I just move on, losing a kill equals no loss. Just another person playing their game.
How do you deal with combat logging?
- Thread starter KiNETiCA
- Start date
- Status
If it went legal the EULA states that Frontier can do as they choose and reserve the right to restrict your access to the game. Not even read the EULA properly but almost all digital distribution works that way these days including steam. Not saying it's right but proof wouldn't be needed by FD, it'd highly likely be a case closed move along, you pressed agree and can technically still play just without other players.
As for the data capture it's probably a case of needing to know which of the 2 million units sold they need to look at and it's probably not a big red flag that says "combat logged". It's probably a bit of code that says "connection lost from server to client". It's when that bit of data is combined with the 30 other times it happened and when investigated that the client (player) got below X% hull strength or started loosing before "connection lost" then it turns from data into proof.
In the end a single event, or even multiple events as you say could be just random data. If they put a "if connection lost = 40+ then ban" code in they'd catch a lot of innocent players in there. Some players leave via Alt+F4 or task-kill or whatever due to bugs, some do it because it's a faster way to get to desktop especially on older machines if they need to exit in a hurry.
Similarly if they had "if connection lost = 40+ then flag for investigation" then FD would probably have a few thousand reports a month to look at.
Better PR to use player made reports with cmdr names to narrow down the worst perpetrators vs other players and deal with them on a case by case basis rather than going Blizzard on it and banning a whole bunch of people in one big sweep. Means when they take the time to investigate each instance of "connection lost" it's much more likely it'll be a result rather than spending man-hours investigating for a "ah it was just an accident".
Last edited:
HAHA Hilarious. As long as that works both ways. You kill x number unarmed ships. You are banned. EH Not so hot an idea old son.
Last edited:
Only if killing unarmed ships is deemed a breaking of the game rules.
Combat logging - I.e. Using out of game tools for in game benefits is categorically against the rules and is fairly obvious. Therefore it can be actioned.
Killing unarmed ships isn't currently deemed breaking the rules, it's entirely in game and there is no statement anywhere by FDev saying that it's not allowed.
Harassment as defined by Frontier on the other hand is breaking the rules and can again be actioned.
"Morally reprehensible" and "against the rules" are different things.
Spawncamping in online games is a similar scenario. It's not cheating like using an aimbot or health/damage hacks and other cheats which can be actioned by the developers. The individual server admins may kick spawncampers but the owners of the game can't because it's arguably a part of it. They just put things in place like invulnerability for 3 seconds or whatever to deal with it. As Elite should with a karma system and/or crime + punishment.
Last edited:
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Indeed - in the words of Support: "If you don't report, we can't support".
Almost makes me wanna jump in open to submit and leave ye in the dust or just use the legal disconnect as soon as I see the interdict appear to start more flaming.
Thank you for the reply, good answers.
If it does come down to it having to be reported by others CMDRs, and requiring excess amount of logging to be done before the logging is deemed intentional, than even wanton combat loggers really don't have much to worry about. As you said, better PR might get it reported more often but I still don't think it will get reported that often. My non forum/reddit friends who play ED aren't even aware of combat logging being a problem in ED. I was playing for over a year before using the forums, same thing - I didn't know it was an issue.
Maybe they just need to partner with an anti cheat outfit, get a VAC type system in the background?
Last edited:
LOL There is no cheat when they log, you lost nothing cept the thrill of the kill.
I haven't been combat logged. Follow the convo
Just wondering if it's something they could ever technically police. And I refer to it as cheating, simply because if you try and do what the game requires - it doesn't let you log out in combat - so you are cheating the system we're playing in.
Last edited:
I can usually resist the temptation to log, so basically, I deal with the "problem" by just not doing it.
Oh, you meant other people doing it... Hmm, don't see how it'd affect me, so I don't care. It's an extremely minor thing really, and easily avoided by not engaging unwilling opponents.
Oh, you meant other people doing it... Hmm, don't see how it'd affect me, so I don't care. It's an extremely minor thing really, and easily avoided by not engaging unwilling opponents.
Just report them, including as much detail as possible, then block them.
It's not remotely perfect, and little usually comes of it, but some of the more blatant types do seem to get a slap on the wrist from time to time.
Even basic telemetry should reveal when and how frequently disconnections occur and since I never file out-of-game reports without significant video evidence (which often includes admissions of guilt, if not outright braggadocio about it), things are usually pretty clear when it comes to habitual offenders.
Being in the same area?
Out of sight, maybe out of mind, but not out your game.
Disconnecting uncleanly is definitely cheating.
As for 'loss'...if this game had a functional economy, attrition would apply, where an enemies' loss is your gain. It would actually be possible to deter others or otherwise shape their behavior, by inflicting penalties on them and making it too costly to carry through with disagreeable actions. Indeed, in the not too distant past, you could cause your foes to quit the field by expending the funds they had set aside for rebuys...hard to do that now... and impossible to do if they are willing to cheat out of consequences.
It's not remotely perfect, and little usually comes of it, but some of the more blatant types do seem to get a slap on the wrist from time to time.
Even basic telemetry should reveal when and how frequently disconnections occur and since I never file out-of-game reports without significant video evidence (which often includes admissions of guilt, if not outright braggadocio about it), things are usually pretty clear when it comes to habitual offenders.
Being in the same area?
Out of sight, maybe out of mind, but not out your game.
Disconnecting uncleanly is definitely cheating.
As for 'loss'...if this game had a functional economy, attrition would apply, where an enemies' loss is your gain. It would actually be possible to deter others or otherwise shape their behavior, by inflicting penalties on them and making it too costly to carry through with disagreeable actions. Indeed, in the not too distant past, you could cause your foes to quit the field by expending the funds they had set aside for rebuys...hard to do that now... and impossible to do if they are willing to cheat out of consequences.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
The game does let the player log out in combat - using the delayed exit menu.
Sandro mentioned combat logging as one behaviour that might be taken into consideration if the potential karma system is implemented.
Right, splitting hairs there, Im confident you knew exactly what I meant... THAT, vs killing a process from your task manager, in case you're still unsure what i mean
Last edited:
Right, splitting hairs there, Im confident you knew exactly what I meant... THAT, vs killing a process from your task manager, in case you're still unsure what i mean
How do you, as a player, tell the difference?
How many 'Report Player' buttons have been hit consequent to this very act of logging off via the 15-sec timer?
Me? I don't, I can't. I've never been combat logged on, if that's the right way to word it. That's why I posed the questions... I wondered how much is evidence based, and how much is based on what others 'report.'
Last edited:
Once someone has seen it done both ways more than a few times, identifying the difference between use of the menu and a lost connection is pretty easy.
The most obvious difference is that someone who leaves via the menu takes damage right up until the moment they vanish and vanishes pretty much 15 seconds after they stop shooting/maneuvering, while someone who loses connection almost immediately stops taking damage and looks like they are frozen in their last act/on their last course until they time out, which doesn't have a very consistent delay, but rarely takes 15 seconds.
Tons of them...which is fine, because Frontier can see that they used the menu and will thus ignore any reports of cheating for that incident.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Right, splitting hairs there, Im confident you knew exactly what I meant... THAT, vs killing a process from your task manager, in case you're still unsure what i mean
No splitting hairs at all - you stated "it doesn't let you log out in combat" when it, i.e. the game, does indeed let any player who so chooses log out at any time (subject to a delay when "in danger").
It's not cheating to "look for a crew" during battle. [big grin]
Try to think as if you were just fighting a hologram.
"The princess is in another castle."
Try to think as if you were just fighting a hologram.
"The princess is in another castle."
It's good you managed to decipher my enigmatic code. It will definitely help anyone in the thread who has never played Elite.
Its a small galaxy...
- Status