I play Open yet do not engage in PvP generally. And if I do, its for in-game reasons (CG for example). It rarely happens, and when it happens its never against vastly outclassed ships. Yet I dont want this to be PvE-only. I want other people to be able to attack me. It means I have to be more alert, there is more danger and being attentive is rewarded. You want to take that away from me.
Frontier. Please make a PVE mode to this game.
- Thread starter CMDR Generic EventHandler
- Start date
I play Open yet do not engage in PvP generally. And if I do, its for in-game reasons (CG for example). It rarely happens, and when it happens its never against vastly outclassed ships. Yet I dont want this to be PvE-only. I want other people to be able to attack me. It means I have to be more alert, there is more danger and being attentive is rewarded. You want to take that away from me.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
.... then, presumably, you'd play in Open rather than Open-PvE mode then?
Not really. Nothing will change for you, and in fact you'll be a valuable contribution to Open.
Because PvPers also want players like you in their mode. The ones who enjoy the thrill of the chase. The ones who won't sulk when they get pirated but take it in stride with their experience. With the option of Open PvE, the blame of any unwanted PvP is removed from the attacker, and put into the victim's shoes since there will be a viable alternative. While at the moment, if you want an Open mode but don't want PvP you need to rely on the goodwill of those who do.
There are also pirate NPC's that inflict non-consensual damage to your ships.
I propose a no-resistance mode where nothing can harm you.
I do not understand why Frontier is doing so little against griefing and ganking. People and opinions differ, but Frontier might be actually losing real money here.
Why do non-PvP people play open or join groups like Mobius? I think it is fair to assume that really a lot of people actively seek non-violent social interaction. The popularity of groups like Mobius is proof of that as is the huge success of social media like Facebook etc.
By letting the gankers run rampant Frontier might be chasing away potential customers that never got a recommendation from a friend who tried out Elite and got wrecked at a CG in open. Similar, Frontier could probably sell more paint shops, because - let us be honest - people like to show off to others, but "showing off" hardly works in solo mode ;-)
I would make this something high priority to the point of adding stop gap measures like a PvE-only flag. Such a flag has issues - no doubt - but would they be worse than what is in place now?
Maybe Elite sells well enough, but - again - Frontier might be losing money here.
Why do non-PvP people play open or join groups like Mobius? I think it is fair to assume that really a lot of people actively seek non-violent social interaction. The popularity of groups like Mobius is proof of that as is the huge success of social media like Facebook etc.
By letting the gankers run rampant Frontier might be chasing away potential customers that never got a recommendation from a friend who tried out Elite and got wrecked at a CG in open. Similar, Frontier could probably sell more paint shops, because - let us be honest - people like to show off to others, but "showing off" hardly works in solo mode ;-)
I would make this something high priority to the point of adding stop gap measures like a PvE-only flag. Such a flag has issues - no doubt - but would they be worse than what is in place now?
Maybe Elite sells well enough, but - again - Frontier might be losing money here.
The difference between an NPC and a player is: the NPC is stupid by design...
verminstar
Banned
Do they attack in wings?
From time to time, yes. They are even instructed by FD to kill you. They ARE out to get you and your credits.
Here is a thread for you https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...-design-goal-with-random-NPC-gankers-Frontier
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Shut the front door!
Is that like a forum where sentiments which aren't yours get erased upon reading and replaced by a sentiment you can deal with? So no alien thoughts and ideas can harm one's preconceived notions.
I agree, that would be splendid
verminstar
Banned
Wouldnt be much point to them if they didnt fight back sometimes...why are ye trying to tell me something I already know? Too much eggnog and quality street maybe?
Ah we get to the true heart of the matter. Many pvpers want people to play open so they have content, in fact many would like more negative incentives made to being in solo or group to "force" others into their choice mode of open pvp .
This first quote is a prime example of what I mean when I say pvpers know they're a minority and will remain so and try to blame pvers.
Here's a sad fact, why should Fdev cater to such a small group if they can't sustain themselves, perhaps THEY should go to a private group as it seems they are the ones that ideally fit in there, I mean since they are so few.
The second quote just goes to confirm what is being done now isn't working or is working backwards.
I have played many many mmo that had both pvp AND pve servers, even ones where you could switch at will and those are the ones that worked best as you could switch from one to the other at will depending on your mood.
That's what we need now and some will say well that's what we have but it isn't really because mobuis just isn't working due to size limitations while the pvp claim, "it will be lonely"...
In a case like this Fdev should consider the needs of the many over the needs of the few.
It's that simple.
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You're right it's a sandbox that should stop ostracizing people that want to pve and putting them in a small "prison space" but I digress...
I said that because it's pretty clear in almost every pvp thread you guys blame pvers for the lack of "decent pvp" or "pvp mechanics", you guys are the one's trying to ostracize a certain group and then have the gall to try and claim we are doing that.
As I have said before and will repeat...we have no need to do that to you pvpers thus my strawman comment.
Asinine indeed, glad you can see it!
Do you realize everyone, even the players taking part in PvP, also takes part in PvE? How could those 'you pvpers' guys be blaming 'pve guys' for too much PvE, when those taking part in PvP are PvErs themselves? Sorry but you're being pretty moronic with that us-vs-them mentality over imagined slights. I guess that's what happens when you live in an echo-chamber and only listen to the same made-up scary stories about Open and those who play there.
You make all kinds of baseless claims about 'PVPers' but you are the one asking Frontier to exclude players from a mode that is already for all intents and purposes a PvE mode.
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Oh no the childish broad brush is back... Well, more amusement for me.
So sad indeed that they decided to focus on PvP balancing recently and hasn't implemented a pure PvE mode despite having vocal demands for it since pretty much day one.
So sad .-.
How many of these mmos are sandboxes?
Oh god the broad brush, trying to paint the sun black over there?
Right, ever considered the concept that one minority's disappearance leads to another's appearance? Use reason for a second and think of the aftermath if you continuously apply that concept.
So you're one of the folk Ashesofhegemony represents?
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/317689-Why-we-hate-you-this-christmas
Hogwash, you and few others in these pvp threads keep spouting the same thing and then accuse others of doing what you all routinely do while trying to provide some strawmans and red herrings to deflect away from yourselves or the main issues.
What's even funnier is most of the time you guys can't help but devolve into personal attacks or silly claims that we need to "git gud" or we are somehow "traumatized over imagined slights" "childish", paraphrasing here but it always comes down to the same garbage.
Maybe if you guys stuck to attacking the problem and arguments instead of the people posting you might get more traction alas seems you guy need to pvp even in the forums.
Oh and just for the record while I toyed in mobuis a little before going on a break from the game I played mostly in open and I didn't ever combat log.
Space Dandy isn't afraid of dying or killing the so called expert pvpers, I'm just not always in the mood for such.
I can even que in 1.2.3. the same few who will quote me with rubbish replies..lol
Edit: I was mistaken the responses were even quicker than I thought they would be!
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The CMDR whose video I used to make this parody/cautionary tale video would likely disagree with you...
[video=youtube;KcsBP_Mky6Y]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcsBP_Mky6Y[/video]
Think it's fair to label the general term PvP as player attacking player. PvP via PvE is playing some background sim and doesn't directly pit someone with engineer modded pew pew sticks against someone hauling tonnage for NPCs.
Syncing with the topic:
In any case, the crux of the matter is that there's a massive percentage of the playerbase that prefers to go about their game unhindered by another player, but still play with other players, random players, and in an FDEV controlled and managed environment. Some like it solo, but generally, you remove the hindrances generated by the unpredictable chaotic nature of human free-will playing a more aggressive combative game, then more will find that some kind of open PvE environment is more interesting and gravitate towards it. Right now the PvE playerbase is fragmented. Obstacles put in place such as NPC aggressors are part of the PVE ethos, and can always be balanced by FDEV at will, and this doesn't change whichever mode you're in. Only another player would ever attack someone in the mailbox, or take advantage of a speeding loophole to ensure another player loses out via a suicide sidewinder... NPC's do not do this.
I think FDEV are in a difficult place with these types of debates. In one hand you have a player base that needs other players to be game content. Then on the other, you have players that have no intention of being someone elses content. Technically each side should be able to play they way they want, and another mode aka PvE OPEN is therefore needed. My own opinion is that group mode would no longer be needed since folks can simply group up as they do anyway.. and solo should remain to be just that. True too many modes would dilute things, so keep it simple. OPEN with PvP. OPEN PvE only, and solo. It's the most concord solution there is.
TLDR; Playing in an OPEN mode is the debate, and clearly there's a need for a PvE one. There is no OPEN mode where folks can play the game unhindered by other players.
If this isn't obvious enough of what this forum user is attempting to accomplish, I literally have no words. Instead I have meme.
But in case that 0.01% chance that you were serious...
You've been tossing "ad hominem" left and right by stereotyping with broad brush, put that brush away before pointing at other people's brushes (actually most replies to you are telling you to stop it with the broad brush which then you reply with either nonsense or passive aggression. Unfortunately unlike the others, that kind of sophistry doesn't go well with me), thank you very much.
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My point was that it's virtually impossible to play ED without engaging in some PvE at least, so Space Dandy's attempt to make it sound like PvP players are full of disdain towards PvE players is pretty misguided.
These are just two extreme ends of a much wider spectrum. The vast majority of players is going to be sitting in the middle: people who mostly play the PvE game but don't mind the occasional hostile interaction with other players as long as there is a proper system of checks and balances for them to have a limited degree of control over the threat represented by other players. That's where a proper C&P system comes into play rather than the easy cop-out of making a pure PvE mode which would drain players away from a properly balanced and designed trully Open mode.
If you have a problem with me you'll need to be more specific. I'm always open to improvement but that's all rather vague and not very helpful.
Personal attacks are against the forum's rules, if you find someone doing that report it. I do exercice a lot more restraint on that aspect than most users around here so I'm afraid you're refering to someone else than myself. As for telling others to git gud, ultimately that's really all the advice you need. But I try to help and share my knowledge of the game in a more helpful manner, most of the time. Still I fail to see what this has to do with that PvP vs PvE war you think is going on. Telling someone they need to up their game rather than whine about difficulty is something that is done by a lot of people regardless of their stance on the place of PvP in this game.
Becoming so agitated over a video game tends to have that effect on the people you're having a conversation with. It's one thing to think Frontier should focus more on PvE (somehow) and express that opinion, it's quite another to make it quite clear you'd want all PvP to be removed from the game altogether like you've been doing in this thread.
My personal agenda regarding Open is for Frontier to implement some proper C&P that would disincentivize what little ganking is going on in policed space and push it towards lower security systems, so as to help those on the fence regarding Open. From what I've seen around here that's actually a pretty popular opinion, and doesn't need that much more traction since it's something Frontier has been hinting at being on the table.
If you create an Open mode where PvP is disabled, that is ALL you will get, even when you're in the mood for it. If you create such a mode, that is where virtually everybody except a few very dedicated players will play. Not because that is what they actually want, but because that is the safest and most profitable option. Their experience will be lessened because there just isn't that tingling sense of danger whenever they meet another player, however unlikely it is that anything bad will happen. But yet that is where the ywill go, because gamers and people in general go for the path of least resistance. You know your experience would be better if there was at least that potential, but you've got that urge to make credits and play it safe. It takes a lot of effort to step outside that mentality, and you can't expect the vast majority of gamers to do it. That's why games need to be balanced and designed carefuly so as to avoid situations where there is just one explicitely superior option which would also ruin the experience.
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