Fleet Carrier Feedback and Issues (Odyssey Edition)

[Delta_Vee]

Hey folks,

I just wanted to sit down and give some thoughts, feedback and criticism on the current state of Fleet Carriers in Elite: Dangerous Odyssey.

I run a squadron by the name of Whitetip Operation, we're about 200+ members strong in-game, have several star systems under our control and are always active, but after having a meeting with other faction members in the area, we've decided to decommission our Fleet Carriers.

Why?

Because they offer almost nothing to squadrons outside of being a 'lite station'. The only times we've used it properly in the last few months is to provide large pads to folks when operating in systems that only have outposts.

The upkeep costs, wear and tear costs, upfront purchasing fees and upgrading of the carrier feels like nothing more than a money sink that saps away at my credit balance over time whilst providing no real gameplay to my squadron or myself.

I had a rant on Twitter about them which you can find here:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1402390623274012673

Source: https://twitter.com/FrameshiftShark/status/1402390623274012673


But I would like to list off some suggestions below:

- Allow for Fleet Carriers to be more deeply integrated into Squadrons. As it stands right now, we have four or five carriers for our Squadron but only the owners can contribute to their running costs. It would be nice for the carrier's credit bank to be accessible by all squadron members so they can deposit funds at their leisure to help contribute. They WON'T be able to withdraw funds, only deposit. I understand Frontier doesn't want players just giving eachother money but this small change improves Carrier operations and gives Squadron members something bigger to contribute towards. Currently the only way to get around this is to have Squadron members ship goods like Low Temp Diamonds and Painite to a carrier so the owner can sell them.

- Add a Squadron Carrier Roster: A menu on the Squadron page that shows all active carriers a Squadron owns with their current location and a way for squadron members to add their carrier to this list. It could provide basic information on if it's jumping and have buttons to 'View in Galaxy Map'.

- Allow for carriers to plot multi-jump routes like a normal ship can. This makes it so that you can plot a route (within Tritium fuel consumption reason) to somewhere and the carrier will do the rest. This makes carriers like the DSSA ones and the Colonia taxis capable of moving large distances without their owners having to be online for several hours or even days to get their carrier somewhere.

- Add the option to purchase or have an Odyssey social space by default. It kinda sucks that I pay so much and I can't get out of my ship whilst in my carrier and walk around with my friends. I understand the logistics with "where would it be located, how do we handle it during jumps?" but it feels like it should have been something that came when Odyssey launches.

- More customisation! We got a few paints here and there after the first few weeks carriers were added but the store has been dead for them for a good while. Let us mix and match fins, cargo containers and other stuff from each variant for some deeper customisation and uniqueness.

For me, my biggest gripe is that it's obvious from looking at them that these giant ships are meant to be perfect for squadron's to use and could add so much more if they were just more deeply integrated into the clan mechanic so that folks other than the owner can help keep the lights on. As it stands right now, if you want to maintain upkeep yourself, you pretty much have to go mining or do combat. Exploration DOES NOT pay enough to run a carrier in the long run and squadrons can't make use of them.

Feel free to leave your own feedback and comments below.

CMDR SapphireShark
Whitetip Operations Lead

 

[Vergial]

Completely agreed on every point. I had wanted one when they were first announced, but upon seeing what they provide (that is to say, what they provide in GAMEPLAY value) I decided strongly against it. They're too expensive, they offer nothing of real value, they rely too much on a single person to cover the cost (for what was meant to be a group thing in the first place? C'mon now), and they don't really do anything I can't just fly to another system to have done.

It actually annoys me seeing Fleet Carriers in a system since they just create visual noise in the system overview. I'm trying to find a station/outpost, not a carrier with sub-par services.

I genuinely love this game, but every 'big feature' so far has felt so...shallow. Odyssey especially, but that's another topic that also describes how I felt about Fleet Carriers. There's a thing, yes, but there's no real substance to it.

I don't want to be rude, but I often wonder if they have actual people who play games making decisions or if they just...do things.

 

[Traxx]

I agree with your points!
I really hope FCs will get the attention from FDev they deserve. It has so much potential (like many things in elite) but they're very limited in use.
And yeah, more customization would be great. I've seen almost every livery and layout configuration now even though I don't travel around a lot nowadays.
Social spaces on 'em would be amazing! Being able to choose different kinds of layouts or if not layouts, interior color schemes for them.

I honestly always thought that they had more functionality, so this was also a bit of an eye opener for me..
I guess I'll just invest my 4.7 billion credits into some other projects I'd like to make a reality.

I hope that they'll change them for the better in the future, but FDev only seems to care if we make a lot of noise about it. I'll remain hopeful though.
I also hope that my engineered ships don't get messed up if they get transported to a station after decommissioning.

 

[Sensei Jacksama]

i argued against upkeep in the beginning and the community decided they wanted this useless mechanic because "Muh IMMMERSION". we got our 3 updates and thats it. there wont be anymore FC changes for years if ever. Sorry to be negative but thats how fdev work. they release a half broken feature and never touch it again.

 

[Maolagin]

Generally agree with these suggestions - FCs basically are the extent of "base building" that we're going to get in the foreseeable future, and I think there's a lot of scope to make them both more fun and more useful to their owners.

That said, if carrier upkeep is really what's bugging you, you need to take that up with your squadron. I can say, from the perspective of being in the discords of a couple of large player groups, that money flows like water. 15-20M a week is nothing when a squadmate can share a 50M wing mission with you that requires no effort on your part except to log in and collect. Or they can dump exploration data at your carrier, of which I believe 12.5% goes directly to the carrier balance. Or a dozen other things.

Now it may be the case that your squad is in the position of having more players owning carriers than it can use. That's fine. If anything, adding more squad-centric features would probably mean that the typical group would need fewer of them, not more, because socialization would tend to focus on a few hubs.

 

[Ameeleean]

- Allow for carriers to plot multi-jump routes like a normal ship can. This makes it so that you can plot a route (within Tritium fuel consumption reason) to somewhere and the carrier will do the rest. This makes carriers like the DSSA ones and the Colonia taxis capable of moving large distances without their owners having to be online for several hours or even days to get their carrier somewhere.

FC has navigator... which is unable to plot a course. Looks like (s)he passed exam by bribing someone to get "passed" grade and now is unable to do more than press "jump" button

I'm missing a lot of features that FC owner should have like:
1. Course plotting.
2. Personal NPC fleet management- even one NPC pilot doing loops between FC and ONE chosen station using one of ships I own would do the trick. This way I could focus on looking for trade opportunities rather than manual ship piloting since on such short distances engaging supercruise assist is pointless - the only thing that helps (a bit) is autodocking. Similar thing would be nice in exploration - jump in system, order NPC pilot to use Your exploration ship (cheap hauler for example) to do FSS and map all planets and moons.
3. Ability to refine hydrogen to tritium using special FC only module- with ship purchased by player, outfitted by player (fuel scoop + fuel tanks) but managed by FC crew.
4. Ability to install special FC modules that would turn that deluxe personal garage into something else - there are lots of possibilities here, like orbital station with space elevator capable of deploying planetary outpost (remote mining, outpost creation, colonization, military base for squadrons) or to connect it to existing planetary base/colony working as a proxy for their services (meaning outpost without L landing pads would get access to it).
5. FC only missions: transport squadron of pilots, colonists in stasis pods, station parts, commodities for new colonies, support for PowerPlay, research missions (taking researchers to destination, then staying there until their job is done and after that going back).

 

[Shir]

All valid suggestions. Maybe years from now some of them will be materialized..

I would like an option to temporarily retire your carrier, thus stopping upkeep. Also, having a Tritium depot in the Colonia region would be great, a place that has enough supply to restock carriers with tritium like these in the bubble..

 

[GraphicEqualizer]

Biggest issue for me is that they are overkill (and over expensive) for most player's purposes. They were originally envisaged as a squad thing, and makes more sense there, but for most solo players or small groups they are not necessary (but all we have to choose from). All I want is the ability to take along 3 or 4 small to medium ships for gameplay variety (e.g. a miner, a pew pewer, a zippy canyon runner, and a long range scout) and explore far from the bubble without the upkeep making them implausible as a mode of long travel.
I don't need tens of thousands of storage space (other than for the tritium needs currently), I don't need them to clutter the system map, I don't need large pads.
I reckon most players would ditch their humungous white elephants for something that gives them exploration flexibilty.
Exploration carrier variant.

 

[Erei]

- Allow for carriers to plot multi-jump routes like a normal ship can. This makes it so that you can plot a route (within Tritium fuel consumption reason) to somewhere and the carrier will do the rest. This makes carriers like the DSSA ones and the Colonia taxis capable of moving large distances without their owners having to be online for several hours or even days to get their carrier somewhere.

Wait, you can't do that ? Sweet Brebus ! That's insane ! You need ~6HOURS to get to Rakham's peak for the booze cruise from the bubble, and you need to plot every step manually ? That's ridiculous. Remember that the peak can't be accessed another way.
2 more hours and I have a full work day in any civilized country around. And it's intended.

And then you have colonia, how many hours for that ? Holy Brebus, that's insane. Just completely insane.

- Add the option to purchase or have an Odyssey social space by default. It kinda sucks that I pay so much and I can't get out of my ship whilst in my carrier and walk around with my friends. I understand the logistics with "where would it be located, how do we handle it during jumps?" but it feels like it should have been something that came when Odyssey launches.

Free for Odyssey owner. No if, no what. At least one for free, and the other being only cosmetically different, if you want to. I paid for the DLC. I paid for the feature already. If the whole walking during jump is an issue, just disable access to the concourse during jump, timer don't stop until everyone's seated (if you are offline you are sent to ship) and voila.

 

[Teh Smoo]

Free for Odyssey owner. No if, no what. At least one for free, and the other being only cosmetically different, if you want to. I paid for the DLC. I paid for the feature already. If the whole walking during jump is an issue, just disable access to the concourse during jump, timer don't stop until everyone's seated (if you are offline you are sent to ship) and voila.

No comment on jump plotting. But the concourse? BILLIONS of credits and paying REAL MONEY for the DLC? PUT IN A DAMN CARRIER CONOURSE!

Seriously. If you can't or don't want to render jump from inside, put a blast shield over the windows and stop rendering it? I suspect that's the problem- your ship has a loading screen where it switches skyboxes, and there's obviously no reason for legacy station tech to switch skyboxes.

 

[Erei]

Seriously. If you can't or don't want to render jump from inside, put a blast shield over the windows and stop rendering it? I suspect that's the problem- your ship has a loading screen where it switches skyboxes, and there's obviously no reason for legacy station tech to switch skyboxes.

It's more complicated. If you would stay in the concourse during a warp, you'll probably ends up floating where the FC was, in space, and not follow it in warp. Which would be a problem. That's fixable though.

I also wonder if that's not the reason why we don't have FC "bridge" already. Stations concourse are always there. You can pull a database and put them all inside. No problem. FC ? Not so much.

 

[Teh Smoo]

It's more complicated. If you would stay in the concourse during a warp, you'll probably ends up floating where the FC was, in space, and not follow it in warp. Which would be a problem. That's fixable though.

I also wonder if that's not the reason why we don't have FC "bridge" already. Stations concourse are always there. You can pull a database and put them all inside. No problem. FC ? Not so much.

Hm. I haven't actually ridden a FC through warp.

All it really needs to do is update the skybox and change the chat channel, whether the engine can MANAGE that without reloading the instance, though, I have no data on. It just needs to move you into a new system when you enter low or high wake from the carrier instance.

Realistically? I think it's fairly likely they went for "good enough" rather than a robust design. Judging by EVERYTHING ELSE THEY HAVE EVER DONE.

 

[Dragsham]

Agree with Op.
Fc need to change.

 

[T1-Jafo]

All good points; however, Fleet Carriers are a must for any squadron who has a player minor faction and works the BGS.

 

[Delta_Vee]

That said, if carrier upkeep is really what's bugging you, you need to take that up with your squadron. I can say, from the perspective of being in the discords of a couple of large player groups, that money flows like water. 15-20M a week is nothing when a squadmate can share a 50M wing mission with you that requires no effort on your part except to log in and collect. Or they can dump exploration data at your carrier, of which I believe 12.5% goes directly to the carrier balance. Or a dozen other things.

The thing with this is that it would just be so much better for squadron members to DIRECTLY contribute to a carrier's upkeep costs. Yeah I get that you can share a wing mission without any effort from the Carrier Owner or have folks sell exploration data, but it would just be so much better if squadron members could dock at a carrier, press a 'Contribute To Upkeep' button and input money with a screen to say say "Are you sure you want to transfer (insert selected amount here)? This is a non-refundable transaction."

That'd completely cut out the need to take the mission in the first place, that player can make that 50mil from the mission and donated 10? 20? 30mil? Or however much they like. That exploration player can cash in their data but also have the option to chip in whatever amount they like too. It just gives so much freedom to squadrons having a donation button and removes any unnecessary gameplay workaround that we currently have to use.

 

[Vallysa]

Chiming in with general agreement, and specific emphasis on social spaces being a necessity. These things are pinnacle achievements, you really should be able to run around your carrier and meet up with your friends. Also, they should be places were buddies can hop on each other's ships to play.

 

[rada660]

Agree on all point, while I could add some more.

It makes no sense for the FC owner to be fined by the carrier for shooting within its "no fire zone".

And the carrier should use its guns to defend you if you are under attack near it. Or attack any hostile in that matter that gets near it to begin with.

 

[CMDR Astraea Astralis]

Couldn't agree more, now I don't have an FC myself (yet) but from what I've seen there's so much untapped potential, and will likely remain as such unless something changes moving forward. +1 from me.

 

[Delta_Vee]

Just wanted to add as well, onto the 'Odyssey Social Space' aspect, having a social space would also allow for the use of Frontline Solutions and Apex Interstellar in systems where it's not available.

A local system to us, Bakawa, has ONLY outposts and outposts only have access to Apex Interstellar. When the system goes to war, there's no way for players to fight using Frontline as the service doesn't exist for Outposts and the system doesn't have any planetary ports.

In this situation, having an Odyssey social space on the carrier allows for players to use shuttle/dropship services in systems where it's not possible to do so.

 

[Dragsham]

+1 to above post