I love E:D But really?
- Thread starter GraXXoR
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from a verisimilitude POV i dont think that is such an issue.
the cobra mk3 is........ i am not even gonna guess as i cant remember but it is over 100 years old. sure it is has some face lifts over the years but even so in real life if you were to compare a performance car from the 1980s to one produced today, in the majority of metrics the old car would be objectively worse in most areas.
one area i have some experience in.... take a nissan 370z and compare it to a 1980s W10 toyota mr2
(I deliberately cheated and didnt compare a W20 MR2 to a W30 one as i would say arguably the W20 is the better car
)They could be blamed for exploiting it though.Frontier isn't to blame for people's inability to manage anxiety.
Yeah, after I typed that I figured the v word wasn't perhaps the best fit, so I added balance as that's more relevant really.from a verisimilitude POV i dont think that is such an issue.
the cobra mk3 is........ i am not even gonna guess as i cant remember but it is over 100 years old. sure it is has some face lifts over the years but even so in real life if you were to compare a performance car from the 1980s to one produced today, in the majority of metrics the old car would be objectively worse in most areas.
one area i have some experience in.... take a nissan 370z and compare it to a 1980s W10 toyota mr2
(I deliberately cheated and didnt compare a W20 MR2 to a W30 one as i would say arguably the W20 is the better car
In my view, new content should ideally always complement what's already in the game, not replace it or make it redundant. Unfortunately, that is something Frontier have a lot of form in, one just needs to look at the various outfitting options in the game.
Why not, all the other ships were provided at no extra cost to those who had bought the appropriate game/DLC.
The Krait Mk2 is not the best example because it's a pretty bad PvP ship, the Cobra Mk5 in the right hands is a tough opponent.
Let's not start to feel sorry for a poor business company. They need to do the work only once and then they can sell virtually unlimited copies of the exact same product.
They are not like a bakery where you need to bake a new bread every time you want to sell more.
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The problem with allowing players to choose their progression (something I consider almost mandatory in single-player experiences), or opt in to these features, is that this is a persistent multiplayer-only setting. One can choose not to instance with others, but the BGS, PP, and the gameplay aspects of the overarching plot, are shared. Some find it easy to ignore these things, but doing so rather defeats the point from my perspective.
Whether we like it or not, our CMDR's progressions are all intertwined to some small degree. If I don't take advantage of the opportunities presented, I'm playing at a handicap vs. some. I don't want this any more than I want an advantage. I want as level a playing field as possible. And in a multiplayer game, this means everyone playing by the same rules.
I don't see shared knowledge as an RP issue in a setting that, despite some vague lore to the contrary, clearly depicts near omnipresent FTL communication. Anything that one CMDR discovers could easily be disseminated to the whole galaxy in very little time.
Anyway, FDev offering ways for players to play by different, ostensibly better, rules is definitely on FDev.
That’s a great point. Technology is supposed to progress and older ships are supposed to become obsolete.
I get how that’s a problem for people who enjoy multiplayer. I would compare it to Diablo 2 (I know this is an ancient example but it’s on my mind because of PD2) - if someone came out with a new character class that was obviously better than another, that would be sort of game breaking. They are supposed to all be balanced.
I’ve pretty much given up on multiplayer in ED. Just never had a single enjoyable experience and can’t even really imagine what it would be like. So for me, the idea of newer, better ships and older obsolete ships, doesn’t bother me
To a veteran, rebuy costs on ANY ship are so incredibly insignificant in Elite. I salute him on his creative writing but umm yeah, nobody cares about rebuy costs as it is. Certainly not someone with quadbillions in the bank. How is that ruining the game experience?
If you are (even only remotely) interested in exploration events, try expeditions. These were the most fun with the multiplayer features in Elite I ever had. Actually, they were the most fun in general in Elite. I guess it is due to it being casual non-competitive co-op gameplay.
That I've been playing early and long enough to have discovered almost everything I know about the game firsthand does nothing to negate the fact that the game's setting depicts easy and omnipresent FTL communications that render the issue of player knowledge, in the current game, largely moot.
If you think I've made some prior argument to the contrary, you must be mistaken.
Edit: Yes, you are definitely mistaken.
This seems to be the post you are referring to: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threa...urpose-needs-overhauling.627916/post-10467098
I see utterly no claim, explicit or implied, in that post that would make my argument in post #313 of this thread appear disingenuous. Nor do I have the faintest idea why you'd assume these arguments were mutually exclusive.
This game gives every CMDR vessel near-instantaneous galaxy spanning FTL communications, both via the in-game chat and features like telepresence. That is an indisputable fact.
I don't like relying on third party sources and I do not need to. I have 10k hours in this game and I enjoy dissecting games as much as I enjoy playing them. This in no way implies that I have any problem with these sources of information from an RP aspect, in this setting, because this setting makes the exchange of information trivial.
Zero contradictions in my positions here.
If you're going to take offense every time I don't agree with your misremembered distortions of my positions, that's definitely for the best.
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While everyone was telling me the Mandalay was the greatest thing since toast, I waited until I could buy it for credits. My game wasn't "ruined" . My gameplay wasn't impacted. The fact that other people had a new toy faster than I did, made absolutely no impact on me at all whatsoever.
I chose to buy the Corsair for ARX because I wanted to support FDEV and I was bored with Colonization. But yeah, there's no guns being held to our heads here. There's no "pay2win" in Elite Dangerous and people need to stop with that silliniess. None of these ships are so amazing that it makes the game a joke. And honestly the vast majority of everyone is in Solo or massive private groups so....what would it matter anyway?
just for the record not all of us - even veterans - are that wealthy. That said in many ways the economy in elite was better early doors. back then it was possible to actual struggle for money - unless you chose to cheese the game. That was the golden era for the game imo where piracy actually made some semblence of sense in the game beyond roleplay and sometimes it was a necessity to fly with less than the best gear for your build as you could not afford it
now however one cant help but earn silly profits, and add to that if one wants a fleet carrier it is kind of mandatory now (though as i said.... even so not all of us are that wealthy). its a bit of a segue but its a damn shame really imo
from a verisimilitude POV i dont think that is such an issue.
the cobra mk3 is........ i am not even gonna guess as i cant remember but it is over 100 years old. sure it is has some face lifts over the years but even so in real life if you were to compare a performance car from the 1980s to one produced today, in the majority of metrics the old car would be objectively worse in most areas.
one area i have some experience in.... take a nissan 370z and compare it to a 1980s W10 toyota mr2
(I deliberately cheated and didnt compare a W20 MR2 to a W30 one as i would say arguably the W20 is the better car
Well said. That's what kills me about posts like that. I mean on one hand this is a space "simulator". Then it's like people have this unrealistic attitude where the ship lineup should be static. And new ships NOT better than the old ones. How in the world is that realistic? This is what mankind does: improves technology. We move forwards. Why would anyone bother making a Cobra V that didn't exceed the Cobra III !?!!??
I started in a Corvette.
You stated small ships were only for new players or for giggles...even if you include "giggles" your statement is still incorrect. Yea, some Cmdrs use a sidewinder and take it into a high CZ for giggles, not denying that. However, some small ships excel at certain tasks more than medium or large ships, Cmdrs don't use them for giggles, they use them because they are the best arrow in the quiver to get a job done. This is like having a conversation with my 7 year old daughter. I'm tapping out.
As for your ships that you now say are obsolete because of the Cmk5...Asp Scout has always been the runt of the litter, there's been better ships since day 1 than the scout. The same can be said for the T-6. AspX and DBX, can see where you're coming from with this. They both have better jump range than the Cmk5 but also they were trumped by other medium ships that made them "obsolete" to a certain point. Same goes for the FDS and FAS, but they still have more firepower than the Cmk5. Phantom, yea, much better for exploration and did make a good missions runner, but again this was trumped by other medium ships.
The one massive plus for a Cmk5 is it's SCO handling, fuel consumption and and SCO top speed, which whoops everything else. SCO travel though isn't the be all and end all of why you wouldn't use another ship.
Back in the day the cost of ships had a big impact on ship progression. It took flippin ages to earn credits, so things like the T-6 had their place as a stepping stone trading ship. This is no longer the case as you can earn enough credits for almost any ship in hours/days rather than weeks/months.
Not sure the Cmk5 would replace my AspX or Phantom, the Corsair and Mandalay replaced those.
There's such a range of ships in ED that people fly what they feel comfortable flying for any given task, but that doesn't take away from the fact that some are just better on paper at some tasks than others.
Same applies to cars in RL, which is why we all don't drive the exact same car.
o7
I'm personally thankful that I can spent my time in Elite enjoying it and doing what I want to do. And that I'm NOT being forced to grind for imaginary Space Bucks so I can actually unlock the things I want to do.
Also we all say the "early" days of a game were better. Even when everything tells us it objectively was not. Gamer nostalgia is a real thing.
You started the game in a Corvette?
Get off. I'm not even reading the rest of that after that one.
i am not saying you are wrong for the game you want....... however its not so cut and dry. sure there is more content now, and the old content is still there for the most part (yes there are exceptions but not going there for now)
but Elite at its core for me was always a game where you were a broke pilot trying to make your way, with dreams of one day owning something better (in the 1st game it was simply a decked out cobra but in all the other games there were far bigger ships to dream off)
and at launch the game was far better balanced then. So many parts of the game now make little sense because any semblence of the economy has been torpedoed. objectively the game was better rounded at launch imo.
also we only had 1 currency. having multiple currencies just screams free to play game to me and its not something i generally engage in to be honest. i do for elite, because its elite. i would much rather be forced to "grind" as you call it for in game money that i can spend on buying anything rather than instead having the situation we have now where i cant buy basic commodities like phosphorus or parts of destroyed ships for cash.
but yes most of the old content is still in there, but it does kind of make it feel a little pointless doing a lot of it now imo its so out of wack.
back on the topic of ships, personally i was not that bothered when it was intimated it would be a known entity of 3 months wait for the new ships, however the thin end of the wedge / slippery slope has been proven yet again... 1st it was with ARX, (which we were promised would only ever be for cosmetics) and now it is for early access which appears to be stretching out longer and longer for each ship
and before i am accused of being tight... (just in case
) maybe I am however that is not the case for me and Elite. Frontier have had more of my money for Elite than i have have given for any other game in my 40 years of gaming......... and that includes some pretty expensive games like MSFS 2020 with a bunch of content.
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I guess what bothers me about complaints like this is there is never any kind of acknowledgment that these aren't simply choices being made out of thin air, but that there is a real monetary consideration by FDEV (and others) that can't be swept aside if we want the servers being kept running. Or at least no alternative suggestions made on how FDEV should monetize the game going forward. I mean yeah I would love for everything to be free and not cost money too, it just doesn't feel realistic.
I would much rather them break their "promise" (did they literally PROMISE?) on ARX then introduce ANOTHER currency just for ships. Just...god no. I hate it when games go crazy with multiple currency types.
They're in a no-win scenario with that one. It's a double-edged sword. Because then the old-guard (they know who they are) would scream en-mass that people are short-cutting Engineering by making the obtaining of materials utterly trivial. Yeah I would love to buy them for credits too lol. I can understand why they didn't go that route though.
