to dogpile the player and even that is an order of magnitude better.
 
That's a fair point but seriously, achieving that end by just giving them +35 Swords of Smiting is literally the most classically lame way to address the issue in the history of gaming. It's been done since the dawn of gaming and it's been lame since the dawn of gaming.

The second lamest way of doing it is just getting an npc horde to dogpile the player and even that is an order of magnitude better.

You'll feel better. Go over to C&P Rules thread and get a good taunt in. That should do it.
 
A I: It's a videogame.

A II : It's sort of, kind of, like a watered down version of Eve's CONCORD system. In that videogame, if you anger the CONCORD gods, they will very quickly destroy you - just be glad that Frontier have introduced a very forgiving set of ATR gods - they at least tell you how long they're going to take to arrive, giving you time to scoot away.

Look, I'm a RP-er with all the pointy dice to prove it.

It is really hurting my mind that the military don't have this stuff. Just the town dog-catchers (...pun intended...)

If Frontier won't rebalance shields they could at least put this stuff on some military ships in some situations ... for muh immershun
 
A II : It's sort of, kind of, like a watered down version of Eve's CONCORD system. In that videogame, if you anger the CONCORD gods, they will very quickly destroy you - just be glad that Frontier have introduced a very forgiving set of ATR gods - they at least tell you how long they're going to take to arrive, giving you time to scoot away.

Never played EVE, how gets that CONCORD system triggered? Is it also some kind of security system?

In my opinion this is just cheap, they could have solved it much more convenient. Lets assume they would send a wing of two corvettes and two FDL's. The FDL's could have 8 torpedo racks with reverberating cascade and the vettes some FSD interupt missiles. That would be a whole lot more fun and way more believable.
Or they just give them some weapons that are more powerfull than the ones we can have (because military grade engineering or whatever) and send two wings or whatever.
The result would be same, you have to leave the instance, even the strongest PVP Cutter cant take focussed fire from two wings for to long.


Now multiply the ATR damage by 3, and it's what it's like for a trader getting seal clubbed by basic engineered PvP ships, but with a 60m credit loss.... still ouch.

Im sorry but that analogy is just not true. Every trader has the same tools at hand as other cmdrs, if they refuse to use them because they want 2% more profit and 0.8ly more jumprange its their own decision.
Sometimes im also doing trade runs at CG's in open and not one attacker could kill my trade ship. If its a rare commodity CG's you can use every fast ship you want and just outboost them, no problem at all. And if you want to haul bigger loads then use something like a Clipper, Cutter, Any, Python whatever you just have to outfit it correct.

And if all that is no option for you and you really really want to fly shieldless then switch to a private group, there is no risk involved at all.
But sure if you fly in open without shields ar anything yeah then youre gona die very fast. Risk/reward thats how it should be or am i wrong?


Edit: Just another short example, if im coming home from a very long exploration trip in my paper thin Anaconda with around 100MJ shield (just for landings) you can be sure im switching to solo for the last 500-600Ly.
 
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Deleted member 38366

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Im sorry but that analogy is just not true. Every trader has the same tools at hand as other cmdrs, if they refuse to use them because they want 2% more profit and 0.8ly more jumprange its their own decision.
Sometimes im also doing trade runs at CG's in open and not one attacker could kill my trade ship. If its a rare commodity CG's you can use every fast ship you want and just outboost them, no problem at all. And if you want to haul bigger loads then use something like a Clipper, Cutter, Any, Python whatever you just have to outfit it correct.

And if all that is no option for you and you really really want to fly shieldless then switch to a private group, there is no risk involved at all.
But sure if you fly in open without shields ar anything yeah then youre gona die very fast. Risk/reward thats how it should be or am i wrong?

Well, if you somehow give an AspX, Type-6, Type-7 or Type-9 about 4000-6000MJ of Shields, I'd be very surprised.
Because that's what you need to survive just the 1st burst-attack of Double-Shot Frags, delivered by a Ship that's more agile than any Trader and faster than any Trader.

Thing is : typical Traders do not possess any such tools. Unless you think Trading should be reserved to Grade5-modded Cutters that carry no more than 64 tons, because the rest is filled with HRPs/MRPs/SCBs and a C6 SLF Hangar.
Hence, Traders simply die very fast. And they don't stop dying very fast until they essentially stop being Traders.
A T7 or T9 filled to the brim with HRPs/MRPs/SCBs is actually a fairly tough brick. But it just so happens not to be a Trader anymore. That's the whole issue.

You're either in a dedicated Combat Ship or not, end of story. Otherwise good luck tanking >1000DPS in a Trade Ship getting Fragged or Rammed - or most likely any Combination thereof.
All of this stopped working the Day RNGineers were released. It used to be different, though. Much, much different. Too bad these days are gone.
 
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Oh come on stop exaggerating [haha] Are you on Xbox? If so im offering you gladly a little test; im taking my AspX trader with 350MJ shield and you can take any ship you want and try to kill me with it! Give me a system and a time and i be there!
 
Never played EVE, how gets that CONCORD system triggered? Is it also some kind of security system?

CONCORD and our ATR are similar in that they are both a branch of space police.

But the similarities stop there. From the video OP provided ATR can actually be escaped from. In Eve, once CONCORD catches you, it's GG. They work in groups of three, two small ships using EWar to render the offender in question helpless, and one big ship that rocks up 15 seconds late will instakill the Offender, providied the EWar Crusiers didn't do it already.

There are no jurisdictions in Eve. How quickly CONCORD comes to vaporize you is wholly dependent on system security. In High Security space, they drop in inside like 5 seconds. If they were on grid in the system anywhere, their reaction time is shortened. On top of that, if there is more than one offender, multiple CONCORD squads will drop in based on the number of offenders. Everyone gets their own personal death sentence.
 
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Ok thanks. Does EVE not have some kind of pvp flag/servers whatever? Can you really compare the two jurisdiction in EVE and Elite, is it fair to compare? I really dont know much about EVE, i never liked the top down view.
 
Ok thanks. Does EVE not have some kind of pvp flag/servers whatever? Can you really compare the two jurisdiction in EVE and Elite, is it fair to compare? I really dont know much about EVE, i never liked the top down view.

Eve is all on one Server. Everyone who plays Eve all play on their single server. There's no PvP Flagging. There is only system security which is represented by a number between -1.0 and 1.0. From 0.4 and down, systems are basically lawless. CONCORD isn't present in those systems, so any PvP goes unpunished.
 
Is ATR possibly an extremely blunt way to stop ganking? Probably.

But would I prefer no safety measure at all? Hell no.

Look, I get that game devs seem to use a hammer for every job, making every problem look like a nail, but sometimes it's just nice they tried, ok.
 
Look, I get that game devs seem to use a hammer for every job, making every problem look like a nail, but sometimes it's just nice they tried, ok.

I think being strictly accurate they wait several years after the problem could have been fixed with a screwdriver and a turn of about 2mm, then (finally) reach for the hammer...
 
military ships ALWAYS have things civilian ships dont. fact of real life. i see no civil or police helicopters out there with thermal suppression and guns and hellfire missliles - but apache mil spec does. we are NOT military. we are at best mercs with a rank of convenience. the feds and imps navies will ALWAYS have weapons and even ships that just are not available for us to buy - purely for a civil obedience standpoint. no nation state real life or in a logical game, is going to allow the chance for civilians to have weapons that might be able to succeed in a revolt. in america, even, they let civilians 'bear arms' according to the constitution - but they arent allowed to own armed military vehicles. no us citizen has the latest american main battle tank and depleted uranium ammunition for the main gun.

you are suggesting that we SHOULD have those things. never gonna happen. whats happened in the game universe is, the griefing behaviour has led the law enforcement forces to request military assistance. instead of cops, when they cant handle you, you get the navy. you wont win a fight with them because they will always have superior weapons and ships.

Actually, civilians in the US can own tanks and the ammunition for the main gun. It's just really expensive and full of paperwork to do if you want a functioning gun on it. A tank without a working weapon is a lot easier to own, you can buy them at auctions like cars.
 
I think being strictly accurate they wait several years after the problem could have been fixed with a screwdriver and a turn of about 2mm, then (finally) reach for the hammer...

You make then sound so angry and childish lol. I'm not even mad.

Actually, civilians in the US can own tanks and the ammunition for the main gun. It's just really expensive and full of paperwork to do if you want a functioning gun on it. A tank without a working weapon is a lot easier to own, you can buy them at auctions like cars.

If I wasn't going to try to become a US citizen before, I am now!
 
Actually, civilians in the US can own tanks and the ammunition for the main gun. It's just really expensive and full of paperwork to do if you want a functioning gun on it. A tank without a working weapon is a lot easier to own, you can buy them at auctions like cars.

Sorry if this is in poor taste, but if I were ever minded to carry out a massacre, I would totally do it in a tank with a functioning gun.

Actually, showing off my build would probably be my main motivation.

(I'd have to ask the police to hold fire whilst I set the vid to music, and put it on reddit.)
 
Sorry if this is in poor taste, but if I were ever minded to carry out a massacre, I would totally do it in a tank with a functioning gun.

Actually, showing off my build would probably be my main motivation.

(I'd have to ask the police to hold fire whilst I set the vid to music, and put it on reddit.)

Can I be in a defending tank?
 
Can I be in a defending tank?

Absolutely!

(Could you and your buddies/family bring several of those really little ones with the like really short, narrow main guns? If you could also move kinda from right to left across the front of my tank with its ginormous gun, this would help the reddit vid immensely. TY!)
 
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