It's not as black and white as you make it sound. I am saying that a more expensive ship should IN PART make combat easier against a cheaper ship, nowhere did I say something like "Fly in a straight line and your ship does the work for you". Tell me what the point of trading is for a better ship, if the ship isn't actually better?
Fer de lance and expected python nerf
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It's not as black and white as you make it sound. I am saying that a more expensive ship should IN PART make combat easier against a cheaper ship, nowhere did I say something like "Fly in a straight line and your ship does the work for you". Tell me what the point of trading is for a better ship, if the ship isn't actually better?
a lousy pilot in a viper will loose against a mediocre pilot in another viper. the same lousy pilot in a python will not loose against the same mediocre pilot still in a viper.
How can you say "the more expensive ship will not make combat easier"?
a mosquito cannot kill the eagle.....only annoy it.......also 10 mosquitos cannot kill the eagle......only scare away....
after the nerf patch, 2 mosquitos will annoy the eagle to death, as the eagle became a bumble bee in a cage
I'm not sure what "loose" to multiple opponents means, perhaps "losing"... But in all seriousness money should buy you "ownage" of opponents. You play the game, you grind the trade, you make the money, you put in the time, you deserve to have more lethality against others in weaker ships. Before anyone pipes up, this is not pay-to-win as this is in game credits I'm taking about not buying your way to the top with real money.
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It should make combat much easier, to the point where multiple Vipers are required to down a Python. If a Viper goes up against a Python the only person LOSING would be the Viper.
your opinion. mine is different.
let's agree to disagree.
btw..there is a difference of sol to sagitarius A between "deserve more lethatlity" and "owning multiple oponents.
PS thanks for the loose, losing, lose, lost correction. for us non-native english speakers. that one is a nightmare. Why a female horse in the night would have become the word for bad dreams is another of those strange english language things. my favorite though is "the deserter ate dessert in the desert". fabulously strange.
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i agree, that 2 GOOD viper pilots should be able to eat a python, IF:
- the python pilot is crap
- the python is fitted for max cargo
- the python relies to all gimbaled or automated weapons
but there should be NO WAY, 2 good viper pilots should beat a equally skilled python with combat setup!
and thats how it is NOW!
i scared away several pythons already with another viper
i got killed in my python by several vipers and ASPs in warzone
i killed 2 bad fitted cobra easily
i had NO chance against a combat python in 1vs1
against a combat python only another combat python + a viper as support should be really viable. or MANY vipers......
- the python pilot is crap
- the python is fitted for max cargo
- the python relies to all gimbaled or automated weapons
but there should be NO WAY, 2 good viper pilots should beat a equally skilled python with combat setup!
and thats how it is NOW!
i scared away several pythons already with another viper
i got killed in my python by several vipers and ASPs in warzone
i killed 2 bad fitted cobra easily
i had NO chance against a combat python in 1vs1
against a combat python only another combat python + a viper as support should be really viable. or MANY vipers......
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It does: you have a way better ship. A Python smokes a viper any day of the week if the pilot is even remotely decent. But as I said earlier, most Python pilots are former traders who never flown without FA, aren't used to keeping an eye on the radar at all times, have very limited situational awareness, do not use the power distribution system properly and so on. Very understandable as trading is the only way to get a Python for those with a real world job and responsibilities. By the way, thanks for making explicit what has been lurking in the shadows for a bit, namely the idea that throwing money at the game should in part compensate for lack of skill. I understand the notion but do not agree. For example, a F-35 (despite it flaws) is miles beyond a MiG-21. But if you put a 747 pilot in the F-35 and any random army pilot in the MiG the F-35 will be destroyed every single time without fail. No matter how much more expensive it is. There is only so much better gear can compensate for.
Now I am not suggesting you need to train for years to fly a Python.
But you do need to know the basics of combat in ED, and FA, power management and situational awareness are really essential tools and skills no matter what you are flying in a combat zone. They are also not difficult to learn. Just buy a throw-away Viper and head to a nav beacon, or do the combat tutorials for a few hours. The number of times I've seen cmdrs in a Python just lazily turning around chasing a sidewinder at a nav beacon is just silly. I know some pros fly exclusively with FA off, but that is not the skill level you need. But you do need, at the very least, to understand how you can use FA-off while turning. And you should only have pips in weapons when you are actually pulling the trigger, you are crippling your flight performance without any reason otherwise. Let me put it like this: if you currently do not properly fly your Python you will more then compensate for the nerf with some practice.And for what it is worth: ofcourse not all python pilots are crap. In fact the only cmdr who managed to kill me was in a python. I messed up, he did not and the fight was as brief as it was one-sided.
Totally agree. Look at it on pure numbers. The Python costs 40x more than each Viper. It should be at least 15-20 times more lethal than it when kitted out correctly as you mention.
I note you say " it's now an appropriate level " does that mean it's already been nerfed?
There is literally nothing in that quote about infallibility or unconditional belief.
No, I have appropriate faith in actual experts, that's all. It's more than many here, unfortunately, but I've no idea how you've taken "consider the possibility that things might be more complex than you realise" and landed at "Experts are always right".
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They can't. Watch the SuBSynk video here: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=102717&page=36&p=1601158&viewfull=1#post1601158
Pack of pilots, mixed Cobras and Vipers of which the video one has a Beam laser could not crack him.
its only 4 times more lethal.....
i take out an elite conda in 1,5-2 minutes in my viper with two E1 beams + two B2 rails
i take out an elite conda in my python with 3 beams + 2 rails in 30 seconds.......so its only 3-4 times more lethal.....while costing 40-times more
bad cost efficiency
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AGAIN!!!! THAT IS NOT THE PYTHONS FAULT!
its only the shield cells! without them, even the 2 small beams would have cut through after 30 seconds of fire!
i can only shake head about all this stubborness
after the double nerf, the python will be useless for its pricetag! expect millions of repair bills after every fight......
i take out an elite conda in 1,5-2 minutes in my viper with two E1 beams + two B2 rails
i take out an elite conda in my python with 3 beams + 2 rails in 30 seconds.......so its only 3-4 times more lethal.....while costing 40-times more
bad cost efficiency
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AGAIN!!!! THAT IS NOT THE PYTHONS FAULT!
its only the shield cells! without them, even the 2 small beams would have cut through after 30 seconds of fire!
i can only shake head about all this stubborness
after the double nerf, the python will be useless for its pricetag! expect millions of repair bills after every fight......
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so a medicre pilot in a warpython should beat two good viper pilots.
that's the very definition of "money buys owning multiple oponents".
Not interested in such a game and glad FD doesn't seem to make such a one.
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welcome to games (and the real world really). where the next 10 percent often cost 90%...
tons of money gets you an edge. shouldn't get you Iwin.
It's perhaps worth bearing in mind that there at least two more combat-focussed ships on the way (the Ferdelance and the Vulture), both of which look certain to be more expensive than the Viper.
I have a question, when making these adjustments why not make multiple smaller changes until you get it dialed in correctly? Too many times I always see developers do the same thing when making adjustments to things that are considered over powered they almost always swing to far the other way. I would think that any change over 10% would be a large change? For way of comparison how much of a change do we see as the difference between class A and class E equipment?
can't watch vids at work. so I have to ask the stupid questions.
them oponents don't use shield cells?
and as I already said before. running costs of expensive ships are supposed to get a pass too!
Errr.... no you don't. Who ever put that notion into your mind? If you get the big ship but still suck as a pilot, your fault.
Actually, if you had just quoted one more line of his, you'd see that he thinks that a pilot in a python should beat two equally skilled viper pilots.
All large things in the world have bad cost efficiency. And what would you even want? If you really want it to be 40 times as efficient you are looking at killing elite condas in 3 seconds. How does that make sense? It is this simple: destroying stuff is easy. I can seriously damage your car with a $5 club. You can shoot a tank costing tens of millions with basic explosives or RPGs. A shoulder-mounted SAM can wipe out an Apache. Even the most terrorist on a budget can do insane damage to property and lives.
If I were a trader I'd count my blessings knowing that my ship is 4x more lethal than the only dedicated fighter in the game. It is an awesome trade ship: you just know you can get any route done no matter what people intend to do to you. You can't say the same of a T7. You know all this talk about poor traders being harmed by 'griefers'. Guess how many of them were flying Pythons. Guess how much they lost in T6/T7 insurance and cargo? But no, if you mean that you invested all that money to bounty hunt and it hardly pays of: you are correct. That is probably why very few armies use oil tankers to blockade shipping lanes, and it may be why Pizza Hut does not deliver your Quatro Formaggi in a tank.
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A Python has less than 6 times the hull mass of a Viper and much more of the hull is spent on having cargo bays in comparison.
It still has extreme firepower compared to lesser ships. Being expensive shouldn't make it indestructible.
The Python is not a capital ship, its an ad-hoc cruiser. If you let several torpedo boats into knife fighting range of your cruiser you should be endangered.
It still has extreme firepower compared to lesser ships. Being expensive shouldn't make it indestructible.
The Python is not a capital ship, its an ad-hoc cruiser. If you let several torpedo boats into knife fighting range of your cruiser you should be endangered.
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