Handling Fleet Carriers in 2018 - Fleet Carrier Concept

[nexxo]

I think that it is a great idea (and I don't see Fdev being adverse to adopting it, seeing as they are constantly asking for player feedback). I would make carriers destroyable though --even if that should be a tough thing to do given their size. Ships on board would also be destroyed; undocked ships would have to find their own way home. There needs to be jeopardy involved in going deep into the black, and a sense of dependency on the carrier as your home out there as the squadron collects materials and fuel (scooping) for its continued maintenance and repair. Hey, it's Elite Dangerous!

Travel is also well-considered: a far bigger jumps range than a ship (but with limits) and a charge time longer than it tales to just fly your ship there.

 

[andrak]

I think that it is a great idea (and I don't see Fdev being adverse to adopting it, seeing as they are constantly asking for player feedback). I would make carriers destroyable though --even if that should be a tough thing to do given their size. Ships on board would also be destroyed; undocked ships would have to find their own way home. There needs to be jeopardy involved in going deep into the black, and a sense of dependency on the carrier as your home out there as the squadron collects materials and fuel (scooping) for its continued maintenance and repair. Hey, it's Elite Dangerous!

Travel is also well-considered: a far bigger jumps range than a ship (but with limits) and a charge time longer than it tales to just fly your ship there.

That would be a very painful thing to experience. You are suggesting the loss of carrier, all ships within (all of them could be fully engineered), all the crew on board the carrier as well.. Would you be able to rebuy all this? Would it come with a rebuy on all the carrier modules as well? This sounds like way too much to lose.

 

[M00ka]

I think that it is a great idea (and I don't see Fdev being adverse to adopting it, seeing as they are constantly asking for player feedback). I would make carriers destroyable though --even if that should be a tough thing to do given their size. Ships on board would also be destroyed; undocked ships would have to find their own way home. There needs to be jeopardy involved in going deep into the black, and a sense of dependency on the carrier as your home out there as the squadron collects materials and fuel (scooping) for its continued maintenance and repair. Hey, it's Elite Dangerous!

Travel is also well-considered: a far bigger jumps range than a ship (but with limits) and a charge time longer than it tales to just fly your ship there.

I humbly disagree, to be able to lose not only the Carrier but everything on it (mats, trained NPCs, docked ships) could be a game ending event for players. Lets say you get a bunch of your friends to form a Squadron, you work hard to outfit it, and it gets destroyed. Everything you have will have gone as I image the rebuy on a carrier would be very very large.

I like the OP's idea that at a given damage percent the Carrier automatically disengages from combat and high wakes back to it's previous destination. This would encourage planning by the Squadron. Lets say the Squadron decides to move to a specific system 2,000 LY away, within a single jump range the OP suggested. Now they could do that in one jump but risk the possibility that if things turn bad, some of their Squadron ships will be stranded. Maybe they could be smart, do their initial jump to a system 1,800 LYs. Whilst waiting for the week long FSD cooldown (another excellent idea BTW) the squadron can start on the objective, 200 LY isn't far for most ships to travel. Then once the cooldown is over, the Carrier can jump into the target system. If things go bad, it will jump back to it's last destination, only 200 LY, not too close to the incident but still allows any Squadron ships that weren't docked (I would imagine there would be a 'call to arms' if the Carrier was attacked and all available squadron commanders would be in their personal ships helping defend it). Add to the fact the OP has already suggest that any repairs to the Carrier would be very time consuming and costly to the Squadron would be enough penalty to suffer.

 

[CMDR Kantos Kan]

Maybe you could not buy commodities but only sell them to the market. If in deep space the market values could assume some fixed balanced value. It would be nice to give traders / miners some love in the carrier concept.

But, if you're in the middle of nowhere, where is the market? I mean, those commodities are physical goods. They take up space in your cargo hold. If you're in the middle of nowhere, how can you sell? To whom?

 

[andrak]

But, if you're in the middle of nowhere, where is the market? I mean, those commodities are physical goods. They take up space in your cargo hold. If you're in the middle of nowhere, how can you sell? To whom?

The same way it works in the bubble I suppose. Maybe an NPC Type 6 or Keelback jumps into your carrier instance now and again and docks at your carrier when you have a market connection purchased, if that maintains "immersion".

 

[M00ka]

The same way it works in the bubble I suppose. Maybe an NPC Type 6 or Keelback jumps into your carrier instance now and again and docks at your carrier when you have a market connection purchased, if that maintains "immersion".

Maybe allow non-squadron members to use the trading module on the ship, they don't get access to anything else, just trade to both buy and sell commodities

 

[MrFailfactory]

I like a lot of what you had to say - what we are going to get, though, isn't going to be that grandiose.

Not because Frontier can't deliver, but because they won't - and shouldn't. Some of the things are just too much, such as the incredible costs you outline for various things, and a number of the capabilities that you would like to see, and some of the things have logistics tied to them that sound really difficult to manage.

I actually don't think that the Carriers should have any combat capability, nor should they be attackable. Some situation where the Squadron isn't able to push back an NPC attack that is part of a mission (choose from a multitude of reasons), and now their Carrier is wrecked. No one is going to like the taste of that, and even the most hard-core Save Resetters would probably not be on board as well. Too much time investment from too many people, and that is something that needs to be respected, in my opinion.

I really think that these things are just going to be a mobile base for the squadron - Repair, Rearming, Outfitting (from what you have deposited there), and hopefully Cartographics capability as well. I think they will just sit at the entry star, hopefully scooping fuel that you can then Refuel your ships from, until you dock, and tell it to go somewhere else. If you had one of these on an Exploration mission (a place to save your Cartographics Data and a Save Point), that would greatly open up the options for what kind of dangers that Frontier could place out in the black. Sign me up, please.

Any kind of large upkeep costs will also effectively lock out any solo players from ever having one of these, and I think that is something that Frontier should very carefully consider before deciding. I am hoping that you don't actually need to lead or be part of a Squadron to buy them, even if that means saving up a lot of credits over a long period of time.

Overall though, I did like your presentation, and the thought that went into it. +1

Riôt

 

[Quantis Trap]

I like the work which was put into this video, but I believe a lot of concepts which were expressed are not need at all and over complicate it.

 

[Ebel]

Very nice Andrak, I like all your ideas and particularly your presentation. Only place I might slightly differ is that the Carrier must take damage. By this I assume you mean significant damage. Only difference I might have is if a Carrier is well run and well winged, there might be a significant force available to repel attacks. As in WWII and carrier fleets there, it depends on how you deploy your resources! Small point only. +1 Sir.

 

[andrak]

I like a lot of what you had to say - what we are going to get, though, isn't going to be that grandiose.

Not because Frontier can't deliver, but because they won't - and shouldn't. Some of the things are just too much, such as the incredible costs you outline for various things, and a number of the capabilities that you would like to see, and some of the things have logistics tied to them that sound really difficult to manage.

I actually don't think that the Carriers should have any combat capability, nor should they be attackable. Some situation where the Squadron isn't able to push back an NPC attack that is part of a mission (choose from a multitude of reasons), and now their Carrier is wrecked. No one is going to like the taste of that, and even the most hard-core Save Resetters would probably not be on board as well. Too much time investment from too many people, and that is something that needs to be respected, in my opinion.

I really think that these things are just going to be a mobile base for the squadron - Repair, Rearming, Outfitting (from what you have deposited there), and hopefully Cartographics capability as well. I think they will just sit at the entry star, hopefully scooping fuel that you can then Refuel your ships from, until you dock, and tell it to go somewhere else. If you had one of these on an Exploration mission (a place to save your Cartographics Data and a Save Point), that would greatly open up the options for what kind of dangers that Frontier could place out in the black. Sign me up, please.

Any kind of large upkeep costs will also effectively lock out any solo players from ever having one of these, and I think that is something that Frontier should very carefully consider before deciding. I am hoping that you don't actually need to lead or be part of a Squadron to buy them, even if that means saving up a lot of credits over a long period of time.

Overall though, I did like your presentation, and the thought that went into it. +1

Riôt

Thanks. We have slightly different opinions I think. I feel as if there isn't enough consequence in the game. Not only that but players even feel the need to email support when they make a mistake to reinstate their loss. I think carriers should get damaged and how much they do or don't is directly tied to player skill.

On upkeep you don't have to hire crew. There would be a big initial cost and then you could just outfit the modules you need. Only upkeep is then the cost of damage. If you took on a mission that was just way too threatening you could dismiss the carrier very early, take very little damage at all and just fail the mission. Not too big a deal. The carrier could be dismissed at any time.

 

[andrak]

Very nice Andrak, I like all your ideas and particularly your presentation. Only place I might slightly differ is that the Carrier must take damage. By this I assume you mean significant damage. Only difference I might have is if a Carrier is well run and well winged, there might be a significant force available to repel attacks. As in WWII and carrier fleets there, it depends on how you deploy your resources! Small point only. +1 Sir.

Thanks very much.

I wasn't thinking significant damage. If your squadron are all epic pilots maybe it takes next to no damage at all.

 

[Space Dandy]

I like a lot of what you had to say - what we are going to get, though, isn't going to be that grandiose.

Not because Frontier can't deliver, but because they won't - and shouldn't. Some of the things are just too much, such as the incredible costs you outline for various things, and a number of the capabilities that you would like to see, and some of the things have logistics tied to them that sound really difficult to manage.

I actually don't think that the Carriers should have any combat capability, nor should they be attackable. Some situation where the Squadron isn't able to push back an NPC attack that is part of a mission (choose from a multitude of reasons), and now their Carrier is wrecked. No one is going to like the taste of that, and even the most hard-core Save Resetters would probably not be on board as well. Too much time investment from too many people, and that is something that needs to be respected, in my opinion.

I really think that these things are just going to be a mobile base for the squadron - Repair, Rearming, Outfitting (from what you have deposited there), and hopefully Cartographics capability as well. I think they will just sit at the entry star, hopefully scooping fuel that you can then Refuel your ships from, until you dock, and tell it to go somewhere else. If you had one of these on an Exploration mission (a place to save your Cartographics Data and a Save Point), that would greatly open up the options for what kind of dangers that Frontier could place out in the black. Sign me up, please.

Any kind of large upkeep costs will also effectively lock out any solo players from ever having one of these, and I think that is something that Frontier should very carefully consider before deciding. I am hoping that you don't actually need to lead or be part of a Squadron to buy them, even if that means saving up a lot of credits over a long period of time.

Overall though, I did like your presentation, and the thought that went into it. +1

Riôt

This very much this!

I also hope there will be no need to restock the carrier so you can then restock your ships or that would just kill it for exploration outside the bubble.

 

[Cosmo]

I actually don't think that the Carriers should have any combat capability, nor should they be attackable. Some situation where the Squadron isn't able to push back an NPC attack that is part of a mission (choose from a multitude of reasons), and now their Carrier is wrecked. No one is going to like the taste of that, and even the most hard-core Save Resetters would probably not be on board as well. Too much time investment from too many people, and that is something that needs to be respected, in my opinion.

Indestructible carriers would be boring and unrealistic. Carriers should have basic defense turrets which could be automated (and upgrade-able). Real-life carriers have extensive active and passive defenses such as sensors, missiles and Gatling guns.

If carriers are fully destructible then Frontier must decrease the grind to acquire and upgrade a carrier or people would get burned out.

If carriers can't be blown up, as the OP suggested in the video, they would automatically retreat (hyper-jump to safety) with a low hull. Or let high ranked squadron members decide. Then players need to grind to repair the carrier. It creates an endless cycle of utilizing, upgrading and repairing a carrier. Upgrades would eventually be maxed out.

This is what ED needs: end-game loops that can be replayed for months and years. The way squadrons utilize their carriers (exploration, combat, squadron missions, mining etc) adds variety.

 

[Henri]

I bet it has a gunner seat and a fighter seat

 

[andrak]

I bet it has a gunner seat and a fighter seat

No, arcade mode reserved for multipew only (semi joking) [money]

 

[Robert Maynard]

Not watched video (quiet house right now) - would the Carrier exist in all modes / platforms simultaneously?

 

[lysan]

Awesome suggestions, just one concern, the time to jump should not be hours, I don't think this will work, let the cool down be long but not the jump out time.

Indestructible carriers would be boring and unrealistic. Carriers should have basic defense turrets which could be automated (and upgrade-able). Real-life carriers have extensive active and passive defenses such as sensors, missiles and Gatling guns.

If carriers are fully destructible then Frontier must decrease the grind to acquire and upgrade a carrier or people would get burned out.

If carriers can't be blown up, as the OP suggested in the video, they would automatically retreat (hyper-jump to safety) with a low hull. Or let high ranked squadron members decide. Then players need to grind to repair the carrier. It creates an endless cycle of utilizing, upgrading and repairing a carrier. Upgrades would eventually be maxed out.

This is what ED needs: end-game loops that can be replayed for months and years. The way squadrons utilize their carriers (exploration, combat, squadron missions, mining etc) adds variety.

Auto jump to safety is a good idea.

 

[TieKnee]

Super concepts!!! well thought out... It would be nice to see this available for gameplay !! +1 rep.. thanks for your work on getting it done!

 

[MrFailfactory]

Thanks. We have slightly different opinions I think. I feel as if there isn't enough consequence in the game. Not only that but players even feel the need to email support when they make a mistake to reinstate their loss. I think carriers should get damaged and how much they do or don't is directly tied to player skill.

On upkeep you don't have to hire crew. There would be a big initial cost and then you could just outfit the modules you need. Only upkeep is then the cost of damage. If you took on a mission that was just way too threatening you could dismiss the carrier very early, take very little damage at all and just fail the mission. Not too big a deal. The carrier could be dismissed at any time.

I agree that there is indeed not enough consequence in the game, and this is underscored by the fact that Frontier seems to be pretty liberal about granting Mulligans for things that are the Commanders' own fault.

This is a big feature, and potentially game-changing in a good way. I am concerned, however, that people that prefer to play in Solo are going to be left hanging, and I really think that Frontier should consider whether or not doing so would be a good idea. I am also concerned about how the logistics of moving them will be handled, and whether or not the implementation of said movement is acceptable.

Also - epic fights around the Carrier would be fantastic. Again, I did like the majority of what you had to say, and I am looking forward to seeing how they get implemented.

Riôt

 

[Psy]

Yes really like the video, amazing work with the mock ups and all

The ELW migration mission is very cool

I really hope solo players can buy a fleet carrier, I want to fly mine out to the core and use it as an exploration base there

And let other explorers join my "squadron" if they also want to use it as an exploration base of operations.

Would love to see modules for outfitting ships, stellar cartographics, repair etc too. I am hoping for something along these lines

What would be really amazing is if you could choose to set your carrier as able to be used by all players, not just your squadron, so the players themselves can start engaging in some real emergent gameplay with people setting up carriers all over the galaxy anyone can stop in for repairs, have a new spawn point, change their outfitting, etc

What i really want to see is fleet carrier owners / squadrons able to turn a profit by offering these services to other players from their publicly available carrier (and after the very large investment in setting it all up)