Hardware & Technical Head Tracker?

One thing the Oculous Rift users need to be aware of, is how do they intend accessing their PC keyboards... when wearing that 'hard-ware' ? I'm sure that ED, will have a suitably large 'key-board' binding menu?

2 points...

1. Oculus are aware of the issue - I read something to that effect in a recent interview. So it's a given that they are looking into that for the consumer version.

2. The game will be playable to a great degree with an XBox controller... because that's what they want - you should be able to sit back and fly/fight just with the controller. So there should be no absolute reliance on a keyboard for the majority of the time. Typing messages might be a tad hard though! ;)
 
2. The game will be playable to a great degree with an XBox controller... because that's what they want - you should be able to sit back and fly/fight just with the controller. So there should be no absolute reliance on a keyboard for the majority of the time. Typing messages might be a tad hard though! ;)


This I like.
 
2 points...

1. Oculus are aware of the issue - I read something to that effect in a recent interview. So it's a given that they are looking into that for the consumer version.

That's some good news, I'm looking forward to seeing what they come up with there.

2. The game will be playable to a great degree with an XBox controller... because that's what they want - you should be able to sit back and fly/fight just with the controller. So there should be no absolute reliance on a keyboard for the majority of the time. Typing messages might be a tad hard though! ;)

This I like.

This I sorta like, but mainly I worry about...

The XBox 360 controller has, 2 analogue joysticks, 1 D Pad, 4 buttons, 2 Bumpers and 2 Triggers... You can also press the analogue sticks

So for some finger in the air guessing the controls for Elite could use the analogue sticks for roll and yaw, throttle and pitch. Basically movement around the universe.

The triggers would presumably be for guns and missiles. Then we'd need to have some kind of weapon selector for each of those, maybe on the corresponding bumpers?

Targeting Next, Previous and Subsystems could be maybe 3 of the buttons.
Firing off ecm (or those heat dumps we recently saw) would be very handy to do in combat too, so lets put that on button 4.

One of the buttons on the sticks could be for 'shifting gear' for supercruise or hyperspace and the other for bringing up the navigation screen.

We can maybe compromise on buttons some what, adding more abilities at the expense of convenience. I.E. We could get rid of the previous target button in place of say your afterburners. Or you can only fire guns OR missiles, which would free up 2 buttons at the cost of having to toggle a lot more in the heat of battle. You get the idea.


I've included some of the keyboard guides for other games, just for reference...
Elite Manual
Oolite controls
Frontier Controls
Wing Commander 1 Controls
Tie Fighter
Freespace 2

Looking through these, even Elite used most of the buttons on the keyboard. I have serious concerns about some how munging 30 or 40 needed controls into a use on a game pad. Imagine trying to escape from a pirate, manoeuvring so you don't get hit and then having to navigate through a series of radial menus to get to the galactic map (most likely using your analogue stick that you're using to stop yourself getting shot at) in order to hyperspace out. vs pressing 'm'. Now obviously you could have a button for your hyperspace map, but then you loose it for something else. Not only that, but we've not even thought about target friendly, hostile, closest attacking ship, most recent ship in the area (surprisingly handy that some ship with the weapons to destroy your escort has just shown up and you need to concentrate on getting them out of the sky).

Anyway you hopefully get the idea. combining all the features we need to fit on to a gamepad (or most joysticks) is an exercise in compromise and an extremely difficult design challenge. One that many people will find beneficial since I've no doubt that a lot of people (myself included) would far rather use a gamepad than mouse and keyboard. However that convenience comes at a cost, that I find myself unwilling to pay.

I would prefer to take a hand off the controller to quickly use my keyboard than being forced to navigate through radial menus.
I would prefer to take a hand off the controller to quickly use my keyboard than having to toggle round 20 more targets to get back to where I wanted. (or some other compromise)
I would prefer to take a hand off the controller to quickly use my keyboard than have Elite Dangerous dumbed down so that it only needs 11 controls.

Eid
 
I completely agree with you there Ben.

I'm thinking about how real pilots fly their planes currently. Humans have two hands...

Even in aircraft today, while cruising you don't need a hand on the flight stick or yoke at all times. The aircraft will be trimmed sufficiently to effectively fly itself.

Combat though is a different matter. I like you have played combat flight sims and I get along fine with a combination of joystick and keyboard. Complex combat flight sims would simply not be playable with a joypad.

Real combat pilots get along just fine with only two hands and they have a lot more controls than a qwerty keyboard to worry about. Granted they have extensive training.

I too am concerned that the advent of console gaming has dumbed down some games, and I think the control method has played a large part in this.

I think a player's brain will be trained very quickly regarding what keys do what function. With multi-function joysticks and numerous buttons on even cheap joysticks nowadays, I cant see the advantage of a joypad!
 
Two analogue sticks!?


What do you mean? A gamepad has 2 Analogue sticks? So do some joysticks, or the have a normal joystick for controlling pitch and yaw, a rudder for yaw and a throttle plus one or more 8 way hats?

Anyway not quite following you?
 
I have a TrackIR5 myself and it's really great ... i LOVE it! And use it for all kind of games. E.g. for several flight and racing sims.

I heard E:D will have Occulus Rift support so i hope they will add TrackIR too. That would be awesome!
 
+1 for trackIR

its so much more immersive and gives situational awareness.

I know its expensive, and you might think you only use it for 1 or 2 games. but it makes a difference - a huge one..
 
That TrackIR looks like a recipe for eye strain. You turn your head to look sideways, but then have to look back with your eyes in the opposite direction to actually see what's on your screen.

I'd rather stick with my multi-monitor setup to be honest.

Not at all.. you barely have to turn your head. You can set everything so you can turn your head a lot or very little. Its up to you.

In fact you don't turn your head more than a few inches to look behind if you wanted.

You get so used to it and it feels so natural after a couple days of using it you'll never want to go back.

Trust me.. trackIR is a MUST for this game.

Plus when it comes to combat it gave me a massive edge. Allowed me extreme situational awareness and made me really so much better in deciding how to manage my energy and keeping the target in view.
 
I searched for this topic but didn't find it. If there was already a thread on this please direct me.

---
Will ED support head tracking movement?

TrackIR can be configured to directly to the game and also take over the mouse, but the game has to support head movement.

I cannot stress how important it is to have smooth head movement when dog fighting and flying air sims.

Here's a link to TrackIR for those who haven't heard of such things.
http://www.naturalpoint.com/trackir/

Hopefully it will also support FaceTrackNoIR with a PS Eye Camera and CPU to handle the processing it can be cheap alternative...
 

Mike Evans

Designer- Elite: Dangerous
Frontier
Hopefully it will also support FaceTrackNoIR with a PS Eye Camera and CPU to handle the processing it can be cheap alternative...

So I tried this last night and unfortunately it resulted in something hijacking the POV Hat switch UP on my Saitek X52 joysticks meaning I couldn't rebind that input and the game, seeing POV Hat Up as a way to navigate the interface, constantly going up on any menus! Basically the virtual joystick FaceTrackNoIR creates which I can then bind to the head look controls is also reporting something else that the game thinks is pressing up on any menus.

The only way to fix it is to unbind that control but then that means you have an input you can never use for anything as it won't rebind. This probably has something to do with the fact the game doesn't distinguish between multiple joysticks present at the same time where as it can distinguish between an xbox 360 pad and joystick.
 
So I tried this last night and unfortunately it resulted in something hijacking the POV Hat switch UP on my Saitek X52 joysticks meaning I couldn't rebind that input and the game, seeing POV Hat Up as a way to navigate the interface, constantly going up on any menus! Basically the virtual joystick FaceTrackNoIR creates which I can then bind to the head look controls is also reporting something else that the game thinks is pressing up on any menus.

The only way to fix it is to unbind that control but then that means you have an input you can never use for anything as it won't rebind. This probably has something to do with the fact the game doesn't distinguish between multiple joysticks present at the same time where as it can distinguish between an xbox 360 pad and joystick.

I had the same problem, though when I flicked between the two tabs in control panel where you see the response to each joystick movement, it seems to free it up (difficult to describe better as in Afghanistan right now so not near my computer). However I noticed in the War Thunder control menu where you assign axes (rather than single movements) to axis movements of joysticks/virtual joysticks, it only recognised the axis movement and so disregarded this pov hat issue. Not sure what computer trickery is involved in this, however.
 
So I tried this last night and unfortunately it resulted in something hijacking the POV Hat switch UP on my Saitek X52 joysticks meaning I couldn't rebind that input and the game, seeing POV Hat Up as a way to navigate the interface, constantly going up on any menus! Basically the virtual joystick FaceTrackNoIR creates which I can then bind to the head look controls is also reporting something else that the game thinks is pressing up on any menus.

The only way to fix it is to unbind that control but then that means you have an input you can never use for anything as it won't rebind. This probably has something to do with the fact the game doesn't distinguish between multiple joysticks present at the same time where as it can distinguish between an xbox 360 pad and joystick.



Hi Mike,

I'll have a butchers regarding this when I get back, off-site at the moment. I will be back later tonight. I'll ask on the facetracknoir forums to see if anybody has a workaround.


Thanks
Haider
 
Back
Top Bottom