Glorious HIPs - 3306

[Iron Body]

An interesting(?) thought has just occurred to me, prompted by the discussion in another thread: hip-13044-actual-coordinates.609724/.

We know that FD used a vizier catalogue to position most of the HIP stars in the ED galaxy. The missing ones (ie. not found) are almost all of those with a very small parallax values in that catalogue. Also, all the unreachable stars have quite small parallax values as well. The discussion in the other thread revealed that some parallax values in the vizier catalogue are subject to substantial errors. This was assuming that the Gaia catalogue, being more up to data had the latest, more accurate data.

I have recently looked a bit deeper into the Gaia catalogue for some other unreachable HIP stars and found that the parallax values, and therefore distances from Sol, are orders of magnitude different from what is in the game. In most cases those HIP stars should be much closer to Sol than they are in the game.

This is only a preliminary look at this question, and I intend at some point to download all the parallax values for the HIP stars from Gaia and calculate their real positions in the galmap. This is actually quite feasible, the Gaia website has an excellent query facility.

The big question is then, having these much more accurate positions for HIP stars, could FD then rerun the stellar forge for HIP stars and change all their coordinates to the more correct values ?

I know this is unlikely, but would be nice !

edit: Could do this for other catalogue stars as well, eg JMASS and HD stars, though they be be more accurate already.

 

[Maolagin]

The big question is then, having these much more accurate positions for HIP stars, could FD then rerun the stellar forge for HIP stars and change all their coordinates to the more correct values ?

The short answer, as I understand it, is "no".

Reason being, stellar forge operates by distributing the mass in a given procgen sector among the generated stars. Hand placed stars do count against the mass allocation, and in fact effectively get first dibs on that mass. Putting that together, I would infer that moving a hand placed star from one sector to another would effectively re-roll the procedural generation of all generated stars in the altered sectors. They've made a number of statements over the years that they really don't plan on doing that - they can change what's in star systems pretty freely, but consider the systems themselves not subject to change.

 

[varonica]

The short answer, as I understand it, is "no".

Reason being, stellar forge operates by distributing the mass in a given procgen sector among the generated stars. Hand placed stars do count against the mass allocation, and in fact effectively get first dibs on that mass. Putting that together, I would infer that moving a hand placed star from one sector to another would effectively re-roll the procedural generation of all generated stars in the altered sectors. They've made a number of statements over the years that they really don't plan on doing that - they can change what's in star systems pretty freely, but consider the systems themselves not subject to change.

Hmm, I tend to agree with that, it will never happen, but they could rename stars is some cases if there were some correct stars in the right locations or close enough. The problem of course being that the mass and type of star in the catalogues is based on real world values obtained through observation, so they couldn't just rename an F star to HIP that we know is a B or indeed change the mass of stars to match due to the above problems. Personally at this stage I think it will never happen, the galaxy is very much a static object apart from pretty minor adjustments that don't affect the forge itself.

 

[varonica]

Hmm that's interesting, just dropped into HD 44929 (the furthest out of my current set I am doing) and strangely the stars and planets are all tagged by CMDR Orange!, but EDSM said there had been no visitors so I am on all the entries in EDSM, sorry if I've stolen it Orange! but I can't check tags until I get there!

 

[Iron Body]

A progress report with another top commanders list.

hamstelBaster​	6873​
expugnax​	3933​
Jackie Silver​	3688​
Irisa Nyira​	1882​
Varonica​	1836​
Arnoldo​	1033​
kjnpbr​	966​
getedoi​	846​
DrewCarnegie​	763​
Pirin​	715​
Orvidius​	708​
Mikish1​	654​
iFred [SecB]​	617​
Jjgoldberg​	568​
Spock Oddsocks​	546​
Rollo Rhadium​	516​
pipski​	504​
Stulli​	500​
Mooing​	492​
Jimbo Jameson​	474​
Panicpete​	447​
HappyRogger​	441​
lorrad​	413​
Matt G​	394​
lightspeed​	392​
Molan Ryke​	351​
Orange!​	343​
endlessfalls​	340​
Ralph Vargr​	325​
Snake Man​	310​

Quite a bit of movement at the top, not much lower down.

I have now moved on to sectors 2/3 with 309 stars. Thus leaving the following systems:

sector​	HIP​	ename​	x​	y​	z​
1​	73761​	HD 133296​	493.97​	504.91​	1,042.53​
1​	76364​	HD 138782​	552.91​	228.19​	1,091.75​
1​	80174​	HD 147070​	653.25​	-10.31​	1,353.63​
1​	77865​	HD 327507​	528.91​	127.22​	1,073.56​
1​	78320​	HD 327602​	580.66​	137.59​	1,233.66​
1​	104431​	HIP 104431​	187.94​	-451.06​	476.25​
1​	76229​	HIP 76229​	410.16​	211.88​	853.91​
1​	110506​	?​	12.25​	-107.94​	72.25​
6​	32814​	35 Geminorum​	633.59​	197.66​	-1,633.34​
6​	31704​	HD 260988​	1,046.84​	48.34​	-2,258.53​
6​	21936​	HD 29914​	235.38​	-452.78​	-882.34​
6​	22601​	HD 30897​	214.16​	-401.28​	-945.00​
6​	23846​	HD 33037​	441.97​	-567.06​	-1,491.44​
6​	23967​	HD 33235​	208.22​	-296.94​	-932.47​
6​	24757​	HD 34561​	334.16​	-331.81​	-907.56​
6​	25111​	HD 35051​	143.63​	-193.69​	-1,049.13​
6​	25072​	HD 35067​	351.72​	-333.25​	-1,002.22​
6​	25128​	HD 35135​	632.75​	-567.38​	-1,523.13​
6​	25163​	HD 35177​	389.97​	-354.03​	-1,007.06​
6​	25493​	HD 35762​	353.84​	-304.13​	-986.03​
6​	25872​	HD 36411​	739.88​	-553.44​	-1,425.53​
6​	26024​	HD 36627​	405.84​	-306.31​	-1,048.06​
6​	26202​	HD 36820​	180.06​	-147.94​	-979.34​
6​	26213​	HD 36954​	446.72​	-317.13​	-960.38​
6​	27210​	HD 38453​	417.69​	-238.47​	-955.13​
6​	27744​	HD 39401​	487.66​	-245.69​	-948.56​
6​	27816​	HD 39497​	392.13​	-186.03​	-932.91​
6​	28289​	HD 40316​	226.66​	-56.53​	-1,022.44​
6​	28590​	HD 40935​	519.59​	-200.06​	-1,067.03​
6​	28747​	HD 41099​	105.25​	245.84​	-3,186.50​
6​	28668​	HD 41166​	493.00​	-196.59​	-870.19​
6​	28830​	HD 41433​	568.84​	-204.66​	-1,110.28​
6​	29043​	HD 41855​	410.72​	-124.28​	-910.66​
6​	29406​	HD 42561​	417.25​	-91.09​	-1,036.31​
6​	30009​	HD 43913​	626.06​	-118.47​	-1,294.94​
6​	30341​	HD 44638​	953.72​	-150.06​	-1,900.63​
6​	30690​	HD 45339​	669.84​	-77.13​	-1,327.97​
6​	32748​	HD 49640​	1,665.53​	249.16​	-3,398.19​
6​	32829​	HD 49827​	1,693.06​	323.44​	-3,639.16​
6​	33181​	HD 50509​	1,007.25​	644.66​	-3,508.19​
6​	36479​	HD 59268​	480.72​	1,058.88​	-2,669.94​
6​	38362​	HD 63856​	473.97​	324.56​	-822.91​
6​	39886​	HD 67319​	104.31​	873.69​	-1,432.63​
6​	48176​	HD 84949​	338.78​	888.13​	-673.31​
6​	22428​	HIP 22428​	225.81​	-381.03​	-781.78​
6​	23770​	HIP 23770​	156.69​	-252.84​	-812.44​
6​	23945​	HIP 23945​	150.63​	-241.25​	-831.88​
6​	24058​	HIP 24058​	310.50​	-325.53​	-675.22​
6​	24518​	HIP 24518​	192.22​	-230.50​	-764.81​
6​	25185​	HIP 25185​	215.56​	-213.09​	-761.41​
6​	25481​	HIP 25481​	233.09​	-212.69​	-815.53​
6​	25513​	HIP 25513​	174.09​	-178.53​	-911.94​
6​	25591​	HIP 25591​	249.13​	-209.16​	-681.38​
6​	25640​	HIP 25640​	291.00​	-245.56​	-847.66​
6​	26061​	HIP 26061​	343.16​	-248.59​	-675.59​
6​	26749​	HIP 26749​	336.47​	-213.88​	-688.41​
6​	28123​	HIP 28123​	263.28​	-102.56​	-789.44​
6​	28285​	HIP 28285​	380.09​	-168.63​	-685.09​
6​	28762​	HIP 28762​	348.22​	-116.53​	-798.81​
6​	29508​	HIP 29508​	301.03​	-48.72​	-839.97​
6​	29896​	HIP 29896​	582.28​	-80.53​	-1,453.75​
6​	31349​	HIP 31349​	334.72​	83.66​	-1,091.19​
6​	33089​	HIP 33089​	480.47​	49.25​	-838.72​
6​	37744​	HIP 37744​	70.72​	393.44​	-801.94​
6​	37967​	HIP 37967​	411.97​	314.66​	-813.94​
6​	39412​	HIP 39412​	242.44​	209.03​	-440.47​
6​	39809​	HIP 39809​	313.59​	289.63​	-573.94​
6​	41263​	HIP 41263​	10.81​	352.16​	-503.16​
6​	41821​	HIP 41821​	144.25​	436.81​	-621.13​
6​	43111​	HIP 43111​	433.69​	919.53​	-1,174.19​
6​	43990​	HIP 43990​	63.53​	515.44​	-592.44​
6​	45157​	HIP 45157​	204.44​	614.44​	-637.25​
6​	45549​	HIP 45549​	140.59​	489.72​	-488.69​
6​	46119​	HIP 46119​	207.78​	461.16​	-430.59​
6​	48232​	HIP 48232​	74.94​	431.09​	-337.84​
6​	48810​	HIP 48810​	250.41​	698.00​	-494.22​
6​	48984​	HIP 48984​	166.56​	513.53​	-359.19​
6​	49570​	HIP 49570​	180.72​	492.47​	-317.31​
6​	49842​	HIP 49842​	211.50​	596.38​	-373.16​
6​	50585​	HIP 50585​	110.19​	450.97​	-268.84​
6​	51043​	HIP 51043​	115.25​	633.13​	-367.91​
6​	51086​	HIP 51086​	212.59​	687.59​	-374.59​
6​	52382​	HIP 52382​	33.53​	584.22​	-311.53​
6​	52812​	HIP 52812​	21.16​	483.41​	-247.72​
6​	23161​	HR 1600​	123.28​	-320.81​	-1,087.44​
6​	26072​	HR 1860​	120.97​	-123.16​	-1,131.34​
6​	26098​	HR 1871​	416.81​	-306.22​	-990.06​
6​	14699​	UX Eridani​	58.44​	-513.97​	-414.63​
6​	23680​	W Orionis​	376.56​	-465.59​	-1,075.34​
7​	25512​	HD 243692​	-188.84​	-95.59​	-3,190.69​
7​	26946​	HD 246560​	-49.13​	34.91​	-1,733.88​
7​	24201​	HD 33357​	-586.13​	88.91​	-2,270.41​
7​	26364​	HD 36949​	-284.97​	133.47​	-1,881.28​
7​	32421​	HD 48563​	-115.22​	366.91​	-1,169.19​
7​	36301​	HD 58548​	-281.69​	826.97​	-1,646.38​
7​	32228​	HIP 32228​	-513.47​	857.97​	-2,410.13​
7​	33908​	HIP 33908​	-175.13​	325.19​	-757.56​
7​	33954​	HIP 33954​	-119.97​	312.31​	-780.72​
7​	34678​	HIP 34678​	-70.09​	264.19​	-637.88​
7​	35490​	HIP 35490​	-107.13​	247.34​	-512.81​
7​	37059​	HIP 37059​	-221.66​	831.97​	-1,583.03​
7​	37383​	HIP 37383​	-267.94​	952.13​	-1,753.66​
7​	37813​	HIP 37813​	-109.38​	425.63​	-761.44​
7​	38044​	HIP 38044​	-119.06​	413.19​	-717.31​
7​	38841​	HIP 38841​	-51.84​	306.78​	-515.09​
7​	39677​	HIP 39677​	-75.88​	440.34​	-689.44​
7​	39875​	HIP 39875​	-88.19​	317.31​	-477.88​
7​	42429​	HIP 42429​	-130.66​	471.34​	-589.03​
7​	43442​	HIP 43442​	-47.81​	426.72​	-505.06​
7​	46930​	HIP 46930​	-9.66​	525.16​	-474.03​
7​	46981​	HIP 46981​	-95.84​	574.66​	-524.69​
8​	38061​	HD 59664​	-2,061.75​	1,503.84​	-1,771.13​
8​	7227​	HIP 7227​	-1,683.34​	-1,980.06​	-1,755.44​
9​	115732​	HD 220844​	-5,297.13​	-1,787.25​	-1,633.91​
9​	116535​	HD 222031​	-3,557.44​	-1,492.66​	-1,153.75​
9​	2959​	HD 3455​	-2,268.53​	-2,177.09​	-1,287.44​
10​	115987​	HD 221180​	-477.78​	-1,191.72​	200.34​
10​	116004​	HD 221235​	-868.69​	-1,128.75​	6.00​
10​	109030​	HIP 109030​	-859.31​	-563.88​	240.47​
10​	113956​	HIP 113956​	-575.25​	-878.25​	184.28​
10​	67518​	HIP 67518​	-211.38​	633.69​	21.03​
11​	103477​	HD 103477​	-1,332.63​	-695.97​	865.84​
11​	101878​	HIP 101878​	-822.97​	-304.72​	518.44​
11​	107024​	HIP 107024​	-440.78​	-437.56​	326.00​
11​	77352​	HIP 77352​	-522.00​	1,138.28​	868.75​
11​	82209​	HIP 82209​	-941.13​	916.66​	627.84​
11​	88811​	HIP 88811​	-822.47​	396.00​	481.75​
12​	78739​	Gliese 9541 B​	-0.50​	44.50​	81.09​
12​	101098​	HD 195040​	-1,539.31​	-2,313.84​	3,498.53​

Many of these are leftovers from previous lists which have either been missed (mostly by me) or maybe stlil in progress.
There are 13 stars still outstanding in sector 4, but they are all named stars in the bubble which I need to check more carefully.

Given the slow progress I have made with my last group of 500 stars - 3 months - I don't see this phase of the project completing before the new year.

 

[varonica]

Still working on my list, there were a few way out beyond the rest so that's taken a bit of time but I am now working my way back in to the bubble and will get all the close ones, mind you a lot of them were permit locked so that saves a bit of running around. I am now heading to the last few outliers it will be done pretty soon after that as I head bubblewards, but I am thinking, maybe not rush due to update 14 and the Thargstars, see what happens there first!

 

[ORANGEORANGE]

An interesting(?) thought has just occurred to me, prompted by the discussion in another thread: hip-13044-actual-coordinates.609724/.

We know that FD used a vizier catalogue to position most of the HIP stars in the ED galaxy. The missing ones (ie. not found) are almost all of those with a very small parallax values in that catalogue. Also, all the unreachable stars have quite small parallax values as well. The discussion in the other thread revealed that some parallax values in the vizier catalogue are subject to substantial errors. This was assuming that the Gaia catalogue, being more up to data had the latest, more accurate data.

I have recently looked a bit deeper into the Gaia catalogue for some other unreachable HIP stars and found that the parallax values, and therefore distances from Sol, are orders of magnitude different from what is in the game. In most cases those HIP stars should be much closer to Sol than they are in the game.

This is only a preliminary look at this question, and I intend at some point to download all the parallax values for the HIP stars from Gaia and calculate their real positions in the galmap. This is actually quite feasible, the Gaia website has an excellent query facility.

The big question is then, having these much more accurate positions for HIP stars, could FD then rerun the stellar forge for HIP stars and change all their coordinates to the more correct values ?

I know this is unlikely, but would be nice !

edit: Could do this for other catalogue stars as well, eg JMASS and HD stars, though they be be more accurate already.

As the others have stated, it is likely due to how the universe is generated that moving these catalog stars would require a regeneration of every proc-gen star in the galaxy.

I discovered this a while ago and I don't remember all the details, but I believe the initial error between the original coordinate system used in the spreadsheet and the one used in the game was that the one in the game used a different version of the HIP catalog, which I happened to find on VizieR tool.

HIP catalog was decent but not perfect, but the errors are more due to how they are implemented in the game than the catalog itself. As you know, the lower the parallax, the further away the star is. 1 milliarcsecond corresponds to 1 / 0.001 = 1000 parsecs away, or about 3260 ly. The catalog generally has uncertainties of around 1 mas. That means for example if I see a relatively close star 100 parsecs away, then it should have a parallax of 10 +/- 1 mas. However, what if we look at a very distant star that is quite bright? Then if its parallax is around 1 +/- 1 mas, then the star will be 1000 parsecs as expected. We really can only optically see stars up to a range of 1000 parsecs using the HIP telescope...there are very few exceptions. As a result, if the telescope got a value like 0.07 +/- 1 mas, then the game just picks 0.07 mas and places it about 40,000 ly away, which is crazy. We know in real life that the value is probably closer to around 1, and it's just a bright star that's far away, not 40,000 ly away but maybe 3000 ly away. Also keep in mind uncertainty is just 1 sigma range, which only covers about 65% of values. About 1/3 of your data will be outside these uncertainty ranges. Of course, the game just picks the data value without uncertainty, and that is why we have crazy far away stars.

It also gets more complicated with giant stars, as their parallax can be harder to tell, as they often are variable in some way; not to mention variable stars in general, which are often hard to do parallax on. That is why many of the absurdly distant stars are often giant stars I believe. If not, they probably were some variable star that got a bad parallax measurement.

Gaia, of course, does a lot of HIP does but much better, with billions of stars. Crazy stuff, and will definitely be curious to see what you can come up with.

Hmm that's interesting, just dropped into HD 44929 (the furthest out of my current set I am doing) and strangely the stars and planets are all tagged by CMDR Orange!, but EDSM said there had been no visitors so I am on all the entries in EDSM, sorry if I've stolen it Orange! but I can't check tags until I get there!

No worries. I must have done it a while ago since I don't remember this star well. I often upload every log I ever had and if it never picked it up on EDSM it must have been a missing log or a bug. It's okay though I don't really care too much about the EDSM credit, and I hope you didn't waste too much time going out there.

 

[varonica]

No worries. I must have done it a while ago since I don't remember this star well. I often upload every log I ever had and if it never picked it up on EDSM it must have been a missing log or a bug. It's okay though I don't really care too much about the EDSM credit, and I hope you didn't waste too much time going out there.

Going places is rarely a waste of time, that's what exploration is all about!

 

[varonica]

Well this is a trifle awkward, I am essentially stranded on my own Fleet Carrier, after a docking glitch I exited my ship, and had a black screen, had to use task manager to restart my game and found myself on foot in the carrier with no accessible ship docked, so I am stuck on foot. This may be the moment I have to update my old Horizons version to see if that can force be back into a ship somehow!

 

[varonica]

So here is sector 4, when you're ready. They are sorted in sol distance order as before.

I have been trying to automate the sorting to be done by the FindShortestTour function in Mathematica, but interfacing between Perl and Mathematica is a nightmare.
I can do it manually, so if you want to specify a start and end point for the run let me know.

HIP 45588​	25 Hydrae​	425​	226​	-214​	526.78​
HIP 53207​	HIP 53207​	339​	397​	-85​	528.92​
HIP 44911​	HIP 44911​	527​	80​	-88​	540.25​
HIP 25885​	HIP 25885​	447​	-296​	-104​	546.11​
HIP 53197​	HIP 53197​	361​	412​	-85​	554.34​
HIP 18469​	HIP 18469​	373​	-430​	-91​	576.46​
HIP 45388​	HIP 45388​	559​	110​	-102​	578.78​
HIP 18374​	HIP 18374​	390​	-449​	-87​	601.06​
HIP 56127​	87 e Leonis​	353​	489​	-12​	603.22​
HIP 49682​	HIP 49682​	427​	402​	-197​	618.66​
HIP 42842​	HIP 42842​	587​	110​	-211​	633.40​
HIP 13612​	HIP 13612​	278​	-584​	-148​	663.51​
HIP 54678​	HIP 54678​	360​	550​	-92​	663.75​
HIP 53899​	HIP 53899​	349​	555​	-132​	668.77​
HIP 13310​	HIP 13310​	279​	-600​	-144​	677.18​
HIP 49587​	HIP 49587​	583​	326​	-114​	677.61​
HIP 56073​	HIP 56073​	341​	592​	-55​	685.40​
HIP 41009​	HIP 41009​	617​	96​	-292​	689.33​
HIP 49543​	HIP 49543​	618​	301​	-91​	693.40​
HIP 23487​	HIP 23487​	538​	-424​	-131​	697.41​
HIP 32701​	HIP 32701​	644​	-251​	-97​	697.96​
HIP 34674​	HIP 34674​	664​	-248​	-4​	708.81​
HIP 44486​	HIP 44486​	680​	138​	-170​	714.38​
HIP 36471​	HIP 36471​	685​	-216​	-11​	718.33​
HIP 30375​	HIP 30375​	633​	-282​	-205​	722.66​
HIP 52890​	HIP 52890​	541​	474​	-70​	722.67​
HIP 46609​	HIP 46609​	662​	242​	-171​	725.29​
HIP 51250​	HIP 51250​	425​	545​	-222​	725.90​
HIP 48059​	HIP 48059​	680​	249​	-108​	732.16​
HIP 55699​	HIP 55699​	391​	626​	-63​	740.76​
HIP 57152​	HIP 57152​	388​	647​	-2​	754.42​
HIP 50930​	HIP 50930​	530​	514​	-191​	762.61​
HIP 27866​	HIP 27866​	661​	-378​	-175​	781.30​
HIP 54213​	HIP 54213​	410​	659​	-142​	789.02​
HIP 44220​	HIP 44220​	714​	213​	-270​	792.51​
HIP 34342​	HIP 34342​	700​	-134​	-381​	808.16​
HIP 51117​	26 Sextantis​	526​	583​	-225​	816.82​
HIP 45289​	HIP 45289​	741​	278​	-275​	837.85​
HIP 42088​	C Velorum​	844​	-83​	-35​	848.79​
HIP 48672​	HIP 48672​	723​	407​	-196​	852.52​
HIP 28603​	HIP 28603​	732​	-394​	-200​	855.02​
HIP 46184​	HIP 46184​	694​	387​	-328​	859.64​
HIP 39666​	HIP 39666​	801​	20​	-319​	862.42​
HIP 56493​	HIP 56493​	499​	723​	-8​	878.52​
HIP 48784​	HIP 48784​	677​	496​	-266​	880.40​
HIP 18139​	HIP 18139​	541​	-673​	-184​	882.87​
HIP 44506​	HIP 44506​	770​	284​	-332​	885.31​
HIP 26232​	HIP 26232​	681​	-446​	-354​	887.69​
HIP 33023​	HIP 33023​	802​	-256​	-282​	887.84​
HIP 30626​	HIP 30626​	774​	-330​	-285​	888.37​
HIP 45288​	HIP 45288​	839​	219​	-213​	892.89​
HIP 52060​	HIP 52060​	475​	711​	-264​	894.90​
HIP 44538​	HIP 44538​	884​	156​	-193​	918.17​
HIP 51768​	HIP 51768​	790​	470​	-49​	920.54​
HIP 28888​	HIP 28888​	797​	-409​	-292​	942.21​
HIP 52205​	HIP 52205​	570​	723​	-234​	949.94​
HIP 45298​	HIP 45298​	930​	142​	-132​	949.99​
HIP 48516​	HIP 48516​	854​	393​	-173​	955.87​
HIP 47596​	HIP 47596​	806​	440​	-276​	958.86​
HIP 10166​	HIP 10166​	371​	-913​	-62​	987.45​
HIP 27669​	HIP 27669​	822​	-475​	-282​	990.37​
HIP 21073​	HIP 21073​	678​	-675​	-256​	990.38​
HIP 46738​	HIP 46738​	959​	226​	-126​	993.29​
HIP 16415​	HD 22037​	568​	-817​	-199​	1,014.75​
HIP 26586​	HIP 26586​	823​	-521​	-297​	1,018.32​
HIP 51409​	HD 90969​	674​	731​	-260​	1,027.73​
HIP 45060​	HD 79134​	1047​	33​	-32​	1,048.01​
HIP 49852​	HD 88318​	896​	528​	-177​	1,054.95​
HIP 17699​	HD 24022​	686​	-813​	-130​	1,071.66​
HIP 29486​	HIP 29486​	946​	-473​	-233​	1,083.02​
HIP 39970​	HD 68324​	1088​	-150​	-122​	1,105.05​
HIP 52343​	HD 92675​	791​	757​	-176​	1,108.92​
HIP 49439​	HD 87584​	895​	606​	-262​	1,112.16​
HIP 23465​	HD 32823​	884​	-674​	-97​	1,115.86​
HIP 39953​	Gamma Velorum​	1099​	-146​	-133​	1,116.60​
HIP 37819​	c Puppis​	1074​	-128​	-335​	1,132.29​
HIP 30882​	HD 46332​	1029​	-499​	-15​	1,143.71​
HIP 50094​	HD 88752​	1048​	452​	-74​	1,143.71​
HIP 34398​	HD 54843​	1078​	-343​	-196​	1,148.11​
HIP 49293​	HR 3959​	883​	671​	-324​	1,155.38​
HIP 41206​	HD 71074​	1066​	139​	-447​	1,164.25​
HIP 46142​	HD 81449​	1153​	198​	-123​	1,176.33​
HIP 34578​	HD 54978​	1080​	-225​	-500​	1,211.21​
HIP 23690​	HD 33041​	898​	-725​	-385​	1,216.66​
HIP 33456​	HD 52026​	1138​	-385​	-265​	1,230.24​
HIP 29903​	HD 44206​	1111​	-545​	-202​	1,253.85​
HIP 49337​	HD 87394​	1118​	557​	-189​	1,263.29​
HIP 43325​	h Velorum​	1249​	53​	-182​	1,263.30​
HIP 32502​	HD 49558​	1149​	-397​	-396​	1,278.52​
HIP 38071​	HD 63603​	1227​	-152​	-344​	1,283.34​
HIP 46167​	HD 81376​	1045​	606​	-517​	1,313.98​
HIP 41625​	HD 72200​	1306​	-190​	-4​	1,319.75​
HIP 46569​	HR 3767​	1215​	461​	-332​	1,341.26​
HIP 40746​	HD 70194​	1314​	-58​	-264​	1,341.51​
HIP 22340​	HD 30849​	999​	-858​	-256​	1,341.53​
HIP 26685​	HD 38041​	1114​	-698​	-268​	1,341.65​
HIP 29778​	HD 43718​	1102​	-488​	-601​	1,346.75​
HIP 44841​	HD 78592​	1299​	266​	-295​	1,358.37​
HIP 44836​	HD 78593​	1347​	221​	-248​	1,387.36​
HIP 49481​	HD 87672​	1291​	687​	-238​	1,481.65​
HIP 42144​	HD 73071​	1366​	246​	-556​	1,495.19​
HIP 30424​	HIP 30424​	1249​	-506​	-680​	1,509.45​
HIP 19351​	HD 26429​	1009​	-1105​	-286​	1,523.45​
HIP 39980​	HD 68454​	1497​	-282​	-48​	1,524.09​
HIP 27776​	HD 39719​	1220​	-689​	-633​	1,537.47​
HIP 29530​	HD 43239​	1303​	-621​	-530​	1,537.64​
HIP 39536​	HD 67101​	1528​	-150​	-317​	1,567.73​
HIP 38421​	HIP 38421​	1382​	53​	-753​	1,574.72​
HIP 33327​	HD 51706​	1505​	-545​	-263​	1,622.10​
HIP 41533​	HD 71896​	1607​	-48​	-271​	1,630.40​
HIP 35488​	HIP 35488​	1546​	-392​	-375​	1,638.42​
HIP 51098​	HD 90447​	1286​	1013​	-295​	1,663.43​
HIP 26945​	HD 38615​	1416​	-873​	-6​	1,663.50​
HIP 36216​	HD 59367​	1616​	-372​	-366​	1,698.17​
HIP 41039​	B Velorum​	1700​	-190​	-141​	1,716.39​
HIP 49042​	HD 86782​	1464​	838​	-364​	1,725.70​
HIP 49013​	HD 86765​	1637​	558​	-124​	1,733.93​
HIP 38510​	HD 64716​	1742​	-275​	-314​	1,791.31​
HIP 42312​	e Velorum​	1805​	-31​	-241​	1,821.28​
HIP 43023​	a Velorum​	1847​	-55​	-138​	1,852.96​
HIP 42834​	D Velorum​	1847​	-142​	-51​	1,853.15​
HIP 40373​	HD 69120​	1734​	136​	-725​	1,884.38​
HIP 35407​	HD 57119​	1686​	-240​	-883​	1,918.30​
HIP 32274​	HD 48943​	1716​	-597​	-648​	1,928.98​
HIP 42340​	HD 73700​	1939​	-63​	-217​	1,952.12​
HIP 47438​	HD 83861​	1945​	274​	-14​	1,964.25​
HIP 44835​	HD 78496​	1697​	669​	-729​	1,964.39​
HIP 11128​	HD 14954​	919​	-1749​	-29​	1,975.96​
HIP 16482​	HD 22132​	1108​	-1611​	-422​	2,000.27​
HIP 29753​	HD 43789​	1756​	-838​	-560​	2,024.69​
HIP 50215​	HD 88963​	1926​	666​	-11​	2,037.93​
HIP 48864​	HIP 48864​	1991​	697​	-185​	2,117.57​
HIP 37890​	HD 63048​	1891​	-30​	-953​	2,117.78​
HIP 38262​	HD 64008​	2053​	-171​	-694​	2,173.86​
HIP 30206​	HD 44764​	1955​	-893​	-607​	2,233.37​
HIP 41780​	HD 72284​	2045​	369​	-898​	2,263.76​
HIP 35061​	HIP 35061​	2112​	-315​	-1167​	2,433.45​
HIP 30338​	HD 44896​	2073​	-850​	-1128​	2,508.43​
HIP 34851​	HD 56023​	2388​	-761​	-327​	2,527.57​
HIP 34871​	HIP 34871​	2203​	-346​	-1231​	2,547.21​
HIP 42624​	n Velorum​	2538​	-140​	-169​	2,547.47​
HIP 46701​	n Velorum​	2538​	-140​	-169​	2,547.47​
HIP 31920​	HD 48291​	2327​	-927​	-563​	2,567.34​
HIP 32294​	HD 49191​	2373​	-958​	-387​	2,588.18​
HIP 35432​	HD 57218​	2453​	-400​	-1154​	2,740.24​
HIP 38655​	TYC 6553-2880-1​	2502​	112​	-1329​	2,835.28​
HIP 46332​	HD 81713​	2533​	1045​	-819​	2,859.87​
HIP 44258​	HD 77237​	2481​	896​	-1105​	2,859.93​
HIP 40413​	HD 69250​	2782​	128​	-1016​	2,964.48​
HIP 37070​	HD 61209​	2630​	-141​	-1361​	2,964.64​
HIP 35051​	HD 56211​	2633​	-408​	-1419​	3,018.73​
HIP 31402​	HD 46997​	2552​	-890​	-1408​	3,047.50​
HIP 32734​	HD 49960​	2700​	-749​	-1473​	3,165.55​
HIP 43413​	f Velorum​	3254​	-81​	-194​	3,260.78​
HIP 34729​	HD 55345​	2832​	-452​	-1621​	3,294.26​
HIP 48979​	HIP 48979​	3073​	1365​	-480​	3,396.61​
HIP 36938​	HD 61076​	3231​	-579​	-874​	3,396.83​
HIP 35013​	HD 56316​	3203​	-810​	-932​	3,432.77​
HIP 48622​	HIP 48622​	3461​	1355​	-488​	3,748.69​
HIP 26123​	HIP 26123​	2907​	-1926​	-1598​	3,835.85​
HIP 26516​	HD 37690​	3142​	-2003​	-1244​	3,928.32​
HIP 23321​	HD 32400​	2933​	-2446​	-1273​	4,025.66​
HIP 34646​	HD 55173​	3532​	-656​	-1817​	4,025.77​
HIP 37896​	HD 63046​	3576​	78​	-2060​	4,127.65​
HIP 43404​	HD 75692​	3926​	736​	-1234​	4,180.66​
HIP 22205​	HD 30500​	2908​	-2778​	-1653​	4,348.12​
HIP 45231​	HIP 45231​	4056​	1114​	-1102​	4,348.16​
HIP 38683​	TYC 6553-2661-1​	3925​	159​	-2122​	4,464.73​
HIP 22770​	HD 31449​	3312​	-2877​	-1359​	4,592.75​
HIP 38461​	HIP 38461​	4727​	-478​	-1357​	4,941.10​
HIP 40374​	HIP 40374​	5776​	28​	-1763​	6,039.13​

Ok this list is done! A lot of them are permit locked, follows is the list of permit locked systems;

21936​	HD 29914​	235.38​	-452.78​	-882.34​	Permit requried​
22428​	HIP 22428​	225.81​	-381.03​	-781.78​	Permit requried​
22601​	HD 30897​	214.16​	-401.28​	-945​	Permit requried​
23161​	HR 1600​	123.28​	-320.81​	-1087.44​	Permit requried​
23680​	W Orionis​	376.56​	-465.59​	-1075.34​	Permit requried​
23770​	HIP 23770​	156.69​	-252.84​	-812.44​	Permit requried​
23846​	HD 33037​	441.97​	-567.06​	-1491.44​	Permit requried​
23945​	HIP 23945​	150.63​	-241.25​	-831.88​	Permit requried​
23967​	HD 33235​	208.22​	-296.94​	-932.47​	Permit requried​
24058​	HIP 24058​	310.5​	-325.53​	-675.22​	Permit requried​
24518​	HIP 24518​	192.22​	-230.5​	-764.81​	Permit requried​
24757​	HD 34561​	334.16​	-331.81​	-907.56​	Permit requried​
25072​	HD 35067​	351.72​	-333.25​	-1002.22​	Permit requried​
25111​	HD 35051​	143.63​	-193.69​	-1049.13​	Permit requried​
25128​	HD 35135​	632.75​	-567.38​	-1523.13​	Permit requried​
25163​	HD 35177​	389.97​	-354.03​	-1007.06​	Permit requried​
25185​	HIP 25185​	215.56​	-213.09​	-761.41​	Permit requried​
25481​	HIP 25481​	233.09​	-212.69​	-815.53​	Permit requried​
25493​	HD 35762​	353.84​	-304.13​	-986.03​	Permit requried​
25513​	HIP 25513​	174.09​	-178.53​	-911.94​	Permit requried​
25591​	HIP 25591​	249.13​	-209.16​	-681.38​	Permit requried​
25640​	HIP 25640​	291​	-245.56​	-847.66​	Permit requried​
25872​	HD 36411​	739.88​	-553.44​	-1425.53​	Permit requried​
26024​	HD 36627​	405.84​	-306.31​	-1048.06​	Permit requried​
26061​	HIP 26061​	343.16​	-248.59​	-675.59​	Permit requried​
26072​	HR 1860​	120.97​	-123.16​	-1131.34​	Permit requried​
26098​	HR 1871​	416.81​	-306.22​	-990.06​	Permit requried​
26202​	HD 36820​	180.06​	-147.94​	-979.34​	Permit requried​
26213​	HD 36954​	446.72​	-317.13​	-960.38​	Permit requried​
26749​	HIP 26749​	336.47​	-213.88​	-688.41​	Permit requried​
27210​	HD 38453​	417.69​	-238.47​	-955.13​	Permit requried​
27744​	HD 39401​	487.66​	-245.69​	-948.56​	Permit requried​
27816​	HD 39497​	392.13​	-186.03​	-932.91​	Permit requried​
28123​	HIP 28123​	263.28​	-102.56​	-789.44​	Permit requried​
28285​	HIP 28285​	380.09​	-168.63​	-685.09​	Permit requried​
28289​	HD 40316​	226.66​	-56.53​	-1022.44​	Permit requried​
28590​	HD 40935​	519.59​	-200.06​	-1067.03​	Permit requried​
28668​	HD 41166​	493​	-196.59​	-870.19​	Permit requried​
28762​	HIP 28762​	348.22​	-116.53​	-798.81​	Permit requried​
28830​	HD 41433​	568.84​	-204.66​	-1110.28​	Permit requried​
29043​	HD 41855​	410.72​	-124.28​	-910.66​	Permit requried​
29406​	HD 42561​	417.25​	-91.09​	-1036.31​	Permit requried​
29508​	HIP 29508​	301.03​	-48.72​	-839.97​	Permit requried​
29896​	HIP 29896​	582.28​	-80.53​	-1453.75​	Permit requried​
30009​	HD 43913​	626.06​	-118.47​	-1294.94​	Permit requried​
30341​	HD 44638​	953.72​	-150.06​	-1900.63​	Permit requried​
30690​	HD 45339​	669.84​	-77.13​	-1327.97​	Permit requried​
31349​	HIP 31349​	334.72​	83.66​	-1091.19​	Permit requried​
31704​	HD 260988​	1046.84​	48.34​	-2258.53​	Permit requried​
32814​	35 Geminorum​	633.59​	197.66​	-1633.34​	Permit requried​
33089​	HIP 33089​	480.47​	49.25​	-838.72​	Permit requried​

The rest are all confirmed to be in EDSM and have a visitors tag from either me or the odd other player who must have been flying around in that area!

 

[Iron Body]

Ok this list is done! A lot of them are permit locked, follows is the list of permit locked systems;

Great news !!

I have about 150 left on my sector 2/3 list, but I have slowed down to collect the lucrative bio-data. I need the cash to restock the three loads of tritium I have bought for the carrier - about 60k tons of tritium @49k/ton = 2.9 billion.

There are still quite a few stars left in sector 6 , as listed above.

(short response due to watching the world cup at the same time)

 

[varonica]

Great news !!

I have about 150 left on my sector 2/3 list, but I have slowed down to collect the lucrative bio-data. I need the cash to restock the three loads of tritium I have bought for the carrier - about 60k tons of tritium @49k/ton = 2.9 billion.

There are still quite a few stars left in sector 6 , as listed above.

(short response due to watching the world cup at the same time)

Ok, am hanging around the bubble for a week or two to stock Tritium and run some missions. One of the thoughts I have is that with the Thargoid war apparantly running full ahead now what are the chances of the some of those locked systems suddenly becoming unlocked in the near future, maybe the Thargoid war will lead us in that direction eventually.

 

[varonica]

There are still quite a few stars left in sector 6 , as listed above.

Some sort of data overlap there, out of the stars in sector 6 most were permit locked, 2 had been visited already by other players and the rest were already visited by me, so sector 6 is actually all done! So permit locked is of course obvious, the ones marked V were already visited by me, the ones marked D were already done by other visitors, so that's job done

35 Geminorum​	633.59​	197.66​	-1633.34​	Permit required​
HD 260988​	1046.84​	48.34​	-2258.53​	Permit required​
HD 29914​	235.38​	-452.78​	-882.34​	Permit required​
HD 30897​	214.16​	-401.28​	-945​	Permit required​
HD 33037​	441.97​	-567.06​	-1491.44​	Permit required​
HD 33235​	208.22​	-296.94​	-932.47​	Permit required​
HD 34561​	334.16​	-331.81​	-907.56​	Permit required​
HD 35051​	143.63​	-193.69​	-1049.13​	Permit required​
HD 35067​	351.72​	-333.25​	-1002.22​	Permit required​
HD 35135​	632.75​	-567.38​	-1523.13​	Permit required​
HD 35177​	389.97​	-354.03​	-1007.06​	Permit required​
HD 35762​	353.84​	-304.13​	-986.03​	Permit required​
HD 36411​	739.88​	-553.44​	-1425.53​	Permit required​
HD 36627​	405.84​	-306.31​	-1048.06​	Permit required​
HD 36820​	180.06​	-147.94​	-979.34​	Permit required​
HD 36954​	446.72​	-317.13​	-960.38​	Permit required​
HD 38453​	417.69​	-238.47​	-955.13​	Permit required​
HD 39401​	487.66​	-245.69​	-948.56​	Permit required​
HD 39497​	392.13​	-186.03​	-932.91​	Permit required​
HD 40316​	226.66​	-56.53​	-1022.44​	Permit required​
HD 40935​	519.59​	-200.06​	-1067.03​	Permit required​
HD 41099​	105.25​	245.84​	-3186.5​	v​
HD 41166​	493​	-196.59​	-870.19​	Permit required​
HD 41433​	568.84​	-204.66​	-1110.28​	Permit required​
HD 41855​	410.72​	-124.28​	-910.66​	Permit required​
HD 42561​	417.25​	-91.09​	-1036.31​	Permit required​
HD 43913​	626.06​	-118.47​	-1294.94​	Permit required​
HD 44638​	953.72​	-150.06​	-1900.63​	Permit required​
HD 45339​	669.84​	-77.13​	-1327.97​	Permit required​
HD 49640​	1665.53​	249.16​	-3398.19​	v​
HD 49827​	1693.06​	323.44​	-3639.16​	v​
HD 50509​	1007.25​	644.66​	-3508.19​	v​
HD 59268​	480.72​	1058.88​	-2669.94​	v​
HD 63856​	473.97​	324.56​	-822.91​	v​
HD 67319​	104.31​	873.69​	-1432.63​	V​
HD 84949​	338.78​	888.13​	-673.31​	v​
HIP 22428​	225.81​	-381.03​	-781.78​	Permit required​
HIP 23770​	156.69​	-252.84​	-812.44​	Permit required​
HIP 23945​	150.63​	-241.25​	-831.88​	Permit required​
HIP 24058​	310.5​	-325.53​	-675.22​	Permit required​
HIP 24518​	192.22​	-230.5​	-764.81​	Permit required​
HIP 25185​	215.56​	-213.09​	-761.41​	Permit required​
HIP 25481​	233.09​	-212.69​	-815.53​	Permit required​
HIP 25513​	174.09​	-178.53​	-911.94​	Permit required​
HIP 25591​	249.13​	-209.16​	-681.38​	Permit required​
HIP 25640​	291​	-245.56​	-847.66​	Permit required​
HIP 26061​	343.16​	-248.59​	-675.59​	Permit required​
HIP 26749​	336.47​	-213.88​	-688.41​	Permit required​
HIP 28123​	263.28​	-102.56​	-789.44​	Permit required​
HIP 28285​	380.09​	-168.63​	-685.09​	Permit required​
HIP 28762​	348.22​	-116.53​	-798.81​	Permit required​
HIP 29508​	301.03​	-48.72​	-839.97​	Permit required​
HIP 29896​	582.28​	-80.53​	-1453.75​	Permit required​
HIP 31349​	334.72​	83.66​	-1091.19​	Permit required​
HIP 33089​	480.47​	49.25​	-838.72​	Permit required​
HIP 37744​	70.72​	393.44​	-801.94​	v​
HIP 37967​	411.97​	314.66​	-813.94​	v​
HIP 39412​	242.44​	209.03​	-440.47​	v​
HIP 39809​	313.59​	289.63​	-573.94​	v​
HIP 41263​	10.81​	352.16​	-503.16​	v​
HIP 41821​	144.25​	436.81​	-621.13​	v​
HIP 43111​	433.69​	919.53​	-1174.19​	v​
HIP 43990​	63.53​	515.44​	-592.44​	v​
HIP 45157​	204.44​	614.44​	-637.25​	d​
HIP 45549​	140.59​	489.72​	-488.69​	v​
HIP 46119​	207.78​	461.16​	-430.59​	v​
HIP 48232​	74.94​	431.09​	-337.84​	v​
HIP 48810​	250.41​	698​	-494.22​	v​
HIP 48984​	166.56​	513.53​	-359.19​	v​
HIP 49570​	180.72​	492.47​	-317.31​	v​
HIP 49842​	211.5​	596.38​	-373.16​	v​
HIP 50585​	110.19​	450.97​	-268.84​	v​
HIP 51043​	115.25​	633.13​	-367.91​	v​
HIP 51086​	212.59​	687.59​	-374.59​	v​
HIP 52382​	33.53​	584.22​	-311.53​	v​
HIP 52812​	21.16​	483.41​	-247.72​	v​
HR 1600​	123.28​	-320.81​	-1087.44​	Permit required​
HR 1860​	120.97​	-123.16​	-1131.34​	Permit required​
HR 1871​	416.81​	-306.22​	-990.06​	Permit required​
UX Eridani​	58.44​	-513.97​	-414.63​	d​
W Orionis​	376.56​	-465.59​	-1075.34​	Permit required​

 

[varonica]

There are still quite a few stars left in sector 6 , as listed above.

Not a data overlap, I have already done sector 6 previously, I realised it after looking back a couple of pages!

Going to check out sector 7, seems there are still some to do there!

Nope, my mistake, I have already visited all the stars in sector 7.

Bookmarked everything from sector 8 to 12, on my way through that lot now, not many, and Gliese 9451 B has been renamed to KALB and is a populated system so that's done already.

 

[varonica]

Given the slow progress I have made with my last group of 500 stars - 3 months - I don't see this phase of the project completing before the new year.

I have 17 systems to do in the 8-12 sectors, some of them look out of range, there are 8 in sector 1, so no problems, although as you say the new bio rewards do slow you down a bit.

 

[Iron Body]

Great news. I must have missed your prevous updates somehow. Time run another update.

edit: just started checking my "definitive" list of permit locked stars. The list above has already been included, but they have the spurious non-ascii charaters in the names. So thats why they did'nt match - easily corrected.

 

[varonica]

Great news. I must have missed your prevous updates somehow. Time run another update.

edit: just started checking my "definitive" list of permit locked stars. The list above has already been included, but they have the spurious non-ascii charaters in the names. So thats why they did'nt match - easily corrected.

Oops

 

[Iron Body]

Interim list of the top 20 HIP hunting commanders :
hamstelBaster = 6873
expugnax = 4048
Jackie Silver = 3688
Varonica = 1887
Irisa Nyira = 1882
Arnoldo = 1033
kjnpbr = 967
getedoi = 846
DrewCarnegie = 764
Pirin = 715
Orvidius = 708
Mikish1 = 654
iFred [SecB] = 617
Jjgoldberg = 568
Spock Oddsocks = 546
Rollo Rhadium = 516
pipski = 504
Stulli = 500
Mooing = 492
Jimbo Jameson = 474

 

[Iron Body]

We know that EDSM doesn't distinguish system names by case , and this leads to the duplicated names issue in EDSM.

This means that the commander query I use to find the first discoverer, and traffic, of a system returns unreliable data for systems with case dependent names.
for example the query "?systemName=c+Puppis" returns "C Puppis,goemon,2017-03-03 10:04:55,11"
Even though both c Puppis and C Puppis are in the game, and the Spansh data dump.

Consequently, the only way to check the first discoverer will be to look them up in the galmap, which is a pain. Also, if there is no traffic there - they will have to be visited.
But first, I have to find the duplicated names, which is a pain. Hopefully there won't be too many.

So for the time being I am going back to finish sectors 2 and 3.

 

[varonica]

Oh what to do, now I am stuck, I just reached system HD 221180, one of my target systems, there are 4...yes 4 planets with 9 bio each, I've calculated it out and with first discovery bonus I am looking at a massive 1,573,019,200 cr, it will slow me down a bit though....oh what to do!