Exactly this, +1 CMDR. This is about his 'prey' escaping and him trying to prevent it, nothing more.
Hi FD, Any plans to check the game breaking Submit and Highwake issue? ( Its basically an exploit )
- Thread starter Majinvash
- Start date
This This ThisThis This ThisThis This ThisThis This ThisThis This ThisThis This ThisThis This ThisThis This ThisThis This ThisThis This ThisThis This ThisThis This ThisThis This ThisThis This This...did I mention THIS?!
This!
Also - surely any pirate wing worth its salt will contain at least one craft with a decent jump-range that means it can keep following via wakes and interdicting said target? Eventually they'll either submit or run out of fuel to HW out again and the rest of the wing can catch up and pew pew claim cargo?
Or is Maji's claim about wings purely one of having overwhelming firepower to take down lone targets and not really one about pirating effectively within the game mechanics?
All alternatives are flawed,but some alternatives are more flawed than others. - CMDR George Orwell
You can please some of the CMDRs all of the time, you can please all of the CMDRs some of the time, but you can’t please all of the CMDRs all of the time. - CMDR John Lydgate
Like the two wise men above,I can't see a mechanic that'll keep everyone happy,sorry.
(Apologies for the horrendous appropriation and misuse of other peoples words)
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And what then you "follow" them? The chance of getting their instance or the fact that they can highwake faster than your scan/jump makes it near impossible to catch them. Wake scanners are only good for NPCs you want to follow and kill. Any one could line up with the players vector and select a system until its in front of them to tell where they went. P2P Blows.
I explained on the first page why a wake scanner just doesn't work but I'll do it again: by the time you have scanned the wake, jumped and loaded into the new instance, the target has either dropped out of supercruise on the other side (meaning you will never see them again as you can't see low wakes that were created while you were not in the instance), hyperjumped away (same deal, you wont see the high wake as you weren't present at the time it was created) or plain switched to another game mode while you were on the loading screen.
Last time I checked, piracy is supposed to be a possible career in this game. I'm fairly sure just forcing the prey to jump away doesn't fit with what a player buying Elite Dangerous to conduct piracy or to be an assassin/bounty hunter should expect.
Neither should the expectations of the prey be that pirates shoot them on sight because the game mechanics make negotiating or even using limpets impossible.
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high wake escaping is a terrible mechanic that needs to be expunged. we were told we would get a normal space functionality to the interdictor that could counter this.. where is it?
people being able to moonwalk out of fights is the largest reason most pirates and PVPers shoot first without conversing.
people being able to moonwalk out of fights is the largest reason most pirates and PVPers shoot first without conversing.
You do not honestly believe that part of your post do you?, are you honestly trying to tell me and others that the 'shoot first' mindset of many commanders would change given a different implementation?
To an RP pirate yes. 100% from my perspective. I'd love to be able to pirate by my own code of conduct but that's impossible as it stands.
i used to comms first until i got highwaked by everybody. now i just go straight for the drive disable shot and blow their hatch, and send a warning message while firing.
most of my clan (the code) feel the same say. so yes, to answer your question it would change 'the mindset of many commanders'.
all of them? obviously not. there will always be gankers and people who just want to kill in this game, just like in any other MP game. they can be dealt with in differant ways that are outside the scope of this thread.
That is exactly what would happen in my case.
Some targets I interdict and know I have some wiggle room because my TTK (including a full speed ram) is low enough to not let them run away even if we're having a little chat. But some targets I know will be able to just high wake unless I commit absolutely to disabling them right away. That means obviously shooting first, before they even get a chance to offer to surrender (unsurprisingly, these are the ones guilty of combat logging the most.) Often this isn't even enough and they manage to highwake anyway (and with the terrible transition times you sometimes enter the instance just in time to see your prey jumping in a flash).
Keep in mind these are trading ships, so in theory pretty bad at defending themselves or running away. Now try and imagine what the odds of any bounty hunter catching a pirate clipper would be. During the Kaushpoos CGs I had two wings of bounty hunters on my tail, and at their best they were an annoyance, not a threat.
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Speaking as a newer player who has decided to primarily do bounty hunting, I have to agree with all the people saying that this system of highwaking and combat logging makes it frustrating to deal with any wanted player that I can't kill in a few seconds. It's especially frustrating because as someone piloting a smaller ship (viper mkiii) with less than optimal modules I really can't kill anyone except for much smaller ships and poorly equipped ships before they are able to combat log or hw, and apparently every wanted player in a ship bigger than a sidewinder or eagle knows these tricks. I got this game with the intention of being a bounty hunter and using the bounty listings to hunt down pirate players but right now it seems pointless to do that if anyone can just combat log or hw away and drop into solo mode.
My second point, and I guess this is more of a question, is why would you play in open is you aren't looking to interact with random players? Excuse my ignorance but if you wanted to have the elite experience without worrying about player pirates or player bounty hunters couldn't you just play solo? Even if you wanted to play with your friends this way isn't that what private groups and private servers are for? Maybe I'm not understanding this or open play has something that private and solo play don't offer besides potential player conflict but to me the whole appeal of open play was the idea that I might come into conflict with other players.
My second point, and I guess this is more of a question, is why would you play in open is you aren't looking to interact with random players? Excuse my ignorance but if you wanted to have the elite experience without worrying about player pirates or player bounty hunters couldn't you just play solo? Even if you wanted to play with your friends this way isn't that what private groups and private servers are for? Maybe I'm not understanding this or open play has something that private and solo play don't offer besides potential player conflict but to me the whole appeal of open play was the idea that I might come into conflict with other players.
The potential for player conflict is great. But the mechanics force crappy player behaviour. The 'Elite experience' for me is meeting interacting with random people in my adventures. The actual experience is almost exclusively ganking, but the 1/10 times I meet someone who doesn't shoot on sight makes the rest worth it. Barely.
I want pirates and bounty hunters to try to kill me. It's fun. I get myself wanted so I can flee from Authority ships, and I'm totally happy to die when I have an opportunity to press the target button before I get blown up. I don't want Majinvash to kill me 15 times in an hour because he's sitting outside a station, in a wing, waiting to interdict noobs and pin them with four railguns in the first moment. That's not a game, it's a save loading sim.
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I decided to look up what combat logging is (when did it stop being ragequit?), and it turns out I was constant combat logger until I figured out the high shift. In order to have even mild fun in Elite, end task was my constant companion. It's never occurred to me to do that in another game. I'm always happy to take my punishment. But not in this. It's not hard, or punishing, it's just boring. There might as well be a off screen RNG/countdown that decides when my ship explodes. Well, before I learned the high shift. =]
I want pirates and bounty hunters to try to kill me. It's fun. I get myself wanted so I can flee from Authority ships, and I'm totally happy to die when I have an opportunity to press the target button before I get blown up. I don't want Majinvash to kill me 15 times in an hour because he's sitting outside a station, in a wing, waiting to interdict noobs and pin them with four railguns in the first moment. That's not a game, it's a save loading sim.
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I decided to look up what combat logging is (when did it stop being ragequit?), and it turns out I was constant combat logger until I figured out the high shift. In order to have even mild fun in Elite, end task was my constant companion. It's never occurred to me to do that in another game. I'm always happy to take my punishment. But not in this. It's not hard, or punishing, it's just boring. There might as well be a off screen RNG/countdown that decides when my ship explodes. Well, before I learned the high shift. =]
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Majinvash
Banned
So giving you are not trolling
You no longer need to combat log because you know how to high wake out instead?
M'lord, I rest my case.
Cheque please
Majinvash
The Voice of Open
lmao. Wow.
The prosecution rests.
The prosecution rests.
So let's see if I have this logic down correctly. People are high waking away from bad guys. The bad guys find this distressing and want the capability changed, more in their favor. So they can catch more good guys. And expect the good guys to just say 'Thank you sir, can I have another!'.
Ok, I'm in, devs please, make this happen with the next patch! I like where this is going!
Ok, I'm in, devs please, make this happen with the next patch! I like where this is going!
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To be fair I do think ideas like the one posited in the "KILLERS" thread in this forum are also good ones, senseless griefing is no fun for anyone besides the griefers. It's just that I think having a "get out of jail" free card via combat logging or hw isn't the solution and actually hurts the game.
Yes, see, griefers cause grief. I didn't pay money for grief. If RP'ing pirates were what they claimed, I'd stop. But the two times someone said 'cut your engines I want your stuff', I got blown up after releasing my cargo. I don't see a reason to waste my time and money on boring liars. I'm glad you rested your case, it's silly. You're the biggest toughest kid on the playground moaning because the other kids can run faster. Sorry, not other kids. I meant preppies.
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Also Majin, maybe stop complaining at 'git gud' at catching people.
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High waking has reduced a significant amount of cheating.
That's an excellent point mon frere!
Can I rest my case next to yours?
Hey, Majin, what's your solution to people sitting at the mailslot and pinning everyone with railguns? Mine is shifting out, so I don't have to wait for the pirates to go to sleep to get out of the station. I just left Nu, after being killed twice by campers outside Nappis mailslot. What would you have done?
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