Griefers make open impossible, and how easy the solution is.

[TrollhunterX]

There are three scenarios':

1) On your own: just get a shot in in the last 20 seconds

2) with others, in a wing: everyone who hit the target gets the bounty (so total bounty is multiplied)

3) with others, not in a wing: last one to hit gets the bounty.

This encourages winging up with strangers, and the risk of PvP discourages kill stealing.

Righto.

So presuming that 'On your own' means Solo, I'm just surprised that 'last one to hit' doesn't get mentioned more in general discussions about bounty hunting. Or, possibly, I learned this from 'How to make a good start' guides that emphasised beginning in Solo, so it wasn't a necessary caveat.

Either way, I'd better get the hang of communications before I go near a RES in Open (alas, my live keyboard skill is Type O).

 

[Ian Skippy]

Righto.

So presuming that 'On your own' means Solo, I'm just surprised that 'last one to hit' doesn't get mentioned more in general discussions about bounty hunting. Or, possibly, I learned this from 'How to make a good start' guides that emphasised beginning in Solo, so it wasn't a necessary caveat.

Either way, I'd better get the hang of communications before I go near a RES in Open (alas, my live keyboard skill is Type O).

On your own means any combat that ended with only one Cmdr involved. So you (plus some cops) vs a pirate for example. It's not so much about the game mode, but about a difference between Cmdr and NPC; it is much easier for another Cmdr to steal your kill than it is for an NPC to do so.

The idea was that nobody enjoys the latter, whereas kill stealing between players would lead to interaction: either winging up (ideally, numbers-wise) or PvP.

 

[Old Duck]

Thankfully for me, an honorable pirate, there are enough people playing in open to make PvP piracy worthwhile. So far, only a tiny fraction has clogged on me (one being an Elite Cutter, LOL).

 

[Kloppage Time]

I never knew my in game mum sniff

.....and mum worked at Lakon selling T-7s until she met Ricardo.

Selling T-7s eh? That's what they told you, huh? Well, I hope you're sitting down, Mr Nuke...or may I call you Rubber?

I've been doing some extensive research for a new BBC series (yep, the licence fee survived WWIII) of "Who Do You Think You Are?" focusing on disgruntled PowerPlay non-entities rather than Z-list or has-been celebs & I can exclusively reveal that your mom actually used to hang around the docks waiting for T-7 pilots - known to be some of the most desperate losers in the galaxy (second only to Cobra MkIV pilots) - to take their shore-leave...

...but not, alas, to sell them T-7s!

 

[Rubbernuke]

Who are "you" here? Certainly not the new player that just got enough credits to buy themselves a hauler and decided to casually check out that invitation from Felicity Farseer that they just received. Such a player will have no idea what is awaiting them or how likely it is that a random player will just decide to blow them out of the sky, they also do not have the experience nor resources to properly fit out their ships or fly them. An experienced player with a "Dangerous" (or at least "Competent") tag on them is one thing and typically enters open knowing fully aware of what can and cannot happen. Seal clubbing Harmless or Mostly Harmless haulers and sidewinders taking their first steps outside the noob zone is quite another.

You can fly in almost any direction and be safe from the starter zone. Plus, every player should assume anyone they see will want to kill them- and avoid others. This process is trial and error- each time you fail you need to look at what you could do better. If you don't think that process is for you, Open is not for you.

Someone who is willing to learn will analyse why its a bad idea to go so early to Farseer, what to look for, and use this experience to change what they do next. A poor player will simply give up at the first hurdle even though on the label it says people will shoot, and that lives are infinite.

 

[Rubbernuke]

Selling T-7s eh? That's what they told you, huh? Well, I hope you're sitting down, Mr Nuke...or may I call you Rubber?

I've been doing some extensive research for a new BBC series (yep, the licence fee survived WWIII) of "Who Do You Think You Are?" focusing on disgruntled PowerPlay non-entities rather than Z-list or has-been celebs & I can exclusively reveal that your mom actually used to hang around the docks waiting for T-7 pilots - known to be some of the most desperate losers in the galaxy (second only to Cobra MkIV pilots) - to take their shore-leave...

...but not, alas, to sell them T-7s!

That explains a lot. The looks at supermarkets, the scorn. And why I can only fit through large doors as I'm so tall.....

 

[gorankar]

Duplicate

 

[gorankar]

You can stick your fingers in your ears and sing Kumbaya but it doesnt make the dystopia of the game-world go away. Westerns & the wild-west (apologies to Kurosawa) were the inspirations behind the Star Wars OT & Elite alike. Westerns are often focused on the relationships that build up despite the quick-draw environment. So it is in ED; being aware that someone could attack at any moment if they choose, makes the interactions that much more interesting when they dont. There are many games out there that cater to casual fluffy gameplay. You dont need to attempt to hijack this one. The devs dont seem to have the time to develop & support existing features as it is, even without bowing to bandwagons to change ED into something it isnt. ED doesnt default to 'nice'; what you get depends on the nature of the NPC or CMDR in front of you, and how you interact with them. Adding elements like OpenPvE takes development down a path of homogonising towards things like WoW, taking away its unique proposition. That doesnt secure the future of ED, it only threatens it.

WOW was and still is rediculously popular, and your opinions on this have been well stated by you. These things do not answer the questions I posed. How does it effect you how others want to play? What they see the game as being? With the exception of removing some victims from the game how are you harmed? Everything you said above is how you want the game to be played, how you enjoy it. That was not answer the questions I was asking.
It's why I am relatively fine with gankers, as annoying as they are. I don't have to play with them if I don't want. An Open PvE mode would just make not playing with them easier. It benefits me and them by removing someone that is just going to mode switch or high wake the moment he decides he does not have time or patience for the hollow triangles.

 

[gorankar]

Who would be missed more I wonder? Gankers or victims? If nothing else, I suppose this thread has answered that much at least.

 

[[VR] Orodruin]

You can fly in almost any direction and be safe from the starter zone.

Except the direction that the game points you in by sending the Farseer invitation.

Someone who is willing to learn will analyse why its a bad idea to go so early to Farseer, what to look for, and use this experience to change what they do next. A poor player will simply give up at the first hurdle even though on the label it says people will shoot, and that lives are infinite.

I think this is a bit naive to be honest. It is one thing to be presented with a challenge, it is another to be rofl-stomped by someone that has spent a hundred or a thousand times more time than you in the game the first thing that happens.

 

[Screemonster]

Blue hair princess, Aisling Duval.
You know that the power play pledge is a big PvP flag? PP has it's own weaker C&P, almost like FDev encourages pvp between pledged player.

Hilariously, one of the things that I was talking about in a previous thread about the idea of a PvP toggle or an open PvE mode is that I'd only be okay with it if certain things and situations made it offer no protection - and "attacker is of a different powerplay faction to defender" is definitely one of those things. In fact, anything where being shot wouldn't summon authority ships - you're wanted, in an anarchy, in an instance with no system link, and so on. There were a few other details like "attacking someone raises your PvP flag at least until you dock or leave the system", obviously.

The biggest question is what to do about piracy short of "being manifest scanned while carrying cargo makes you a valid target".

Edit: unless the PvP flag's effect was to make it so your ship could only be disabled and not killed by other player - so hull, canopy and life support won't go below 1% and power plant explosion chance reduced to 0. Like the buddha code in HL2 - the biggest issue there would be people hanging around and stunlocking you for the lulz and even then presumably the authority ships will show up.

 

[Cheese Helmet]

WOW was and still is rediculously popular, and your opinions on this have been well stated by you. These things do not answer the questions I posed. How does it effect you how others want to play? What they see the game as being? With the exception of removing some victims from the game how are you harmed? Everything you said above is how you want the game to be played, how you enjoy it. That was not answer the questions I was asking.
It's why I am relatively fine with gankers, as annoying as they are. I don't have to play with them if I don't want. An Open PvE mode would just make not playing with them easier. It benefits me and them by removing someone that is just going to mode switch or high wake the moment he decides he does not have time or patience for the hollow triangles.

How does it effect you how others want to play? What they see the game as being?

because the game can only be what it is. The more and more you pull it away from a dangerous open world, that is cutthroat and doesn’t care about whether you live, die, succeed, or fail, the less it becomes that.

With the exception of removing some victims from the game how are you harmed?

False premise, if you are blown up in a video game you are not a victim of anything, except maybe you’re own mistakes. But open pve is fundamentally opposed to what elite is. If you want random player encounters, you get them, and all the randomness that accompanies it. You can’t have random player encounters and also control the randomness. You can either, eliminate all players, only allow players you know, or choose to run into random ones. the game allows you to choose who you encounter, not how they behave. That’s the problem the self proclaimed PvErs don’t understand. You can not control human behavior, only react to it, or avoid humans.

 

[Rubbernuke]

Except the direction that the game points you in by sending the Farseer invitation.

How do you know every single player does just that? Who is this "you"?

I think this is a bit naive to be honest. It is one thing to be presented with a challenge, it is another to be rofl-stomped by someone that has spent a hundred or a thousand times more time than you in the game the first thing that happens.

Really? Maybe I'm odd in that I analyze failure and do my best to avoid it again.

 

[CNC drill press]

The biggest question is what to do about piracy short of "being manifest scanned while carrying cargo makes you a valid target".

Currently: u dont want to be pirated? Go solo/pg.U want run into pirate? Go to open.

With pvp toggle: U dont want to be pirated? Pvp off. U want to be pirated? Pvp on.

U are just replacing invisible solo players with visible solo players

 

[Cheese Helmet]

How do you know every single player does just that? Who is this "you"?



Really? Maybe I'm odd in that I analyze failure and do my best to avoid it again.

Learning is hard for some people

 

[Ragamuffin1979]

When even solo is too hard. Lol

 

[[VR] Orodruin]

How do you know every single player does just that? Who is this "you"?

I never said that every player does that, just that the game points you in that direction. It is not an unreasonable conclusion that a significant number of new players will follow this pointer.

Really? Maybe I'm odd in that I analyze failure and do my best to avoid it again.

When did you start playing? To be perfectly frank, you currently have all of the tools in place to do this analysis and the means to make the corrections. A new player does not.

 

[Rubbernuke]

I never said that every player does that, just that the game points you in that direction. It is not an unreasonable conclusion that a significant number of new players will follow this pointer.

But you can't know that, just as I can't know people don't do it.

When did you start playing? To be perfectly frank, you currently have all of the tools in place to do this analysis and the means to make the corrections. A new player does not.

I was a KS backer.

And players now have all the tools they need- plus a titanic catalogue of information, guides, help as well as in game support and training. If anything new players have the better start- when I was new I had no scoops, credits were hard to get, iffy bugs that led to instant death, no starter zones, no engineering. All I had was my brain and work out problems- no guides, it was all unknown.

 

[Old Duck]

BLOCK THE GRIEFERS AND PLAY IN OPEN!!!!

ps - noble pirates like myself are not griefers. Heck, I'll help protect you from griefers, as this is good for "business"

 

[[VR] Orodruin]

But you can't know that, just as I can't know people don't do it.

Do you really believe that no new player will be the least interested in where the game so nocely points you? To me it seems you are grasping at straws to justify your standpoint. Of course there are going to be new players that follow the pointers. It is not even necessary that most do.

And players now have all the tools they need- plus a titanic catalogue of information, guides, help as well as in game support and training. If anything new players have the better start- when I was new I had no scoops, credits were hard to get, iffy bugs that led to instant death, no starter zones, no engineering. All I had was my brain and work out problems.

You misrepresent the problem. Yes, new players have more information available than there was at the beginning. However, much of the information available is through third party sites and YouTube videos and not everybody wants to need to look things up in third party sites. People at this forum are going to be highly unrepresentative just based on the fact that they have come here.

Yes, when you started playing you had to find things out by yourself, but so did everybody else around you. It is not unavailability of information that is the problem. It is the disparity between new player resources and those of those that prey upon them.