I dislike the Engineer changes...

h347h

h347h
But I will live, the more grindy version is annoying for some people like me who use a lot of different ships but over time it will be okay. My 2 cents from someone who doesn't like the changes.

Edit:
Also moving goal posts on what the 'best' is one of the more annnoying aspects of the change. This has happened before as well and really feels like you are wasting the time of players who worked to get things like thrusters modded out close to the limit only to have that limit moved.
 
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andrak

andrak
Rennard said:
You haven't even tried them yet. Give them a chance.

Aversion to Change is human nature.....fight it!
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You don't need to have tried them to understand the logic of the change.

Now - rep up to g5 once

Coming - effectively rep up every individual module to g5
 

Old Duck

Old Duck
h347h said:
But I will live, the more grindy version is annoying for some people like me who use a lot of different ships but over time it will be okay. My 2 cents from someone who doesn't like the changes..
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I've got to give you credit for making this short and sweet, because I've given way more than 2 cents (more like 2 million dollars) regarding my dislike. I think I'm bankrupt now, LOL.
 

Shiro Akai

Shiro Akai
Have constructive feedback - play beta, taste the changes and then voice your opinion. If lots of people will report that new system is more grindy then *maybe*, just maybe FDEV will reconsider.

I'm personally cautious about stating anything about new changes. Not enough data.
 

Bob McBobblehead

Bob McBobblehead
So far I am liking all the changes in this update, but will reserve my final judgement until I've played the beta for a week or two. My only disappointment is that the Chieftain is another combat ship, was hoping for a multi-role or explorer ship. Can't begrudge PvPers and people who like combat a ship, I just wish FDev would give explorers some ship love.
 

h347h

h347h
Max Factor said:
How. Grinding for all those G5 mats will get most if not all the lower grade mats as you look. It will be the same or a minimal amount more grind to get your modules.
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Because I could just go straight for those G5 mats, avoid the rest, and spend way less time modding out a new ship or build. Now.i have to get mats for every rank which will require me doing different things for every single module. I only needed 12 rolls for 8 good or great shield boosters for my Type-10. That is going to change hands down with the way they have said that won't be the case anymore.
 

kepler84

K
I think it will depend.

It will be way less grindy to obtain an optimal loadout, but far more grindy to obtain a decent G5 one.

My opinion? I like it because it's more deterministic, and the old one was a bit too random for my taste.

Even if the whole process becomes more grindy, I hope the guaranteed progression combined with the new mats broker and the expanded inventory will make the whole thing more engaging.
 

jasonbirder

J
Pretty sure Frontier originally intended Engineered Modules to be acquired Gradually as people obtained Materials organically through their normal activities...
I think they overlooked the possibility that INSTANTLY a proportion of the Player Bade would go out and do whatever in game gymnastics were needed to acquire a large number of rolls (to maximize effect) on G5 Upgrades for ALL or nearly ALL of their Modules...
Isn't this kind of nudging us back towards the original intention of slower more organic acquisition of Engineered modules?
 

h347h

h347h
Max Factor said:
How. Grinding for all those G5 mats will get most if not all the lower grade mats as you look. It will be the same or a minimal amount more grind to get your modules.
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Gathering grade 5 mats doesn't mean you will get the mats required for the lower tier upgrades. Sometimes it takes a different activity, some times the grade 3 and 4 mats are HARDER to get than the grade 5 mats.

Also some lower tier mats will require you to do another activity you don't necessarily have to do now.

Again I will live but I just wanted to give my feedback as with out even testing this I know it will be more grindy.
 

h347h

h347h
jasonbirder said:
Pretty sure Frontier originally intended Engineered Modules to be acquired Gradually as people obtained Materials organically through their normal activities...
I think they overlooked the possibility that INSTANTLY a proportion of the Player Bade would go out and do whatever in game gymnastics were needed to acquire a large number of rolls (to maximize effect) on G5 Upgrades for ALL or nearly ALL of their Modules...
Isn't this kind of nudging us back towards the original intention of slower more organic acquisition of Engineered modules?
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It was never organic. Every one would always have to do something they normally don't do to get materials.
 

jasonbirder

J
It was never organic. Every one would always have to do something they normally don't do to get materials.
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IF you wanted to get Hi-Grade Engineering Mods and a good proportion of your modules...

If you did a mix of Combat, Missions, Mining, Surface Prospecting and investigating USS etc...you'd have a wide range of materials without stepping outside your normal activities (If you're very narrowly focused maybe a different story) The issue isn't organically acquiring a variety of Engineering materials - its acquiring the Materials needed for numbers of G5 rolls on different modules...

I was always under the impression that Engineered Modules were supposed to be outliers...not the NEW NORM...and that they never intended to see people in ships with G5's across the board...
I think that was unexpected...they underestimated the propensity to min/max stats across a proportion of the player base...
 

h347h

h347h
jasonbirder said:
IF you wanted to get Hi-Grade Engineering Mods and a good proportion of your modules...

If you did a mix of Combat, Missions, Mining, Surface Prospecting and investigating USS etc...you'd have a wide range of materials without stepping outside your normal activities (If you're very narrowly focused maybe a different story) The issue isn't organically acquiring a variety of Engineering materials - its acquiring the Materials needed for numbers of G5 rolls on different modules...

I was always under the impression that Engineered Modules were supposed to be outliers...not the NEW NORM...and that they never intended to see people in ships with G5's across the board...
I think that was unexpected...they underestimated the propensity to min/max stats across a proportion of the player base...
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Engineered modules we're the new norm for open players the week engineers launched.

Maxed grade 5 will be the new norm the week after this launches. That is just how these things work.

I don't know if you play with a lot of other people but pretty much everyone know has almost all grade 5 modded out ships.
 
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jasonbirder

J
I don't dispute that...i'm just suggesting it was an unintended consequence...I've long argued that they should make the acquisition of Mats/Unlock of Engineers MORE unpredictable (my preferred method would each individual roll having a random material requirement...so you couldn't load up on say a dozen pharmaceutical Isolators and come back and roll 12 g5 dirty drives...it might include Pharmaceutical Isolators one time...Precipitated Alloys the next, Exquisite Focus Crystals the next...so you could never "Roll-Stack")

There original introduction of Engineering was couched in terms that made it plain they thought it would be slow acquisition over time...not a race to get maxed out G5s on every module...
 

Rennard

R
h347h said:
Gathering grade 5 mats doesn't mean you will get the mats required for the lower tier upgrades. Sometimes it takes a different activity, some times the grade 3 and 4 mats are HARDER to get than the grade 5 mats.

Also some lower tier mats will require you to do another activity you don't necessarily have to do now.

Again I will live but I just wanted to give my feedback as with out even testing this I know it will be more grindy.
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In this scenario it will be even easier in the new system. If you can get a G5 material easily and the G3/4 material is of the same type then take it to the Material Trader. you will get many more of the one you want for the easy G5 you have gathered.

If you don't want to do the activity to get a specific material then do an alternative activity to get a lower or higher grade material of the same type and trade.

The new system adds much more flexibility.
 
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