Newcomer / Intro Heat damage AFTER scooping.

[Rackmonkey]

As a licensed pilot and flight engineer i'd like to think I understand a little about thermal dynamics.

For the life of me I can't figure out how I can set in a sweet spot and scoop all day long and not get above 75 but the second I turn tail from that spot to leave the star and start moving away my temp goes way up into the danger zone. I've also noted that once you temp starts going up, you can't stop it. You increase your orbital path on the star and you don't start cooling, your temp still goes up and you start taking damage.

I understand there is no convection cooling in space but the minute you turn your engines to the star or move away from the radiant heat your temp should go down.

I want to see what everybody else think and maybe put this in as a bug report.

 

[Chris Simon]

That's weird. Maybe you just don't understand what the ship is doing in supercruise. Maybe you think you follow an orbit and don't decrease the distance but you actually do. Try targeting the star to see whether you really are moving away from it.

As you said, each ship has some inherrent maximal heat dissipation limit and if you match the incoming heat or keep below it, you won't overheat. When the incoming heat exceeds the max heat dissipation capability of your ship, you start overheating, the speed of overheating depends on the difference between incoming and outgoing heat, but you will keep overheating unless you return to the distance where the incoming heat is less than you're ship's max. So just turning around and starting to move away won't help, until you fly far enough.

If you want to experiment with this, try different ships, something with good radiators like Diamondback Explorer or Scout. It will give you some legroom as the scooping "window" widens.

 

[Rackmonkey]

It's legible.

I do ask you to believe that I know when I'm getting closer to or moving away from a star. I've been a pilot for 25 years with a little over 15K hours. I know when the houses are getting bigger and when they are getting smaller. (A pilots joke)
The star is directly behind me on my radar. I've reduced my exposed surface area and the only thing pointing at the star are my engines. I assume that that area can handle a little more heat than say...the cockpit.

 

[Chris Simon]

It's legible.

I do ask you to believe that I know when I'm getting closer to or moving away from a star. I've been a pilot for 25 years with a little over 15K hours. I know when the houses are getting bigger and when they are getting smaller. (A pilots joke)
The star is directly behind me on my radar. I've reduced my exposed surface area and the only thing pointing at the star are my engines. I assume that that area can handle a little more heat than say...the cockpit.

To my knowledge the amount of heat your ship is "taking" from the star is the same, no matter which part of your ship you point at it. So there is something else in play.
Do you say that you're sitting in a sweetspot (your heat doesn't rise above a certain percentage) and when you turn your ship away without any further movement, you start taking more heat?

 

[Alec Turner]

I really can't say I've ever noticed this. The closer I am to the star the hotter I get, when I turn and fly away I start to cool down again. The only thing I'd say is that the cooling down is not instantaneous. It feels a bit like the heat builds up (let's say the hull heats up) and then that heat slowly starts permeating through to the internals of the ship. So, as I start to turn away there may be a very short period where the heat I'm registering on my gauge and internals continues to rise (even tho' I'm now flying into a cooler area of space) but the rate at which that heat build up tails off and then start to drop back down again is much faster than if I continued to orbit the star at the same distance without turning away. Basically, like any heating system, there's some lag in the feedback loop.

 

[MickyG1982]

Are you charging your jump drive at the same time as moving away?

If so, that'll be why.

 

[Maenden]

If you were sitting in a 'sweet spot' for scooping it could be that you're not actually turning tail, i.e. directly away from the star, but are climbing away slower than the surface of the star is approaching.
Either along a tangent to the surface, as per the diagram, or along a parabola which does essentially the same thing.

I've also noticed that if you move in and then out of the heat globe then there is a delay in the temperature reporting. The energy collected drops while the temperature continues to rise for a short time.
I've always assumed that this is due to the temperature reported being the inside of the ship. So the exterior hull is hotter than the inside and it takes time for the heat to conduct inwards.

 

[Lankspeed]

Are you charging your jump drive at the same time as moving away?

If so, that'll be why.

Yea When Scooping i set the craft to scoop at about 75% scoop rate Keeping Throttle at 0%

When Full I open engines to Max and pitching up slightly increasing pitch.

Then as Temperature drops I engage the FSD.

Make sure SCOOP is closed before start charge.

This is with the Corvette and a Grade 6 Scoop.
Also works with a grade 4 scoop and Python.
Sorry for all the edits.

If FSD started before temp is below 75 degrees you started to soon.

 

[Lankspeed]

I will even do a Video to Demonstrate.

 

[Rackmonkey]

I'm sorry but radiant heat in space doesn't work that way. If you in the light, it's hot, if your in the shade it's cold. Check out the temps on the light and dark sides of Mercury. If you live in the desert you know this because it's always cooler the moment you step into the shade. You've blocked the radiant heat. We still have an atmosphere so it doesnt get cold like it does in space.

As far as sensor lag or heat buildup...Sensors are on the surface panels of the ship otherwise they would be worthless. And when a panel is not in the light, heating stops. The heat may not dissipate quickly but it doesn't continue to rise. You ever wonder why you can buy eject-able heat sinks for these ships?

 

[Rackmonkey]

You may be right. I remember doing just that. I'll run some experiments and see if thats what cousing my problem. it would explain why my temp is going up when I'm accelerating away.

 

[ArchAngelofDeath]

You may be right. I remember doing just that. I'll run some experiments and see if thats what cousing my problem. it would explain why my temp is going up when I'm accelerating away.

I don't jump to hyper space until I'm down to about 40% heat. FSD charging adds a lot of heat fast.

 

[Skip Rockbounder]

Worry not OP, I understand even if the rest don't, don't have a clue!

The thing I've noticed is, when you move/adjust course it's fires up the engines a bit... that increase in engine heat is noticeable, boosting in normal space will have a big increase as will firing up your cruise/Hyperspace drives, I don't believe you're making the mistake of still heading through the star's atmosphere or heading back towards the star because you're lost or can't fly, I think it's a just another game rule about something that doesn't exist in the Human world yet.

When I skim I do it at a run as I jump into a system I keep flat out and take the temp up to 80-85% (not degrees)* that normally serves me with what I used in the jump... then Jump (when the temp drops below 70%... the last thing you want is to enter the tunnel whilst you're overheating) and repeat


* and why in hells name haven't I got a 'deg' symbol on a generic keyboard? it would be much more use than a stupid 'hat' key

 

[FrankMurphy]

If you turn on orbit lines, fly around the star and use the orbit line/canopy object reference point to find where you can maximise intake and stabilise heat.

If you're an FAA pilot, you'll know there's no such thing as a pilot's licence

 

[Lankspeed]

Ok here is the Video of Me scooping with the Corvette. Grade 6A scoop. Big scoop in nasty system try not to be there to long. Also Scoop regular Every scoop-able star you come across.

Video Follows:

[video]http://www.mediafire.com/file/cxq0acfz2ckwt4l/Scoop.mp4[/video]

 

[Maenden]

Sensors are on the surface panels of the ship otherwise they would be worthless. ?

That can't be right - when the temperature rises you get internal damage . Lots of things bump the temp up.

There aren't two sets of sensor - one set for scooping and another for everything else.

 

[Rackmonkey]

If you turn on orbit lines, fly around the star and use the orbit line/canopy object reference point to find where you can maximise intake and stabilise heat.

If you're an FAA pilot, you'll know there's no such thing as a pilot's licence

You are correct. I have been certified to exercise the priviage of a pilot. Most people wouldent understand the difference so i just say license.

 

[Alec Turner]

As far as sensor lag or heat buildup...Sensors are on the surface panels of the ship otherwise they would be worthless. And when a panel is not in the light, heating stops. The heat may not dissipate quickly but it doesn't continue to rise. You ever wonder why you can buy eject-able heat sinks for these ships?

And yet, my explanation for the observed behaviour works while yours does not!

I'm not saying I'm right (what is "right" after all except for whatever system the game developers have chosen to model), I'm just saying it works for me.

 

[Xevyr]

I have noticed this as well both in my ASPEx and Python and the video on the previous page perfectly illustrates this.

While the game often times seems to have built-in fail triggers.. Like for example when you overshoot your destination in super-cruise.. that's just plain dumb and to me it seems like it's a fail-by-design (meaning that once you pass the threshold regardless of what you do, the game wants you to fail).. since no matter how much you throttle down, your speed will not be reduced until you already overshoot your target. Well guess what.. I switched targets in the middle of the overshoot to something far away and lord behold.. my ship instantly knew how to slow down once more

So one would think this is something similar as well.. You managed to stay close to the star for that long without burning? Well we'll fry you on the way out!

But no, my guess is that in this case it's actually legit and has to do more with gravity. The big red sun on the radar isn't an indicator of you being exposed to the heat of the star (You probably know that already, but I'm new to the game so I only realized it after a week or so), it's signaling you that you're caught in it's gravity and it's trying to pull you / crush you / slow you down. So hovering in it's orbit with 30km/s is one thing, but when you turn away and apply full throttle, it's understandable that your thrusters are working overtime to try to get you to your desired speed, even though the massive star is pulling you back.. So I think the excess heat is completely coming from the thrusters fighting gravity and not the star radiating heat. Same way you can sometimes overheat just by maneuvering around with the thrusters on landable planets with huge gravity.

Edit: you can do a simple experiment to test my theory if you want Find a big gas giant... get close enough to it in Supercruise till the radar shows it as a huge red object (same as when close to a star) and slow down.. turn away apply full throttle and see if your heat goes up.. if yes, then indeed it is simply from the thrusters fighting gravity. I'd expect it to go up a bit less though, since you don't have the base heat increase from the star that you could already dissipate while scooping

 

[Lankspeed]

I have noticed this as well both in my ASPEx and Python and the video on the previous page perfectly illustrates this.

While the game often times seems to have built-in fail triggers.. Like for example when you overshoot your destination in super-cruise.. that's just plain dumb and to me it seems like it's a fail-by-design (meaning that once you pass the threshold regardless of what you do, the game wants you to fail).. since no matter how much you throttle down, your speed will not be reduced until you already overshoot your target. Well guess what.. I switched targets in the middle of the overshoot to something far away and lord behold.. my ship instantly knew how to slow down once more

So one would think this is something similar as well.. You managed to stay close to the star for that long without burning? Well we'll fry you on the way out!

But no, my guess is that in this case it's actually legit and has to do more with gravity. The big red sun on the radar isn't an indicator of you being exposed to the heat of the star (You probably know that already, but I'm new to the game so I only realized it after a week or so), it's signaling you that you're caught in it's gravity and it's trying to pull you / crush you / slow you down. So hovering in it's orbit with 30km/s is one thing, but when you turn away and apply full throttle, it's understandable that your thrusters are working overtime to try to get you to your desired speed, even though the massive star is pulling you back.. So I think the excess heat is completely coming from the thrusters fighting gravity and not the star radiating heat. Same way you can sometimes overheat just by maneuvering around with the thrusters on landable planets with huge gravity.

Edit: you can do a simple experiment to test my theory if you want Find a big gas giant... get close enough to it in Supercruise till the radar shows it as a huge red object (same as when close to a star) and slow down.. turn away apply full throttle and see if your heat goes up.. if yes, then indeed it is simply from the thrusters fighting gravity. I'd expect it to go up a bit less though, since you don't have the base heat increase from the star that you could already dissipate while scooping

Yes. When I come out of FSD I slow the craft as I start to scoop I wait till the scoop gets to about 60% to 70% get the throttle to zero (30km/s).
You mentioned the planet landing and takeoff scenario now if you are too close to ground and increase speed THEN BOOST Temp goes up.
Could this also be an atmospheric effect?

I also tested your theory of approaching a station too fast. That was an interesting trick[big grin].

By the way was the Video helpful?