PvP. PvP never changes.
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I agree, it would be great if FDev would make this sorts of tools available in game and also outside the game.
If FDev started to look at stuff Fuel rats do and what tools they would need to operate using ingame functions (that does not exist yet), but if that done, then FDev would have a good framework for all sorts of game play activities to be coordinated, that would not be locked to just friends/wing/squadrons activities. Think how cool it could be if players could arrange a SRV race and players could sign up and read on the event using these tools, both ingame and outside the game. What about CMDR's seeking "escorts" in gangerous areas, like CG's, or CMDR's wanting to offer escorts?
I was teasing Old Duck. xD
That last one is impossible unfortunately. There is nothing I can do as a pro pvper to protect a paper ship from another pro pvper, much as I would want to. If the other player hangs around after destroying aforementioned paper ship then I'll destroy them, but they usually don't. I can't kill the enemy before it kills the hauler and I can't finish them off fast enough to prevent them waking out. Occasionally, the innocent ship has enough engineering to survive for long enough to put up some defense and then I have time to make them think better of it, but if that's the case, then they also don't really need an escort. It's a bit of a conundrum, really, we've looked into how we can offer this service (escorts on demand), and of course there's no easy way to do that either.
I totally understand that, but that is part of the thing, not only could these sort of "forum" have a training area on how to better protect yourself so that you do not fly around in sthip hold together with strings and paper. as there is no point in trying to escort such ships. But people need to learn, and leaning by getting blown up tend not to be the most fun experiences with a cargohold full of stuff. Of course with engineering it get easier to, but just some more common sense builds with "stock" modules can improve things alot, especially when comparing to the maximum cargo no shields builds some like to run, which I personaly think is stupid regardless of game mode.
I and I do get that you would not need the escort if you know what you are doing part too, as I alwys like to fly prepared... so my lumbering Type-9 can hold its own against a Krait fragbuild for over a minute. So that gives me plenty of time to escape, but then teaming up with some escort to show the "pirate" their error could be quite fun. Just having the option and tools to do it could give us so much potential adhoc game play together.
Nothing about ED is designed in a way to make compelling, attractive and easily accessible PvP outside of CQC. Infinity Battlescape is designed from the very first minute as a PvP game. Its no criticism of ED, but its a bit like muzing whether its better to buy PES2020 to play a game of online football instead of using a third-party multiplayer mod in skyrim and kicking a cabbage around.
People who need educated need to join squadrons, ask on forums and be prepared for the engineer grind. That's 3 out of 3 things that most casuals will simply claim they do not want to do. Resistance to playing the game as intended, is one of the big enablers of griefing. We who pvp seriously, have to endure monstrous battles of attrition due to the hugely inflated defense values caused by engineering. Why did they do this? So that even a hauler can defend themselves long enough to survive the gank. Obviously it boils my blood in the extreme when people in unengineered ships claim that engineering has enabled 'death boats'. The idiots need to realise that if they just did some engineering, WHICH WAS ADDED FOR THEM, they wouldn't need to feel vulnerable or puke tons of salt when their muppetry is exposed. Grrrr. Sorry for minor rant.
See, this is why I'm not well suited for your squadron, because I don't believe this. I had great fun escorting a trader over the weekend, and we did indeed repel attacks. She was in a modestly-armed Conda and I was in a modestly-engineered Vulture. Yet we did it. Thus, not impossible.
You any many others live in this extreme meta pro-league eSports world, but a surprising number of players are more casual, like myself, the person I was escorting, and apparently the griefer that attacked us. I find your world of "that's impossible" to be boring and sad. Just like I find Phisto's "you CANNOT fly shieldless" world to be boring and sad. That's why I did most of my PvP this weekend in a shieldless Hauler, because I find the "pro PvP" meta to be boring and sad and repetitive and boring (as someone else stated earlier in this thread). This is why I don't belong in your squadron.
Now if there's a Squadron out there where players all fly Sidewinders or Vipers, where we go out in two wings of 4 loaded with torpedoes and launch a wave of 16 / 32 torpedoes at a griefa-Cutter and see what happens (screw what the experts say), then sign me up! Heck, I might even join Discord to be part of this band of misfit out-of-the-box thinkers
You just don't understand because you don't have enough experience. One quiet night in Diso is not indicative of the state of pvp my friend. I'm not talking down to you, just telling you how it is as someone who lives it daily.See, this is why I'm not well suited for your squadron, because I don't believe this. I had great fun escorting a trader over the weekend, and we did indeed repel attacks. She was in a modestly-armed Conda and I was in a modestly-engineered Vulture. Yet we did it. Thus, not impossible.
You any many others live in this extreme meta pro-league eSports world, but a surprising number of players are more casual, like myself, the person I was escorting, and apparently the griefer that attacked us. I find your world of "that's impossible" to be boring and sad. Just like I find Phisto's "you CANNOT fly shieldless" world to be boring and sad. That's why I did most of my PvP this weekend in a shieldless Hauler, because I find the "pro PvP" meta to be boring and sad and repetitive and boring (as someone else stated earlier in this thread). This is why I don't belong in your squadron.
Now if there's a Squadron out there where players all fly Sidewinders or Vipers, where we go out in two wings of 4 loaded with torpedoes and launch a wave of 16 / 32 torpedoes at a griefa-Cutter and see what happens (screw what the experts say), then sign me up! Heck, I might even join Discord to be part of this band of misfit out-of-the-box thinkers
You stated yourself why your example has absolutely no relevance whatsoever to what I said (my trader was in a conda). A reasonably well outfitted and very basically engineered conda can survive most ganks for long enough for an escort to get stuck in, especially if the gankers are rubbish. What you do is exactly the same thing we do, wing up and wait to be attacked by outlaws, that's got nothing to do with 'escorting' CG traders, taht's just a label you put on it. Next time you successfully defend a shieldless T9 from a wing of 4 (even crap tier) gankers, please be sure to get that on video and I'll eat my hat.
Additionally, I'd love to see you try that in a regular hotspot like deciat, shinny or wyrd, where the middle to high tier groups hang around in STRONG wings. You'd both have been blown up in seconds.
I think you've mis-understood what Ash was saying.See, this is why I'm not well suited for your squadron, because I don't believe this. I had great fun escorting a trader over the weekend, and we did indeed repel attacks. She was in a modestly-armed Conda and I was in a modestly-engineered Vulture. Yet we did it. Thus, not impossible.
You any many others live in this extreme meta pro-league eSports world, but a surprising number of players are more casual, like myself, the person I was escorting, and apparently the griefer that attacked us. I find your world of "that's impossible" to be boring and sad. Just like I find Phisto's "you CANNOT fly shieldless" world to be boring and sad. That's why I did most of my PvP this weekend in a shieldless Hauler, because I find the "pro PvP" meta to be boring and sad and repetitive and boring (as someone else stated earlier in this thread). This is why I don't belong in your squadron.
Now if there's a Squadron out there where players all fly Sidewinders or Vipers, where we go out in two wings of 4 loaded with torpedoes and launch a wave of 16 / 32 torpedoes at a griefa-Cutter and see what happens (screw what the experts say), then sign me up! Heck, I might even join Discord to be part of this band of misfit out-of-the-box thinkers
Not all PvPers "live in this extreme meta pro-league eSports world"...some do, some don't. If I lived in this world then I wouldn't be flying a Vulture.
I wouldn't class other peoples styles as "sad" though....just different. You can fly how you want and with what ever loadout you want. There are no rules.
As I mentioned before, joining Hutton Truckers may be more up your street and provide meaningful support for their trucking and role playing game style. Even if you do join a Squad you're not forced to participate in events....but it's worth noting that most Squads do use external tools, like Facebook, Teamspeak or Discord...that's something you're always going to have to deal with.
You would like my friend Devil then, constantly messing around with Sidewinders, trying all sorts of ideas, and we have fun, just messing around in whacky builds. But we do not do PvP or use Discord, we are so archaic that we still use Teamspeak... but we do whacky outside the box sidewinders and stuff... and some (many) of them fail in spectacular ways!See, this is why I'm not well suited for your squadron, because I don't believe this. I had great fun escorting a trader over the weekend, and we did indeed repel attacks. She was in a modestly-armed Conda and I was in a modestly-engineered Vulture. Yet we did it. Thus, not impossible.
You any many others live in this extreme meta pro-league eSports world, but a surprising number of players are more casual, like myself, the person I was escorting, and apparently the griefer that attacked us. I find your world of "that's impossible" to be boring and sad. Just like I find Phisto's "you CANNOT fly shieldless" world to be boring and sad. That's why I did most of my PvP this weekend in a shieldless Hauler, because I find the "pro PvP" meta to be boring and sad and repetitive and boring (as someone else stated earlier in this thread). This is why I don't belong in your squadron.
Now if there's a Squadron out there where players all fly Sidewinders or Vipers, where we go out in two wings of 4 loaded with torpedoes and launch a wave of 16 / 32 torpedoes at a griefa-Cutter and see what happens (screw what the experts say), then sign me up! Heck, I might even join Discord to be part of this band of misfit out-of-the-box thinkers
I do like the way you're thinking. Even despite our past grievances, I have to call you a Real PvPer.See, this is why I'm not well suited for your squadron, because I don't believe this. I had great fun escorting a trader over the weekend, and we did indeed repel attacks. She was in a modestly-armed Conda and I was in a modestly-engineered Vulture. Yet we did it. Thus, not impossible.
You any many others live in this extreme meta pro-league eSports world, but a surprising number of players are more casual, like myself, the person I was escorting, and apparently the griefer that attacked us. I find your world of "that's impossible" to be boring and sad. Just like I find Phisto's "you CANNOT fly shieldless" world to be boring and sad. That's why I did most of my PvP this weekend in a shieldless Hauler, because I find the "pro PvP" meta to be boring and sad and repetitive and boring (as someone else stated earlier in this thread). This is why I don't belong in your squadron.
Now if there's a Squadron out there where players all fly Sidewinders or Vipers, where we go out in two wings of 4 loaded with torpedoes and launch a wave of 16 / 32 torpedoes at a griefa-Cutter and see what happens (screw what the experts say), then sign me up! Heck, I might even join Discord to be part of this band of misfit out-of-the-box thinkers
o7
I didn't mean to imply that people who fly meta FDLs are sad, but rather that if I myself am forced to fly a specific meta in order to PvP, that would make me sad. Thankfully I'm not forced to do this, which is one of the reasons I have no interest in joining a "pro" PvP Squadron.
I'm not on Facebook, LOL. I only have to deal with it if I choose to. I shouldn't have to in order to enjoy PvP in this game. I've been gaming since forever, and I've never had to use external tools to enjoy PvP in any other game I've owned over these many years. Thus taking me back to my OP.
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I don't fly meta fdl and I'm one of the better pilots in the game. I too hate the sheepery (I just made that word up, I like it!), which is why my main is usually a challenger, though I must confess wing meta has forced me into a shield tank, but then again I've never seen a mamba outfitted like mine, except one feller who copied my build, and I'm fine with that. You really do have some incorrect preconceptions about pvp in elite, promise.
Edit: Woka here, and several other players in gard, do a good line in using unconventional means to overcome the Meta (Woka mentioned he mains a VULTURE, a small ship) . Theorycrafting is what we do, as you've seen me state before, probably. You'd be amazed how many builds are viable if you are willing to learn a different flying style and do some minmaxing in order to use them optimally. It takes smarts and creativity, a very rewarding part of the game for me.
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Me and you both!
We are not forced to do this either
You can fly what you want, kitted out how you want....there are no strict rules in this regard.
I'm sure some Squads may enforce rules like that though.
Well I do respect your stealth ship. Still, let's agree to disagree on the notion that joining a Discord-based Squadron is the answer for ME, and instead get back to the bigger premise of the OP. Would you not like to see more in-game based PvP events like CGs that revolve around combat zones or purposeful piracy / smuggling and the counters of bounty hunting? Or perhaps a PP CG, where the Federation gives rewards for killing Empire pledged CMDRs and vice-versa. This would be a win-win for both people interested in casual PvP like myself and more diehard PvPers like you and your mates. And more importantly, it gives real in-game purpose to PvP.
It's not like I'm asking Frontier to reinvent the game, but rather to use the tools they already have to give us a reason, a location, and "rules" to engage in combat with other players. Surely even the pro-PvPers would welcome this, no?
ps - gotta go to work, so o7 for now (I'm glad this thread has remained civil).
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I think escorting should be encouraged, but it's a difficult and thankless job that's unlikely to succeed against decent PvPers on a mission.
Yes, proper pvp tools and events in game is something we sorely need, but I don't see any way to replace what discord does, not just for Elite, but EVERY multiplayer game. That would require an entire application that worked similarly to be designed and then integrated into the game, which would be unrealistic and...awkward?