Griefers make open impossible, and how easy the solution is.

Rat Catcher

Rat Catcher
Paul Smith the 3rd said:
... snip
PG is PvE in a group setting...
Click to expand...
My alt plays in a PG for a good part of his playtime, a few friends (literally) having fun together, which is mostly PvE but does include 'staged' PvP in identical basic (no engineering) ships all the same apart from weapon loadout, it is fun and pretty inconsequential.

I'm sure that there are some here who'd frown on us making our antics exclusive, but in truth they don't 'need' me/us in their game and I/we (apologies for inclusive, but grammar would trip up otherwise) certainly don't 'need' them, so it balances out :)

ETA: I have no desire to change open, my main just about lives there, I also don't like the idea of someone else wanting to change open for their own ends...
 

Backelaer

Backelaer
Paul Smith the 3rd said:
As far as I know we never met in the game. So how do you know what I do in it? Fyi until now I never ganked anybody or fought someone who wasn't better than me.
Where did I say something about catching unprepared people? Most times I'm the one caught un- or ill-prepared, but I wouldn't want any pvp flags or other things which would restrict open mode from what it is right now.

Elite is not your usual MMO, there are no common goals or things to do. It's a sandbox with a space setting. Most CMDRs work on their own goals in the game and many times they collide with other CMDRs goals, therefore conflict is build-in, if you like it or not. How the conflict is resolved is up to them, could be by agreement, conflict or anything inbetween. Plus it's not really MMO with instancing and other network related stuff. It's quite a lot of work to get 15 people into the same instance.

PG is PvE in a group setting. Set up a PG, find up to 20.000 like minded people who are most times in the same part of the galaxy and you have many CMDRs around you can meet without fear to be shot at. Why is it that a minority always wants to change open into something it is not if there are 2 other modes? Asking to change 1 of the 3 to suit your ideas is the real lunacy.

*The minority part is deducted from my interactions and talks with other CMDRs in-game, not from the forums or other online venues.
Click to expand...

^This right here. This is me as well.
There seem to be a lot of people assuming that whoever advocates that Open should stay just that* are automatically notorious gankers themselves. To the best of my knowledge I might have killed a handful of players, and got killed myself a lot more in this past half-decade.
I just welcome unpredictable and organic gameplay. I don't mind being interdicted. 99% of the time I also know beforehand if it will happen. Because there's a handful of hotspots where those chances are really high. I take that into account when I fly there. (a) I take a ship that can fight, (b) I take a ship that can escape, or (c) I go Solo.

That being said, are there certain circumstances that make me choose option (c) more often than I'd like to? Hell yeah. I would have liked engineering to be a little more sideways focused. I don't like the enormous dmg multipliers nor the enormous shield multipliers: The way it was implemented has pushed pvp combat more towards a glorified rock-paper-scissors game. However, I still highly prefer the occasional adrenalin rush I get to experience there, as well as having to be more on edge, looking around in SC for potential threats.
It's the idea that combat can happen at any moment, or anywhere that makes open enjoyable for me.
Fot the love of god, please, let's not get 'flags' or any of that other nonsense as long as there are PG's and Solo.


* Open, without any weird limitations (some of which would wreak havoc on the BGS as we know it by the way)
 
Last edited:

Deleted member 38366

D
galahad2069 said:
This game is called Elite: Dangerous, not Elite: Safe space. :)
Click to expand...

That's not its real name though.

Its true name is more like ELITE : Toxic or (more friendly) ELITE : Nonsensical (just because it doesn't make any sense in regard to the never-ending problems).
It's more or less a failed MMO due to non-existing C&P and a few exceedingly poor Design Decisions from the past.
At that point it comes in handy that in reality it's really more of an SMO anyway, plus all the non-Open Options for Players who prefer a Galaxy that makes any sense.

In Open and at least in hotspots, the entire Simulator aspect and any realistic immersion that could come with it is nuked into oblivion.
Basically 100% Gamey, an Arcade Gankfest (and not a good one at it, since it entirely breaks its own in-game rules and logic).

Like someone took CQC and tossed it into the live Game, except a more annoying version of it.
On the pro side, no waiting in a Lobby or unable to play due to lack of Players :D

Thing is though..... The Decisionmakers wanted it so. A honeypot for Gankers and Griefers.
The kind of riffraff all other titles either long banned or put tightly into their corner by intelligent or aggressive Game Design with strict enforcement rules - because they long learned that's the only way to be sure..

Not too bright (understatement), but it was their Design Decision(tm). They love it that way.
Since no sane MMO Developer would ever do that, it's extremely unintuitive and unexpected for new Players of course.
As a result, Players naturally head to the Forum and ask "what the hell is wrong with this Game?". Again and again and again and again. Since 5 years.
....but since FDev refuses to learn MMO Design Basics 101, we'll likely have those Threads in 2020, 2021 and 2022. Again and again and again and again ;)

------------------------

IMHO the button "Open Play" should simply be renamed.
Label it "Lawless FFA PvP Mode" and it'd all be set and done. Fair and correct description, that's how it works and leaves no doubts.

All we'd then need is a unified "CoOp PvE Mode" of some sort and things would be sorted perfectly.
And noone would need to invent and design a C&P System from scratch.

Especially with New Player Experience in mind.... New Customers (not experienced Forum-goers)... it becomes more and more important to properly label things in order not to give false expectations.
And unsurprisingly, new Players expect things to make sense. That simply isn't the case as it stands.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Deleted member 110222

D
FalconFly said:
That's not its real name though.

Its true name is more like ELITE : Toxic or (more friendly) ELITE : Nonsensical (just because it doesn't make any sense in regard to the never-ending problems).
It's more or less a failed MMO due to non-existing C&P and a few exceedingly poor Design Decisions from the past.
At that point it comes in handy that in reality it's really more of an SMO anyway, plus all the non-Open Options for Players who prefer a Galaxy that makes any sense.

In Open and at least in hotspots, the entire Simulator aspect and any realistic immersion that could come with it is nuked into oblivion.
Basically 100% Gamey, an Arcade Gankfest (and not a good one at it, since it entirely breaks its own in-game rules and logic).

Like someone took CQC and tossed it into the live Game, except a more annoying version of it.
On the pro side, no waiting in a Lobby or unable to play due to lack of Players :D

Thing is though..... The Decisionmakers wanted it so. A honeypot for Gankers and Griefers.
The kind of riffraff all other titles either long banned or put tightly into their corner by intelligent or aggressive Game Design with strict enforcement rules - because they long learned that's the only way to be sure..

Not too bright (understatement), but it was their Design Decision(tm). They love it that way.
Since no sane MMO Developer would ever do that, it's extremely unintuitive and unexpected for new Players of course.
As a result, Players naturally head to the Forum and ask "what the hell is wrong with this Game?". Again and again and again and again. Since 5 years.
....but since FDev refuses to learn MMO Design Basics 101, we'll likely have those Threads in 2020, 2021 and 2022. Again and again and again and again ;)

------------------------

IMHO the button "Open Play" should simply be renamed.
Label it "Lawless FFA PvP Mode" and it'd all be set and done. Fair and correct description, that's how it works and leaves no doubts.

All we'd then need is a unified "CoOp PvE Mode" of some sort and things would be sorted perfectly.
And noone would need to invent and design a C&P System from scratch.

Especially with New Player Experience in mind.... New Customers (not experienced Forum-goers)... it becomes more and more important to properly label things in order not to give false expectations.
And unsurprisingly, new Players expect things to make sense. That simply isn't the case as it stands.
Click to expand...
Dude that makes a lot of sense and I totally agree.

Yeah. Rename Open Mode to PvP Mode would make a huge difference.

You'll have people on this forum saying it won't work of course, and they'll be writing 1000-word essays with Latin scientific terms to "explain why we're wrong" when they read this, but...

This forum has a weird tendency to massively over-complicate everything.

Expect demands for lore explanations why Open has been renamed PvP within your idea.

One of the few ideas made by a regular player that actually makes sense BTW.
 

galahad2069

G
FalconFly said:
That's not its real name though.

Its true name is more like ELITE : Toxic or (more friendly) ELITE : Nonsensical (just because it doesn't make any sense in regard to the never-ending problems).
It's more or less a failed MMO due to non-existing C&P and a few exceedingly poor Design Decisions from the past.
At that point it comes in handy that in reality it's really more of an SMO anyway, plus all the non-Open Options for Players who prefer a Galaxy that makes any sense.

In Open and at least in hotspots, the entire Simulator aspect and any realistic immersion that could come with it is nuked into oblivion.
Basically 100% Gamey, an Arcade Gankfest (and not a good one at it, since it entirely breaks its own in-game rules and logic).

Like someone took CQC and tossed it into the live Game, except a more annoying version of it.
On the pro side, no waiting in a Lobby or unable to play due to lack of Players :D

Thing is though..... The Decisionmakers wanted it so. A honeypot for Gankers and Griefers.
The kind of riffraff all other titles either long banned or put tightly into their corner by intelligent or aggressive Game Design with strict enforcement rules - because they long learned that's the only way to be sure..

Not too bright (understatement), but it was their Design Decision(tm). They love it that way.
Since no sane MMO Developer would ever do that, it's extremely unintuitive and unexpected for new Players of course.
As a result, Players naturally head to the Forum and ask "what the hell is wrong with this Game?". Again and again and again and again. Since 5 years.
....but since FDev refuses to learn MMO Design Basics 101, we'll likely have those Threads in 2020, 2021 and 2022. Again and again and again and again ;)

------------------------

IMHO the button "Open Play" should simply be renamed.
Label it "Lawless FFA PvP Mode" and it'd all be set and done. Fair and correct description, that's how it works and leaves no doubts.

All we'd then need is a unified "CoOp PvE Mode" of some sort and things would be sorted perfectly.
And noone would need to invent and design a C&P System from scratch.

Especially with New Player Experience in mind.... New Customers (not experienced Forum-goers)... it becomes more and more important to properly label things in order not to give false expectations.
And unsurprisingly, new Players expect things to make sense. That simply isn't the case as it stands.
Click to expand...

Believe it or not, but I was a new player once. I had to fiddle with the tons of keybinds quite a lot to find the most comfortable and functional settings, I had to learn how to control my ship, which module did what, things like that. I had to learn what rectangles and triangles represented on my scanner and also why some of them were hollow.

One thing was clear though from the very beginning: I had absolutely no problem wrapping my head around the fact that CMDR's can shoot at one another.

If anything could have confused me, it would have been a godmode toggle switch.
 

Deleted member 110222

D
galahad2069 said:
Believe it or not, but I was a new player once. I had to fiddle with the tons of keybinds quite a lot to find the most comfortable and functional settings, I had to learn how to control my ship, which module did what, things like that. I had to learn what rectangles and triangles represented on my scanner and also why some of them were hollow.

One thing was clear though from the very beginning: I had absolutely no problem wrapping my head around the fact that CMDR's can shoot at one another.

If anything could have confused me, it would have been a godmode toggle switch.
Click to expand...
We're rare though.

It seems many people want to go into Open but be given immunity to gameplay from others under the guise of "but my time is valuable".

I'm not going to invoke this "game needs risks" crap as it's a literal video game. There are no risks lel.

But there is a matter of providing the product people paid for. Like it or not but a mode where we can look at another player's cargo ship and yeet it to explosion for "no reason" is that product since day numero uno.
 

Raino

Raino
galahad2069 said:
Believe it or not, but I was a new player once. I had to fiddle with the tons of keybinds quite a lot to find the most comfortable and functional settings, I had to learn how to control my ship, which module did what, things like that. I had to learn what rectangles and triangles represented on my scanner and also why some of them were hollow.

One thing was clear though from the very beginning: I had absolutely no problem wrapping my head around the fact that CMDR's can shoot at one another.

If anything could have confused me, it would have been a godmode toggle switch.
Click to expand...
Things, You earn with no effort, do not have any value to You. I have 10k hours in open and i enjoyed every minute!
 

Craith

Volunteer Moderator
Craith
Morbad said:
If I, for whatever reason, decide to have my CMDR take his G5 FDL against a soft target, he doesn't magically become a worse pilot.
Click to expand...
True - but it will not make you a better pilot, nor is it the reason you are a good pilot. Nor will the soft target learn anything unless you tell him ("you are a known CLogger / from an opposing power / shooting my faction / taking part in this CG we oppose / helping Xenos / hunting Xenos / using a docking computer / flying an adder / using a red paintjob / i just wanted")
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom